Poor Poor Poor Memory Hogging Poor UI in Docks

[PaperDog]

Its like walking in slow motion to get around. The FPS is 9 at best and it feels like a bad dream, where I'm trying to run away... from the Teladi chick , (whom I know is trying to hit on me...) and I cant run fast... . RIght now...Imma say it... You guys need to download a copy of HITMAN and get with their engineers about the map levels and how they manage the memory on that. (My way of saying its NOT my computer that has the problem) They have a superior USER game environment . This stuff here... shaking my head...in very slow , choppy motion...

[Max Bain]

Try setting Antialiasing to FXAA low or medium mode. All other modes give me 50% less FPS.
But other than this, I think your CPU is not very good (thats also why you need so long for save/load operations - I need about one minute for load/save). I at least have constant above 60 fps outside of bigger battles. Rarely even under 20 but thats when 100 vs 100.
I got an Ryzen 3600.

[Alan Phipps]

If the OP's system hasn't changed from this (the only DxDiag of theirs that I can find) then X4 with Win 8 on a 2 core cpu/apu is unlikely to do well.

If their system has changed then we need a new DxDiag.

[Max Bain]

If the OP's system hasn't changed from this (the only DxDiag of theirs that I can find) then X4 with Win 8 on a 2 core cpu/apu is unlikely to do well.

If their system has changed then we need a new DxDiag.

If thats still your system, I would stop trying to play X4. It wont make fun. Really not.

[EGO_Aut]

It is your computer crap

[Slashman]

If the OP's system hasn't changed from this (the only DxDiag of theirs that I can find) then X4 with Win 8 on a 2 core cpu/apu is unlikely to do well.

If their system has changed then we need a new DxDiag.

Why do people with those specs even buy X4?

[Alan Phipps]

Please stay on game topic. All that I have said so far is that *we don't know* the OP's system specs for sure. That previous DxDiag linked was 3 years ago and in an X3 thread.

[PaperDog]

Please stay on game topic. All that I have said so far is that *we don't know* the OP's system specs for sure. That previous DxDiag linked was 3 years ago and in an X3 thread.

Ha ha... I'm laughing Becuse its true... I dont even have that computer anymore. But No doubt , my current one is not much better ... I am looking to upgrade.

[PaperDog]

Try setting Antialiasing to FXAA low or medium mode. All other modes give me 50% less FPS.
But other than this, I think your CPU is not very good (thats also why you need so long for save/load operations - I need about one minute for load/save). I at least have constant above 60 fps outside of bigger battles. Rarely even under 20 but thats when 100 vs 100.
I got an Ryzen 3600.

Actually I turned antialiasing completely off... Also, I'm told that my PC has an integrated GPU... (ANother way of saying my Graphics card is bound to nafarious elements that impede its freedom to operate like the newer independant graphics systems. In short, I have an old pc and I intend to upgrade. HOWEVER.. the save time, is not related to graphics issues. I contend that its how they transfer the data to their cloud... (I still think they couls stand to do it binary if they arent already)

[jlehtone]

I'm told that my PC has an integrated GPU... (ANother way of saying my Graphics card is bound to nafarious elements that impede its freedom to operate like the newer independant graphics systems.

No. Integrated GPU is in the same chip as the CPU. That does not "impede freedom to operate", but it does limit the size of the GPU. Discrete GPUs are bigger. Stronger.

The minimum recommendation for X4 is "Nvidia GTX 780/970 or AMD equivalent (Vulkan support required)".
One can find GTX 780 from a list like: https://www.logicalincrements.com/artic ... comparison
Almost all integrated are "down below".

HOWEVER.. the save time, is not related to graphics issues. I contend that its how they transfer the data to their cloud... (I still think they couls stand to do it binary if they arent already)

Have you used your network usage while the game loads and saves?
Can you show that the transfer hits your bandwidth limit?

I don't use cloud, yet the load and save are not instant.

[Alan Phipps]

Also as another poster said in another of your threads, an integrated apu will reserve (slower) system RAM as shared graphics memory and thus potentially leave your system short on both VRAM and system RAM requirements.

A system upgrade is certainly one answer and I hope it resolves many of your issues with X4.

[dtpsprt]

Ha ha... I'm laughing Becuse its true... I dont even have that computer anymore. But No doubt , my current one is not much better ... I am looking to upgrade.

Not only that, (sorry to butt in btw) but it most probably have a mechanical HD, which has a lifespan of (about) 5 years before it physically degrades due to friction. That's another cause of glacial saving, not that X4 and X Rebirth before it could claim any fast saving prize tbh.

[Imperial Good]

HOWEVER.. the save time, is not related to graphics issues. I contend that its how they transfer the data to their cloud... (I still think they couls stand to do it binary if they arent already)

X4 does not send saves to the cloud while saving. Steam does that when X4 is closed. Any other real-time transmission of the save files would be other third party software like Microsoft One Drive.

The minimum recommendation for X4 is "Nvidia GTX 780/970 or AMD equivalent (Vulkan support required)".

Technically the minimum recommended GPU is any GPU that has at least 3 GB of video memory and supports Vulkan. Those cards were choosen as they had no variants with less memory. I use a 4 GB GTX 760 and X4 runs fine.

Also as another poster said in another of your threads, an integrated apu will reserve (slower) system RAM as shared graphics memory and thus potentially leave your system short on both VRAM and system RAM requirements.

The main issue is the "slower" part. X4 is already highly sensitive to main memory performance. Throwing in a memory bandwidth heavy GPU sharing that resource will almost certainly cause X4 to perform badly, even if the CPU cores are theoretically fast enough for decent performance.

Not only that, (sorry to butt in btw) but it most probably have a mechanical HD, which has a lifespan of (about) 5 years before it physically degrades due to friction. That's another cause of glacial saving, not that X4 and X Rebirth before it could claim any fast saving prize tbh.

I have mechanical drives that have been used for roughly 10 years now. Still perform similarly to how they did when I got them. No noticeable slowdown at all.

I am unsure if HDDs would even affect X4 save time. Unless writethrough is explicitly enabled the file cache will absorb the write calls removing random access latency. Since the save file is a compressed stream and so written sequentially most mechanical hard disks should be able to eventually write it out in ~2 seconds maximum.

[jlehtone]

I have HDDs dating back to 2002 still in 24/7 use.

I have a "4 GB" GTX 970 and X4 warns about potential VRAM shortage due to WQHD resolution. Doesn't seem to run out though.

X4 does not send saves to the cloud while saving. Steam does that when X4 is closed.

Since the save file is a compressed stream

Therefore, Steam sends compressed data over network.
As compact as possible, definitely "binary", and has no effect on load and save times.
Could affect how quickly game starts/quits or is it more on how quickly Steam starts/quits?

[Imperial Good]

I have a "4 GB" GTX 970 and X4 warns about potential VRAM shortage due to WQHD resolution. Doesn't seem to run out though.

I play at 1080p without issues or warnings. Conventional wisdom is that the higher the resolution, the more video memory will be needed. Something like 8k may require 10-20 GB of video memory.

Could affect how quickly game starts/quits or is it more on how quickly Steam starts/quits?

If the saves are not synchronized then steam will delay X4 from starting until they are. Steam will notify this is happening and the X4 process will not even start until steam if finished. After that the X4 application will take the normal amount of time to load to main menu.

Likewise after exiting X4 and steam is synchronizing the save files then steam will warn the user if they try to exit steam before synchronization is complete. The user could then potentially delay the exit of steam until the synchronization is complete.

If the save data is synchronized then steam will both launch X4 immediately and allow the user to exit steam immediately after X4 is closed.

I am unsure about the behaviour of other distribution platforms as I only have the steam edition.

[BigBANGtheory]

interested to see what Ryzen 5000 does in a few weeks, I'm CPU bottleneck to hell and back atm see no difference from 1080p to 4k Ultra

[PaperDog]

As a follow-up, i decided to splurge and purchase a Dell G7 17 /w 1TB SSD (M2) , 32GB ram, core i7, with Nvidia GeForce RTX . Needless to say , X4 runs like a Cadillac on this. Very pleased with it. In fact its so hot, it literally cooks the chassis.. (temp @90 degrees) …The graphics and frame rates are 'fookin' amazing...but even so, because of this heat, I had to tone back the settings … Still looks & performs superior .

[Falcrack]

As a follow-up, i decided to splurge and purchase a Dell G7 17 /w 1TB SSD (M2) , 32GB ram, core i7, with Nvidia GeForce RTX . Needless to say , X4 runs like a Cadillac on this. Very pleased with it. In fact its so hot, it literally cooks the chassis.. (temp @90 degrees) …The graphics and frame rates are 'fookin' amazing...but even so, because of this heat, I had to tone back the settings … Still looks & performs superior .

Nice! It always helps when you play games on systems that meet or exceed the minimum system requirements...

[alt3rn1ty]

As a follow-up, i decided to splurge and purchase a Dell G7 17 /w 1TB SSD (M2) , 32GB ram, core i7, with Nvidia GeForce RTX . Needless to say , X4 runs like a Cadillac on this. Very pleased with it. In fact its so hot, it literally cooks the chassis.. (temp @90 degrees) …The graphics and frame rates are 'fookin' amazing...but even so, because of this heat, I had to tone back the settings … Still looks & performs superior .

I have a very similar laptop (see signature below), the reason you will get so much heat is due to the physically restricted nature of your machine not being able to get rid of it as efficiently as a desktop box .. As you have determined already, If you want your machine to last a long time and not steadily crack the small solder grid on the back of your chips (due to many instances of rapid increase / decrease of the internal temperature), then cutting it down a bit further than just getting the temperature readings to what you think should be a tolerable range is advisable.

Here's my config.xml (found in Documents\Egosoft\X4\ - Edit it with Notepad or similar and copy / paste over its content) for a similar spec laptop, which I find runs X4 smoothly. You can run the game with higher settings but if you want peace of mind that you are not steadily ruining the lifespan of the laptop ..

Code: Select all

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<root>
  <!-- graphic options -->
  <fullscreen>true</fullscreen>
  <borderless>false</borderless>
  <antialiasing>none</antialiasing>
  <presentmode>mailbox</presentmode>
  <colorcorrection>0</colorcorrection>
  <gamma>1.00</gamma>
  <capturehq>false</capturehq>
  <gfxquality>0</gfxquality>
  <!-- high gfx preset -->
  <shaderquality>2</shaderquality>
  <shadows>0</shadows>
  <softshadows>true</softshadows>
  <ssao>0</ssao>
  <glow>0</glow>
  <lodfactor>0.50</lodfactor>
  <effectdistance>0.45</effectdistance>
  <distortion>true</distortion>
  <disableradar>false</disableradar>
  <radarquality>1</radarquality>
  <ssr>false</ssr>
  <ssrquality>low</ssrquality>
  <texturequality>low</texturequality>
  <chromaticaberration>false</chromaticaberration>
  <!-- sound options -->
  <nosound>false</nosound>
  <volumetotal>1.00</volumetotal>
  <volumemusic>0.80</volumemusic>
  <volumevoice>1.00</volumevoice>
  <volumeambient>1.00</volumeambient>
  <volumeui>1.00</volumeui>
  <volumeeffects>1.00</volumeeffects>
  <!-- game options -->
  <subtitles>true</subtitles>
  <autosave>true</autosave>
  <autoroll>false</autoroll>
  <toggleboost2>false</toggleboost2>
  <togglemouselook>false</togglemouselook>
  <rumbleintensity>0.00</rumbleintensity>
  <aimassist>1</aimassist>
  <collisionassist>true</collisionassist>
  <controlmodemessages>true</controlmodemessages>
  <radarmode>false</radarmode>
  <stopshipinmenu>false</stopshipinmenu>
  <forceshootatcursor>false</forceshootatcursor>
  <fpusecameraforward>false</fpusecameraforward>
  <separateRadar>true</separateRadar>
  <speaktargetname>true</speaktargetname>
  <autosaveintervalfactor>1.00</autosaveintervalfactor>
  <!-- input options -->
  <confinemouse>false</confinemouse>
  <gamepadmode>2</gamepadmode>
  <tobiimode>combined</tobiimode>
  <tobiianglefactor>1.00</tobiianglefactor>
  <tobiigazeanglefactor>0.40</tobiigazeanglefactor>
  <tobiipositionfactor>1.00</tobiipositionfactor>
  <tobiideadzoneangle>0.00</tobiideadzoneangle>
  <tobiideadzoneposition>0.00</tobiideadzoneposition>
  <tobiigazedeadzone>0.10</tobiigazedeadzone>
  <tobiifilterstrength>5</tobiifilterstrength>
  <tobiigazefilterstrength>30</tobiigazefilterstrength>
  <!-- online options -->
  <showvisitornames>false</showvisitornames>
  <ventures>true</ventures>
  <highlightvisitors>false</highlightvisitors>
  <!-- privacy options -->
  <sendcrashreports>true</sendcrashreports>
  <!-- modified settings -->
  <chardensity>0.40</chardensity>
  <cockpitcamerascale>0.85</cockpitcamerascale>
  <trafficdensity>0.20</trafficdensity>
  <res_width>1366</res_width>
  <res_height>768</res_height>
  <uiscale>1.1</uiscale>
  <volumetric>0</volumetric>
</root>

The screen res width / height towards the end of those settings you might want to change to something more suitable for your eyes, but the bigger the screen res also amplifies your CPU/GPU usage, and more heat etc (though with most things like Anti-Aliasing turned off thats not so much of a concern).
I also toned down <trafficdensity>0.20</trafficdensity>, by default thats at 0.50, it controls how many civilian drones are around stations, I would rather have more CPU power dedicated to any nearby battles/weapons being fired, and have smoother dogfights than have many fluff civilians being calculated.

This game and its specifications are really for desktop computers, not bandwidth limited or mobile versions of GPUs, so we have to cut back quite drastically even on newer gaming laptops.

[PaperDog]

As a follow-up, i decided to splurge and purchase a Dell G7 17 /w 1TB SSD (M2) , 32GB ram, core i7, with Nvidia GeForce RTX . Needless to say , X4 runs like a Cadillac on this. Very pleased with it. In fact its so hot, it literally cooks the chassis.. (temp @90 degrees) …The graphics and frame rates are 'fookin' amazing...but even so, because of this heat, I had to tone back the settings … Still looks & performs superior .

I have a very similar laptop (see signature below), the reason you will get so much heat is due to the physically restricted nature of your machine not being able to get rid of it as efficiently as a desktop box .. As you have determined already, If you want your machine to last a long time and not steadily crack the small solder grid on the back of your chips (due to many instances of rapid increase / decrease of the internal temperature), then cutting it down a bit further than just getting the temperature readings to what you think should be a tolerable range is advisable.

Here's my config.xml (found in Documents\Egosoft\X4\ - Edit it with Notepad or similar and copy / paste over its content) for a similar spec laptop, which I find runs X4 smoothly. You can run the game with higher settings but if you want peace of mind that you are not steadily ruining the lifespan of the laptop ..

Code: Select all

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<root>
  <!-- graphic options -->
  <fullscreen>true</fullscreen>
  <borderless>false</borderless>
  <antialiasing>none</antialiasing>
  <presentmode>mailbox</presentmode>
  <colorcorrection>0</colorcorrection>
  <gamma>1.00</gamma>
  <capturehq>false</capturehq>
  <gfxquality>0</gfxquality>
  <!-- high gfx preset -->
  <shaderquality>2</shaderquality>
  <shadows>0</shadows>
  <softshadows>true</softshadows>
  <ssao>0</ssao>
  <glow>0</glow>
  <lodfactor>0.50</lodfactor>
  <effectdistance>0.45</effectdistance>
  <distortion>true</distortion>
  <disableradar>false</disableradar>
  <radarquality>1</radarquality>
  <ssr>false</ssr>
  <ssrquality>low</ssrquality>
  <texturequality>low</texturequality>
  <chromaticaberration>false</chromaticaberration>
  <!-- sound options -->
  <nosound>false</nosound>
  <volumetotal>1.00</volumetotal>
  <volumemusic>0.80</volumemusic>
  <volumevoice>1.00</volumevoice>
  <volumeambient>1.00</volumeambient>
  <volumeui>1.00</volumeui>
  <volumeeffects>1.00</volumeeffects>
  <!-- game options -->
  <subtitles>true</subtitles>
  <autosave>true</autosave>
  <autoroll>false</autoroll>
  <toggleboost2>false</toggleboost2>
  <togglemouselook>false</togglemouselook>
  <rumbleintensity>0.00</rumbleintensity>
  <aimassist>1</aimassist>
  <collisionassist>true</collisionassist>
  <controlmodemessages>true</controlmodemessages>
  <radarmode>false</radarmode>
  <stopshipinmenu>false</stopshipinmenu>
  <forceshootatcursor>false</forceshootatcursor>
  <fpusecameraforward>false</fpusecameraforward>
  <separateRadar>true</separateRadar>
  <speaktargetname>true</speaktargetname>
  <autosaveintervalfactor>1.00</autosaveintervalfactor>
  <!-- input options -->
  <confinemouse>false</confinemouse>
  <gamepadmode>2</gamepadmode>
  <tobiimode>combined</tobiimode>
  <tobiianglefactor>1.00</tobiianglefactor>
  <tobiigazeanglefactor>0.40</tobiigazeanglefactor>
  <tobiipositionfactor>1.00</tobiipositionfactor>
  <tobiideadzoneangle>0.00</tobiideadzoneangle>
  <tobiideadzoneposition>0.00</tobiideadzoneposition>
  <tobiigazedeadzone>0.10</tobiigazedeadzone>
  <tobiifilterstrength>5</tobiifilterstrength>
  <tobiigazefilterstrength>30</tobiigazefilterstrength>
  <!-- online options -->
  <showvisitornames>false</showvisitornames>
  <ventures>true</ventures>
  <highlightvisitors>false</highlightvisitors>
  <!-- privacy options -->
  <sendcrashreports>true</sendcrashreports>
  <!-- modified settings -->
  <chardensity>0.40</chardensity>
  <cockpitcamerascale>0.85</cockpitcamerascale>
  <trafficdensity>0.20</trafficdensity>
  <res_width>1366</res_width>
  <res_height>768</res_height>
  <uiscale>1.1</uiscale>
  <volumetric>0</volumetric>
</root>

The screen res width / height towards the end of those settings you might want to change to something more suitable for your eyes, but the bigger the screen res also amplifies your CPU/GPU usage, and more heat etc (though with most things like Anti-Aliasing turned off thats not so much of a concern).
I also toned down <trafficdensity>0.20</trafficdensity>, by default thats at 0.50, it controls how many civilian drones are around stations, I would rather have more CPU power dedicated to any nearby battles/weapons being fired, and have smoother dogfights than have many fluff civilians being calculated.

This game and its specifications are really for desktop computers, not bandwidth limited or mobile versions of GPUs, so we have to cut back quite drastically even on newer gaming laptops.

Much thanks for that. I did make some simple adjustments in the graphics setting and I think I got it down to a comfortable warm level.