Split from X-Rebirth Steam poll thread - Round 2

[apricotslice]

If you're a general Steam user, no work arounds are required.

And if your not, the sheer number of workarounds just demonstrate how many (potential) issues there are to fall over. That alone is enough to put someone off.

Seriously, if people want to promote steam, filling a thread with workarounds is not the way to do it.

The only thing that really works is a product that has no issues and has no workarounds because there is nothing that needs working around. Thats not Steam, at least not now.

[strude]

The work arounds are usually aimed at helping the no Steam crowd who have issues with some of the ways Steam works.
...
If you're a general Steam user, no work arounds are required.

And if your not, the sheer number of workarounds just demonstrate how many (potential) issues there are to fall over. That alone is enough to put someone off.

Seriously, if people want to promote steam, filling a thread with workarounds is not the way to do it.

The only thing that really works is a product that has no issues and has no workarounds because there is nothing that needs working around. Thats not Steam, at least not now.

When I said issues, I meant that the people have the issues with the features, not that the Steam features have issues in themselves. Perhaps I should have said "who take issue" instead of "who have issues". I'll edit my post to reflect that.

[apricotslice]

When I said issues, I meant that the people have the issues with the features, not that the Steam features have issues in themselves.

6 of one, half dozen of the other.

Steam has issues. Thats all that interests a lot of people.

[X2-Eliah]

Issues are defined individually. Issue for you is not an issue for me. If you tell me that I'll have your issues with steam - that is false; that's the point

[apricotslice]

Issues are defined individually. Issue for you is not an issue for me. If you tell me that I'll have your issues with steam - that is false; that's the point

An issue is an issue. The more of them there are, then the more likely they will affect me.

As it happens, several important ones do affect me, and I dont have the ability to do the workarounds. Nor for that matter the sheer bloodymindedness to do them.

So issues matter, potential or otherwise.

[the old one]

Strude, i am afraid you have shot yourselve in the foot with that post,because what you are saying is if you have a steam account you do not need work arounds but if you are thinking of going the steam route you do,the old one

[strude]

Strude, i am afraid you have shot yourselve in the foot with that post,because what you are saying is if you have a steam account you do not need work arounds but if you are thinking of going the steam route you do,the old one

Yes I have a little, but it's only down to bad wording by me, so the point I was making has been lost. I guess my edit hasn't really helped clean it up. In hindsight, I think the use of the word "issues" was a mistake, as it has been taken out of context. It was suppose to convey "don't like".

Hopefully I can clear up what I meant:-

I'm not talking about issues with the operation of the Steam software. For me and most usual Steam users, there are no software issues with the operation of Steam, and therefore nothing to work around.

New users who intend to use Steam in the usual way will likely have no issues either, so still nothing to work around.

Those who don't want to use Steam because they "don't like" the way Steam works in one or more ways can sometimes use work arounds to avoid or minimise interacting with the function that they don't like.

[apricotslice]

Those who don't want to use Steam because they "don't like" the way Steam works in one or more ways can sometimes use work arounds to avoid or minimise interacting with the function that they don't like.

Its the big list of those functions that bothers some of us.

In my case, I have technical issues with it, modding issues with it, philosphical issues with it, and it has nothing at all I want (which is also an issue).

The list of selling points is actually the list of things putting me off.

The borg assimilation talk is also a huge turn off. The more people tell me its the future, the further back into the past I start looking. I'm actually trying to figure out how to get a 3.5inch floppy to talk to my laptop via usb now. How bizzarre is that ?

[strude]

I'm actually trying to figure out how to get a 3.5inch floppy to talk to my laptop via usb now. How bizzarre is that ?

I was contemplating that not long ago. Have some old partition recovery software on floppy disk which I was in need of. Sadly, we have 3 PCs in the house and no working floppy drives. Still haven't got around to it, but I should. Not that I accidentally delete my partitions very often these days

[fairywhipper]

the last time i checked you can still buy a usb floppy drive.


reading the posts recently still leaves me ???

external poll - third party software issues, undemocratic etc,
dudes - you are still getting a choice.
if you force steam, then there is no choice.
i do wonder about steam users in general, once you are assimlated, you see no problems! but is that because you have the neccessary resources such as stable high speed internet with no cap. as for downloading many games vs shopping... cost of me downloading =£0.1 * 1mb, so equate that to cost of games.
another thing is once you start buying more than 1 game a week, you realise how crap they are, few games expect more than 25hr game play. xtc costs me 42days realtime to play the main chapter of the game once. maybe im a slow player who doesnt know what im doing, in which case i shouldnt be on steam in case i corrupt you all.

[Scoob]

Hi,

Hesitant to post on here any more however...

You know I've been testing out Steam for a while now right? Well, so far at least, it's been trouble-free for the most part. The initial blip I very first encountered was fixed in a client update.

Lately I've not even bothered starting Steam (for a few days) as I didn't want to play either of the demos I downloaded. So, with Steam not running and me not needing to use it there have been no issues lol.

I fire it up periodically, either directly launching the client or just double-clicking the game icon and having it do it for me. I then select to remain in offline mode & play.

Talk of "work arounds" isn't quite right in my view, it's more "configuring Steam to work how you want". Once you understand it, it's pretty simple.

I was a bit confused about Offline mode, No Updates, etc. etc. initially, but now I've got my head around it, well, it's pretty simple and things work. Really, if Steam had worked like this when I first tried it all that time ago I'd likely not have been concerned in regards to XR.

I know lots of people simply don't want it and are not prepared to try it out for various reasons. Fair enough. But there still appears to be a lot of missinformation popping up that people have taken as truth.

You know, I expected my original posts (before it all got merged) to be a tale of never-ending frustration trying to get Steam working...it turned into the opposite.

Steam hasn't yet demanded to be online or anything, it not once stopped me running any of my game demos, nor has anything insisted on an update. That last thing is sort of a shame as I cannot test out how updates are delivered - well, other that the Steam client update that was applied recently.

So, in summary, so far steam has been doing what it's told. It's staying in offline mode, letting me play my game demos and doesn't run at all if I ask it not to. Other than the memory footprint, which is always over 120mb *, it's not intrusive at all.

* I have 8gb system ram, I suspect the Steam Client uses more ram than others report for this reason.

You know, I might get Skyrim through Steam...actually, I think it's the only way you can get it and I wants it! lol.

Btw: I have several fairly decent machines, the "worst" in every day use is this PC which is a Q6600 @ 2.4 with a 8800GT and 8gb ram running Windows 7 Ultimate 64. Steam certainly has no impact on anything I've tried to do while it's been running. Nor does it appear to be a busy little app doing "stuff" in the background when it should be idle.

Scoob.

[Antaran]

Probably better to have this included..

To all the Steam haters,

....


It could be worse. But IMO, steam has more pros than cons. Been using it since its first month in release (And hated it for about two years)

To all the Steam lovers,

Steam is a bitter taste.

Nearly everyone that loves Steam doesn´t really know what it is about. The vast majority of the PC gaming community has moved to it because the have no choice and wan´t to play games. By using it you pretty much forced to accept everything steam shoves down your throat or loose access to your leased games.

Yes, steam is DRM. But, it's DRM that has pros with its cons.

You like math? I like math.
Cons:
You're required to activate your game, once, online with Steam. Steam also provides great discounts, sales, and bundles without you ever getting a box or anything of the sort.
Steam forces you to download the games you wan´t to install since there is no box to install from.
Instead of wasting money on leasing the game on steam you could go to the store and purchase a real copy of the game.
Hell you can´t even play the game once you get it prerelease, you have to wait for it to unlock instead of getting it in a box and installing and playing it right away.
Steam forces you to patch your games and you can´t even play the game while the pather is downloading.
Steam can ban your account without giving you a reason.

Pros:
Ehm...

Actually, the only argument I've commonly seen is "Bawww Youy can do this, this, this, this, this, this or that, that, that,that to work around that thing you don´t like, which isn´t really a solution it just makes you thinnk that you have solved the problem, but we steam lovers think it should be enough for you, but you still have to use steam if you wan´t to play the game, it alsoe has atchivmentas zomg BAWWWW".

But most games require online activation with their CD keys, anyway... And that makes steam better how?

IMO, steam has more cons than pros. I gave it a chance once and it screwed up my experince big time.

Ohh, And I don't work for McDonalds.

[Antaran]

Hi,

Hesitant to post on here any more however...

.....

You know, I might get Skyrim through Steam...actually, I think it's the only way you can get it and I wants it! lol.

Scoob.

If it works for you and you accept it then go for it, there is no reason not to.

[X2-Eliah]

Nearly everyone that loves Steam doesn´t really know what it is about.

Don't tell me what I know and what I don't know. You dislike it, fine, but accept that I don't obey your view of life, universe and everything. And opening up with "to all steam lovers"... Harsh. So should I refer to you as a 'steam hater' then?

love, me (and not a slave to your individual opinions).

[Shimrod]

opening up with "to all steam lovers"... Harsh

I suspect this is in response to a previous post, which began 'To all the Steam haters':
http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php? ... 95#3720095

Personally I don't hate Steam, I simply don't believe it should be required for playing offline singleplayer games bought on DVD.

[fairywhipper]

Hi,

Hesitant to post on here any more however...

You know I've been testing out Steam for a while now right? Well, so far at least, it's been trouble-free for the most part. The initial blip I very first encountered was fixed in a client update.

Lately I've not even bothered starting Steam (for a few days) as I didn't want to play either of the demos I downloaded. So, with Steam not running and me not needing to use it there have been no issues lol.

I fire it up periodically, either directly launching the client or just double-clicking the game icon and having it do it for me. I then select to remain in offline mode & play.

Talk of "work arounds" isn't quite right in my view, it's more "configuring Steam to work how you want". Once you understand it, it's pretty simple.

I was a bit confused about Offline mode, No Updates, etc. etc. initially, but now I've got my head around it, well, it's pretty simple and things work. Really, if Steam had worked like this when I first tried it all that time ago I'd likely not have been concerned in regards to XR.

Not been critical (too much ), but a few days of playing offline might work, but weeks, months? we dont know, offline mode is not 100% as we have worked out. extended periods of time might have different affects that we are not aware of.
as for initial blip with client update, why does it need an update? IF before you got the update, you changed to dial up again, how would that of effected you? now do you begin to see the problems that some of us might face.

like i said, i am not trying to be critical to you personally and understand why you are hesitant to post again, but you are part of the few who is willing to look at it not just at face value but try it and see what happens.

we are not trying to change steam for those happy with it, we are trying to get a choice not just for us, but for everybody, once if all games is on steam then there is nothing left but to accept it or walk away, but for now we still have a chance to a choice.

ps: skyrim... I want it as well.... but steam is putting me off PC, even if it works or dont work.......

[Antaran]

opening up with "to all steam lovers"... Harsh

I suspect this is in response to a previous post, which began 'To all the Steam haters':
http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php? ... 95#3720095

Your suspicions are correct, I have edited my post to atleast hint at it.

[Antaran]

Nearly everyone that loves Steam doesn´t really know what it is about.

Don't tell me what I know and what I don't know. You dislike it, fine, but accept that I don't obey your view of life, universe and everything. And opening up with "to all steam lovers"... Harsh. So should I refer to you as a 'steam hater' then?

love, me (and not a slave to your individual opinions).

Funny, this is exactly how I feel when someone on the pro steam side tells me that I am wrong and should accept and love steam because it has no problems, no issues and no flaws (according to them atleast)....

P.s. this was a silly post in response to another silly post (The To all steam lovers/haters ones being the silly ones).

[AkrionXxarr]

You're required to activate your game, once, online with Steam.

Steam does not require you to activate every game you download unless you're talking about the 'first time setup' which I don't really consider an 'activation'. Any games you do have to activate you're more than likely going to have to do so with the boxed version as well.

Steam also provides great discounts, sales, and bundles without you ever getting a box or anything of the sort.

Why exactly is Steam providing great discounts a con? And why does not getting a boxed version even matter considering you'd rarely get such discounts from a game store? On one hand you get a box at full price, on the other hand you get no box at 75% off.

Steam forces you to download the games you wan´t to install since there is no box to install from.

Steam is a digitial distribution system; of course you have to download the games you buy. This point is a non-issue.

Instead of wasting money on leasing the game on steam you could go to the store and purchase a real copy of the game.

Sure, with Steam you don't have a boxed copy but I wouldn't consider that 'wasting money' .. Especially considering they hold so many sales. Buy a bundle of games normally worth $600 for 90% off which is roughly the price of a newly released 'triple-A' game. 'Wasting money', especially in this regard, is entirely subjective.

Hell you can´t even play the game once you get it prerelease, you have to wait for it to unlock instead of getting it in a box and installing and playing it right away.

You can't play a boxed game before its release date either. So, again, why is this even considered an issue with Steam? Sometimes a game released on Steam will allow you to download and install (but not play) before it's unlocked, meaning that unless you happen to get a midnight release of the boxed version you're very unlikely, even without a pre-download, to play the boxed version before the steam version.

The last two points I can't really comment on because I don't know enough on those specific subjects. Either way, a rather confusing 'list' of cons you have here.

Also..

You like math? I like math.

Were you going to show some math? I don't see why you'd say this unless you were, and I don't even see a single number in your entire post. Though, if one were to compare Steam bought games with store bought games strictly with math Steam would be the significantly better option.

[Burneyx]

ps: skyrim... I want it as well.... but steam is putting me off PC, even if it works or dont work.......

Same here, i will buy Skyrim for XBox 360, but this is not "wanted", its the result of pcgamers more and more forced to go Steam.

This choice isn't given for X-Rebirth, and i want to say, the day Bernd posted that Deep Silver will go Steam, was the day i bought my XBox 360......
(So this made my final decission)

I can't realy see the win factor for the pc gaming industry if more and more players change their gaming plattform from Pc to Console.

greetings

burneyx