X-Verse Fleet Fest I

Deadbeat_Spinn · Post by **Deadbeat_Spinn** » Mon, 19. Jul 10, 22:40

I recall now about the recount, it was N-S. It was because I had mentioned that GCU's Deimos twins were designed around Kariudo Haulers (the Yaki version of a Deimos) but the ships had Deimos shielding instead of KH shielding otherwise when I made the layout I would have switch them to the Yaki version (despite them being unbuyable).

Until I see how the reaction is to my bonus match design (since it will take place after my match with TS) by the Council, fleet submitters, and forum members will decide if I make the others that I have floating about as thoughts in my head.

Cpt.Jericho · Post by **Cpt.Jericho** » Tue, 20. Jul 10, 00:05

Deadbeat_Spinn wrote:I recall now about the recount, it was N-S. It was because I had mentioned that GCU's Deimos twins were designed around Kariudo Haulers (the Yaki version of a Deimos) but the ships had Deimos shielding instead of KH shielding otherwise when I made the layout I would have switch them to the Yaki version (despite them being unbuyable)

In the fleet post it clearly says 6 GJ shielding and it has been paid for so there is no need for recounting; those ships are even called Deimos! I also don't think that the call for recounting was serious

Technojerk36 · Post by **Technojerk36** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 08:53

Video time! *yay*

I present to you,

Olterin vs. stemardue

and

Stealth Hunter vs X2-Eliah - Part 1

The second part failed to upload so you're going to have to wait until tomorrow for that.

Gavrushka · Post by **Gavrushka** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 09:03

Thank you!

Can I just issue a gentle reminder you were going to re-upload the Video of my match as it is only available in low res!

Technojerk36 · Post by **Technojerk36** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 09:15

I was just thinking about that.

Sure, check back tomorrow and (hopefully) your video will be up

Olterin · Post by **Olterin** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 10:18

Due to the fact that my PC would probably scream at the prospect of such a fleet fight, I didn't look at the save. Well, I just watched the video of me vs stermardue and...

Here's my view on it:

Spoiler

Show

Who spawned my Phoenix the wrong way around?!

Other than that, it was a pretty light-show, with, as far as I can tell, none of my falcon haulers firing their main weapons?

I think the outcome would probably be different if all those Katanas had M/AM launchers in their main weapons - the Phoenix would've been in serious trouble then, as well as both Shrikes (the only capital loss I suffered seemed to be from friendly fire?) But seriously, the Phoenix, which is already slow, being spawned the wrong way around is something you might want to look into - this way, it didn't have it's capital weapons in the front and so the firepower it should have been able to deliver straight off the bat... well, sat tied up the wrong way around for about a minute

That's that, then, as they say. On a second play-through of the vid I noticed the Shrikes facing the wrong direction as well, btw.

And here's a hopefully less biased write-up: (wall of text)

Spoiler

Show

The beginning of this match saw the Fire Vanguard epically fail at logistics jumping in their ships facing away from the enemy fleet. The fighters were quick to rectify this mistake, the capital ships took longer. Meanwhile, the Ronins took advantage of this situation and charged in a tight formation. However, this also proved to be their downfall in the long term. Both "Avenger" and "Vindicator" came about sooner than the Ronins expected and began circling the skirmish now taking place between twenty-two desperate corvettes and twenty-eight fighters with a deathwish. The quad flak turrets of the Shrikes provided the fighters with a much needed steady covering fire from both ends of the field. Meanwhile, the Phoenix "Harbinger" came about and brought it's capital weapons to bear, with the captain apparently deciding that facing the combat field sideways, offering the enemies the broad side of a barn, was a smarter idea than flying in. He was proven to be right, as the Ronins were slowly but surely driven towards this wall, and even though they could evade most of the PPC shots, the flak and railgun turrets could still bring more than enough firepower to bear on them. At one point, the capital turrets of the "Harbinger" were actually able to draw a bead on one of the Katanas, which smartly decided to take cover behind a Shrike that was just coming about. Apparently, the gunners of that turret decided it was best to keep firing and so, one Shrike of the Vanguard fell prey to friendly fire. At this point though, the Ronins had little chance of getting out alive, despite one of the two Shrikes being down. They decided to make a final attempt at taking the big barn out of the picture and, as could easily have been predicted, failed due to inferior weapons. Had the Ronins wielded M/AM launchers instead of EMPCs, would they then have a better chance of winning? Who knows.

Triaxx2 · Post by **Triaxx2** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 12:17

Interesting, I was just wondering yesterday if we'd had any ships lost to friendly fire.

Spychotic · Post by **Spychotic** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 12:21

stemardue wrote:I'm curious to see if they will be able to get in fire range of a Capship based fleet before annihilation ^^

Just barely

Spike

Olterin · Post by **Olterin** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 13:06

Spychotic wrote:
stemardue wrote:I'm curious to see if they will be able to get in fire range of a Capship based fleet before annihilation ^^
Just barely

Spike

More due to the sheer size of the Phoenix than anything else really, though...

X2-Eliah · Post by **X2-Eliah** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 13:37

Well, so far it looks like my fleet was not up to scratch, I was hoping for a more hull-melting experience than that. Shame the AI locks up like that. Anyway, the Plecos seemed to work as distractions well enough, and the annoyance of the IRE fire is something cool too. I do love how one of them rammed the Centaur.

Can't wait for part two, where the big ships finally get it.

imperium3 · Post by **imperium3** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 14:36

X2-Eliah wrote:Well, so far it looks like my fleet was not up to scratch, I was hoping for a more hull-melting experience than that. Shame the AI locks up like that.

Actually that surprised me quite a bit, considering that in my battle against kalu (whose fleet was far larger than your entire battle) at least in the video AI lockup didn't seem to be an issue. Whereas in your battle it seems to have afflicted Stealth Hunter's entire fleet. Strange...

Plus I'm glad I'm in the opposite half of the draw to you, X2-Eliah. Your fleet is the one I fear the most.

X2-Eliah · Post by **X2-Eliah** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 15:22

Well, basing off of this video, you may have a decent chance of winning. I am seriously disappointed on the performance of Solanos (I bet a majority of them were locked up either)..

Technojerk36 · Post by **Technojerk36** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 15:29

Well, wait no more!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioYgf6ITKhQ

Olterin · Post by **Olterin** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 15:31

X2-Eliah wrote:Well, basing off of this video, you may have a decent chance of winning. I am seriously disappointed on the performance of Solanos (I bet a majority of them were locked up either)..

First, you get to slaughter my fleet... I'm not too sure of it's performance either. From what I've been able to see, those Falcon Haulers were more of a meatshield than anything else

My only hope lies with the FAA Shrikes at this point... (oh, and the size of the Phoenix

)

X2-Eliah · Post by **X2-Eliah** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 15:54

Okay, the second part was even worse

The slow tricle of Colossus's hull was horrible, If I had been there, I'd gone crazy with the inefficiency of the fighters.

Argh.

Technojerk36 · Post by **Technojerk36** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 16:03

Shouldn't have made a spam fleet

Aro · Post by **Aro** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 21:44

There's a topic in the scripting forum discussing the lockup. It may not just be the ships, adding turrets to the mix could also cause it.

Less than 100 ships per side should limit how often the lockup occurs, maybe. Even then 200 ships + whatever turrets.
Let's hope the final battle in XFF I does not kill his computer when two spam fleets meet up...

BeidAmmikon · Post by **BeidAmmikon** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 22:01

I must say that a real-life confrontation involving a host of small, fast ships is very plausible. However, when one side knows its opponent, then they will use minimum force required to achieve victory. When one side does not know its opponent, it is reasonable for them to throw in the battle everything they've got (the "spam" fleet being the simplest example). Also, in a real life battlefield, variation is a key to success. Using a single ship model opens the door to the enemy, who can use one ship's weaknesses to defeat all similar ships.
Alas, given the nature of our ships' control method (identical scripts, with their functionality more or less hampered and stunted by our rigs) it is also reasonable to think that any given "spam" fleet of small fighters will reach the top of the competition.
Exactly because of this ^ I have the nerve to suggest a limit to the ships that a player can use - otherwise the "spam" fleet either won't work, or will prevail each and every time by simple numeric superiority so we could take this as a given and hand out the medals now. I don't know what number to advance, though. I would use a (very) combined fleet anyway.

And here endeth my 101 in space combat tactics

imperium3 · Post by **imperium3** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 23:39

BeidAmmikon wrote:I would use a (very) combined fleet anyway.

Go for it, for XFF2, then! To be fair I started out with a balanced fleet, however by a process of "I don't need that", and "that's too expensive" ended up with my current fleet which IMO is a fighter-spam on the respectable side of quant vs qual.

I think we should impose a fleet limit but I don't think it need be that low - 100 maybe? But we should wait and see who actually prevails in the end - after all the spam fleets may turn out to be less effective than they appear. Certainly poor X2-Eliah seems unhappy with how much damage he's doing to TJ's PC instead of the enemy!

There are a couple of obviously unbalanced ships that need some kind of nerfing or banning done to them, mainly the ridiculous Solano, and less urgently perhaps the Springblossom too. Not many people seem to have taken Springy's though which is good, perhaps because winning XFF would feel much better without a so-called "cheatship" or because M6s didn't get much consideration.

NUKLEAR-SLUG · Post by **NUKLEAR-SLUG** » Thu, 22. Jul 10, 23:43

BeidAmmikon wrote:Exactly because of this ^ I have the nerve to suggest a limit to the ships that a player can use - otherwise the "spam" fleet either won't work, or will prevail each and every time by simple numeric superiority so we could take this as a given and hand out the medals now. I don't know what number to advance, though. I would use a (very) combined fleet anyway.
And here endeth my 101 in space combat tactics

You can limit using an arbitrary numeric value instead of monetary. M2=20points down to M5=1 point then give a points pool to select from, say 100 points.

Spam 100 m5's if you want to but you could be going up against 5 destroyers equivalent.

egosoft.com

egosoft.com

X-Verse Fleet Fest I