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xeon_1
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Post by xeon_1 »

X2-Eliah wrote:
Choublanc wrote: The Steam case is maybe not so obvious but still, if the company x (Egosoft) obliges me to be client of the company y (Steam), that’s tie sales.
SecuROM. UbiDRM. GfWL. TAGES. Impulse. DirectDrive. Origin. PS3 account. Xbox Live account.

see a pattern? Oh, no, wait, it's only steam that eeeebilll!!!!, right? :roll:
Securom works offline some titles only require a one time connection
GFWL acctualy has an ofline mode that works wheras steam offline mode still doesn't work after 10 years.
Tages offline
PS3 account only for online play i don't have one since i only play singleplayer games and don't use the store.

Xbox ,impulse,origin don't have any experience with that.

Ubidrm works only it isn't user oriented.
Yep i see a pattern.
stuff that works as intended vs stuff that doesn't work namely steam.

Looking at the latest changelog offline still doesn't work

Code: Select all

Fixed switching into offline mode
or in september

Code: Select all

Fixed offline mode not working if there was no remembered password
i don't know how bloody dificult it is to program a simple kill switch for the tcp/ip traffic in that program.
But as they still haven't been able to do it in 10years i fear they never will.
Last edited by xeon_1 on Thu, 27. Oct 11, 19:27, edited 1 time in total.
Chris0132
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Post by Chris0132 »

Steam does work as intended, it's a content distribution platform, it distributes large amounts of content to millions of people.

Thus, it works as intended.

That it doesn't work offline is not 'does't work as intended' it's 'is not intended to work offline, because it's an online content distribution platform'.

It's like complaining that your car doesn't work as intended when it fails to go because you tried to pedal it like a bike.
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the-danzorz
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Post by the-danzorz »

xeon_1 wrote:
X2-Eliah wrote:
Choublanc wrote: The Steam case is maybe not so obvious but still, if the company x (Egosoft) obliges me to be client of the company y (Steam), that’s tie sales.
SecuROM. UbiDRM. GfWL. TAGES. Impulse. DirectDrive. Origin. PS3 account. Xbox Live account.

see a pattern? Oh, no, wait, it's only steam that eeeebilll!!!!, right? :roll:
Securom works offline some titles only require a one time connection
GFWL acctualy has an ofline mode that works wheras steam offline mode still doesn't work after 10 years.
Tages offline
PS3 account only for online play i don't have one since i only play singleplayer games and don't use the store.

Xbox ,impulse,origin don't have any experience with that.

Ubidrm works only it isn't user oriented.
Yep i see a pattern.
stuff that works as intended vs stuff that doesn't work namely steam.
You entirely missed his point, we are saying you are required to be a customer or use these services to play the game(s). Same as steam is going to be for XR.

Steam does work, just maybe in your experience it didn't as intended. However that is just your experience and not a fact.
fairywhipper
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Post by fairywhipper »

if i had console, which demaned access to internet to play a non internet game. it would go back to the shop, and money back. either that or you can tell the console maker to send you a disc with the firmware upgrade on it.... thinking of consumer rights(uk).

in steam, if developers uses steam, then it is a requirement to log onto internet, because steam is a requirement, our choices either accept or no game. consumer rights we either accept or not. if they however fail to notify you of the requirement to use steam, then there is case.

no real laws broke, because steam is a service provider, unless it fails to deliver.
Given up gaming because of steam
Slashman
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Post by Slashman »

xeon_1 wrote:GFWL acctualy has an ofline mode that works wheras steam offline mode still doesn't work after 10 years. .
I played Prototype offline for almost 3 weeks when my ISP has serious problems a year or so ago. So apparently your statement isn't factual across the board. Also played Orcs Must Die offline yesterday(although naturally my scores didn't get added to the leaderboard).

Generalizations are silly.

I'd also like to know since when does Ubisoft's DRM get a pass versus Steam? How can one even suggest that?
If you want a different perspective, stand on your head.
xeon_1
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Post by xeon_1 »

the-danzorz wrote:
xeon_1 wrote:
X2-Eliah wrote:
Choublanc wrote: The Steam case is maybe not so obvious but still, if the company x (Egosoft) obliges me to be client of the company y (Steam), that’s tie sales.
SecuROM. UbiDRM. GfWL. TAGES. Impulse. DirectDrive. Origin. PS3 account. Xbox Live account.

see a pattern? Oh, no, wait, it's only steam that eeeebilll!!!!, right? :roll:
Securom works offline some titles only require a one time connection
GFWL acctualy has an ofline mode that works wheras steam offline mode still doesn't work after 10 years.
Tages offline
PS3 account only for online play i don't have one since i only play singleplayer games and don't use the store.

Xbox ,impulse,origin don't have any experience with that.

Ubidrm works only it isn't user oriented.
Yep i see a pattern.
stuff that works as intended vs stuff that doesn't work namely steam.
Steam does work, just maybe in your experience it didn't as intended. However that is just your experience and not a fact.
Sorry but i had several lan party's ruined by that simple glitch.
If you include the option of offline mode it should work and not switch back to online mode when ever it feels like it.
Then it refuses to run the game since it wants to call home but can't since there is no internet.
Chris0132 wrote:Steam does work as intended, it's a content distribution platform, it distributes large amounts of content to millions of people.

Thus, it works as intended.

That it doesn't work offline is not 'does't work as intended' it's 'is not intended to work offline, because it's an online content distribution platform'.

It's like complaining that your car doesn't work as intended when it fails to go because you tried to pedal it like a bike.
It is a content distribuiton platform yes and for that part i fully understand why it needs to be online.
But once the game is on your pc and you set it to offline mode for whatever reason.
It shouldn't go back to online mode just because there is an active network connection.
Hell if you want to play a single player game but you can't beacause it tries to update said game with a multi gig patch that takes hours to download
Ok try next time you have time to play the game oops can't since there is an other ****** patch out.
Ok set steam offline oops doens't work.

Result steam deinstalled half life dvd used as wall decoration.


edit to remove double post
Slashman wrote:
xeon_1 wrote:GFWL acctualy has an ofline mode that works wheras steam offline mode still doesn't work after 10 years. .
I played Prototype offline for almost 3 weeks when my ISP has serious problems a year or so ago. So apparently your statement isn't factual across the board. Also played Orcs Must Die offline yesterday(although naturally my scores didn't get added to the leaderboard).

Generalizations are silly.

I'd also like to know since when does Ubisoft's DRM get a pass versus Steam? How can one even suggest that?
well i find steam silly
And ubidrm say's it requires an active stable internet connection or no game.
Wtich is why i don't have silent hunter 5 where as i really wanted to play it.
Steam creates the illusion of working offline whereas in reality its no beter then ubidrm

I used it for 4 years and offline mode never functioned during that time.
Last edited by xeon_1 on Thu, 27. Oct 11, 19:44, edited 1 time in total.
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the-danzorz
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Post by the-danzorz »

xeon_1 wrote:
the-danzorz wrote:
xeon_1 wrote:
X2-Eliah wrote:
Choublanc wrote: The Steam case is maybe not so obvious but still, if the company x (Egosoft) obliges me to be client of the company y (Steam), that’s tie sales.
SecuROM. UbiDRM. GfWL. TAGES. Impulse. DirectDrive. Origin. PS3 account. Xbox Live account.

see a pattern? Oh, no, wait, it's only steam that eeeebilll!!!!, right? :roll:
Securom works offline some titles only require a one time connection
GFWL acctualy has an ofline mode that works wheras steam offline mode still doesn't work after 10 years.
Tages offline
PS3 account only for online play i don't have one since i only play singleplayer games and don't use the store.

Xbox ,impulse,origin don't have any experience with that.

Ubidrm works only it isn't user oriented.
Yep i see a pattern.
stuff that works as intended vs stuff that doesn't work namely steam.
Steam does work, just maybe in your experience it didn't as intended. However that is just your experience and not a fact.
Sorry but i had several lan party's ruined by that simple glitch.
If you include the option of offline mode it should work and not switch back to online mode when ever it feels like it.
Then it refuses to run the game since it wants to call home but can't since there is no internet.
I've never see or exsperianced that, ever... where as a more common problem has been issues with stuff like Punkbuster crashing and conflicting with simple and NONE related stuff like sound drivers.

I've been using steam since Half Life 2 first came out, 90% of the time ive kept it on offline mode. Even for lan games with CSS and had no issues what so ever. If something bugged steam, it is something conflicting with it.
Chris0132
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Post by Chris0132 »

Again though, it's supposed to do that.

It's a platform designed to have people routinely download gigabytes of data from it.

The idea is that you have no reason to turn it off or put it in offline mode, and you also have no reason to disable automatic updates on games you play. You're supposed to leave it on and connected all the time in the background so it downloads any updates for you and you hardly notice they're doing so until it tells you it's finished them, which is how it works for me.

Online distribution platform means online all the time, with lots of bandwidth. Actually the bandwidth usage sort of scales, if you have limited bandwidth you won't buy many games on it, and so it won't download many updates, if you have lots of bandwidth you'll use it more and it will have more stuff to download, basically if you have any sort of decent internet, it's a good system.

If you don't have decent internet, it's really not supposed to work, there's not really any way to make it work as intended in that situation, as the entire point is that it gives people with lots of bandwidth a lot of convenience.
xeon_1
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Post by xeon_1 »

the-danzorz wrote:
xeon_1 wrote:
the-danzorz wrote:
xeon_1 wrote:
X2-Eliah wrote:
Choublanc wrote: The Steam case is maybe not so obvious but still, if the company x (Egosoft) obliges me to be client of the company y (Steam), that’s tie sales.
SecuROM. UbiDRM. GfWL. TAGES. Impulse. DirectDrive. Origin. PS3 account. Xbox Live account.

see a pattern? Oh, no, wait, it's only steam that eeeebilll!!!!, right? :roll:
Securom works offline some titles only require a one time connection
GFWL acctualy has an ofline mode that works wheras steam offline mode still doesn't work after 10 years.
Tages offline
PS3 account only for online play i don't have one since i only play singleplayer games and don't use the store.

Xbox ,impulse,origin don't have any experience with that.

Ubidrm works only it isn't user oriented.
Yep i see a pattern.
stuff that works as intended vs stuff that doesn't work namely steam.
Steam does work, just maybe in your experience it didn't as intended. However that is just your experience and not a fact.
Sorry but i had several lan party's ruined by that simple glitch.
If you include the option of offline mode it should work and not switch back to online mode when ever it feels like it.
Then it refuses to run the game since it wants to call home but can't since there is no internet.
I've never see or exsperianced that, ever... where as a more common problem has been issues with stuff like Punkbuster crashing and conflicting with simple and NONE related stuff like sound drivers.

I've been using steam since Half Life 2 first came out, 90% of the time ive kept it on offline mode. Even for lan games with CSS and had no issues what so ever. If something bugged steam, it is something conflicting with it.
Not a problem with the pc's as it happened on 4 different rigs with different setup's.
And it also happend to my clan members pc's that i didn't even maintained
But anyway it moot for my anyway as my rig doesn't meets steams requirements.
Don't run a desktop os.
Some software even refuses to install but that is quickly bypassed.
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the-danzorz
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Post by the-danzorz »

xeon_1 wrote:
the-danzorz wrote:
xeon_1 wrote:
the-danzorz wrote:
xeon_1 wrote:
X2-Eliah wrote:
Choublanc wrote: The Steam case is maybe not so obvious but still, if the company x (Egosoft) obliges me to be client of the company y (Steam), that’s tie sales.
SecuROM. UbiDRM. GfWL. TAGES. Impulse. DirectDrive. Origin. PS3 account. Xbox Live account.

see a pattern? Oh, no, wait, it's only steam that eeeebilll!!!!, right? :roll:
Securom works offline some titles only require a one time connection
GFWL acctualy has an ofline mode that works wheras steam offline mode still doesn't work after 10 years.
Tages offline
PS3 account only for online play i don't have one since i only play singleplayer games and don't use the store.

Xbox ,impulse,origin don't have any experience with that.

Ubidrm works only it isn't user oriented.
Yep i see a pattern.
stuff that works as intended vs stuff that doesn't work namely steam.
Steam does work, just maybe in your experience it didn't as intended. However that is just your experience and not a fact.
Sorry but i had several lan party's ruined by that simple glitch.
If you include the option of offline mode it should work and not switch back to online mode when ever it feels like it.
Then it refuses to run the game since it wants to call home but can't since there is no internet.
I've never see or exsperianced that, ever... where as a more common problem has been issues with stuff like Punkbuster crashing and conflicting with simple and NONE related stuff like sound drivers.

I've been using steam since Half Life 2 first came out, 90% of the time ive kept it on offline mode. Even for lan games with CSS and had no issues what so ever. If something bugged steam, it is something conflicting with it.
Not a problem with the pc's as it happened on 4 different rigs with different setup's.
And it also happend to my clan members pc's that i didn't even maintained
But anyway it moot for my anyway as my rig doesn't meets steams requirements.
Don't run a desktop os.
Some software even refuses to install but that is quickly bypassed.
Odd, but then again i made steam portable and doesn't run on my OS drive, so that may be a contributing factor on why i can stay on offline with no problems.

But the post 2 posts above is right, steam is a online distribution platform designed around having the internet.
VincentTH
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Post by VincentTH »

X2-Illuminatus wrote:
apricotslice wrote:
Ketraar wrote:...its NOT TRUE for XR, this was made clear about 80 pages ago (more or less).
Better find the quote then, because my recollection was that Bernd left it as clear as mud.

A lot of the uncertainty is because Egosoft has not made it definite exactly how much steam interaction is needed to run the game. So far there has only been assumption based on "steamworks" being mentioned.

A definitive statement from Egosoft would go a long way to clearing things up.
For reference:
In [url=http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?p=3704536&highlight=#3704536]this[/url] post Bernd wrote:You should be able to play offline. You only need to be go online once for activation. If this did not always work it may be because some things were simply wrong. Again: Only having to support one version will help us make sure things like this dont happen in the future.
May I refer you to this real life scenario given before of a US navy man whose ship is offshore for an 8 month period, and a game he bought with Steam: Offline mode ceased to work after 2 weeks. This is off Steam's own forum:

service man unable to play Steam offline

I like Steam convenience when I am at home and have Broadband, but I am on the road often with no internet access. In the past, I always have 2 copies of X3TC, one with Steam, and one DVD. I am willing to pay extra for the DVD version IN ADDITION TO the Steam version.
I am not advocating boycotting Steam, I just want to be able to have a CHOICE of no Steam for my special case.

[EDIT]
A Steam game with a DLC enabled (eg. X3TC with the SunnyPlace DLC)will NOT run in offline mode.
Last edited by VincentTH on Thu, 27. Oct 11, 20:56, edited 1 time in total.
Chris0132
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Post by Chris0132 »

Why in the nine hells would you buy a bunch of stuff on STEAM to take onto a navy ship?

Some people really need better computer literacy skills.
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EmperorJon
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Post by EmperorJon »

VincentTH wrote:A Steam game with a DLC enabled (eg. X3TC with the SunnyPlace DLC)will NOT run in offline mode.
I'm fed up with the load of absolute nonsense people are talking. Vincent, did you find this out yourself, or collect it from a forum or something? Because, like much said in this thread, it's simply not true. I am, in fact, running TC with the DLC right now in offline mode.
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Cycrow
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Post by Cycrow »

EmperorJon wrote:
VincentTH wrote:A Steam game with a DLC enabled (eg. X3TC with the SunnyPlace DLC)will NOT run in offline mode.
I'm fed up with the load of absolute nonsense people are talking. Vincent, did you find this out yourself, or collect it from a forum or something? Because, like much said in this thread, it's simply not true. I am, in fact, running TC with the DLC right now in offline mode.
just to confirm, it works fine for me too.
i can go into offline mode and play TC with the DLC included without any problem
Mightysword
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Post by Mightysword »

VincentTH wrote: May I refer you to this real life scenario given before of a US navy man whose ship is offshore for an 8 month period, and a game he bought with Steam: Offline mode ceased to work after 2 weeks.
I wonder if the service man is an attemp to make a sentimental case :P, to me he's just another user really, even if he's the president. :wink: In any case I agree with what Chris is saying. Or just like how one of the response in that very topic "Steam without internet is like a fish out of water".

Steam is a program designed around and inheretenly rely on the Internet. Things like Offline mode is meant as an accomodation rather than an alternative. It's meant for people who has shaky connect, or netphobic who don't want to stay on all the times ...etc... but at the end of the day it will still work under the assumtion that it can get online when it needs. Steam does not mean to work with a total black out, you might get lucky if it does, but if you know you're heading into one and still invest in it, any bad luck is your own bad investment. Staying permanent offline is something Steam "might be able to do", but that's not how it's intended or meant to work.


This also applies to a few other "cases" I see in this thread. A good assumption is that Steam is built under the assumption you have a private connection, one that you can control and troubleshoot if something is wrong. Something inside me screamed in disbelief when people complain Steam doesn't work "at their company's internet", espeically when the point was brought up repeatdly. You know ... I can not even get something like solitaire through at work without asking IT's permission. A few months ago my friend who worked in a different company suddenly went off the radar for 2 months because her company reroute and halt all external traffic inside the company. Before you give me a reason why, don't, because it doesn't matter. If you can get Steam works for your workplace, great! But if you can't then you can't fault it for not to, I doubt it's ever meant to work behidn a cooporation firewall. :wink:
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Texhnolyzed
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Post by Texhnolyzed »

I think even more so now, the anti-Steam people will grab and hold onto every single bit of straw they can find. I'm glad to see some really good posters in this thread though... I pretty much gave up on trying to argue with the people here.
VincentTH
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Post by VincentTH »

EmperorJon wrote:
VincentTH wrote:A Steam game with a DLC enabled (eg. X3TC with the SunnyPlace DLC)will NOT run in offline mode.
I'm fed up with the load of absolute nonsense people are talking. Vincent, did you find this out yourself, or collect it from a forum or something? Because, like much said in this thread, it's simply not true. I am, in fact, running TC with the DLC right now in offline mode.
Here is the post I made, burried in this 100-page thread. I just wanted to make sure that X:R can run in offline mode like Bernd said, so I ran this little test myself. ALso included is the screenshot of the error I have when I bug "PLAY" on X3TC.

http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php? ... 36#3710936

@Cycrow:

In order to reproduce this you have to:

(1) Be in offline mode
(2) Reboot and
Either
(3a) Yank out the Ethernet connector. Steam is known to SILENTLY get on the net even in offline mode.
Or
(3b) block Steam ports (except HTTP/HTTPS)

I did this test while at work and at my in-laws home, with Ethernet access, but all ports except HTTP/HTTPS blocked. Laptop set to offline mode at my home before being brought to in-law house for testing.
Stupid bro-in-law set up the router, but said he forgot the password (or refused to enable it for whatever reason :-)).

[EDIT] Add reboot step, since Steam will cache information and use it for authentication in offline mode if machine is not rebooted.
Last edited by VincentTH on Thu, 27. Oct 11, 22:37, edited 2 times in total.
VincentTH
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Post by VincentTH »

People claim that Steam works fine for them?

Solve this issue which is closer to home than you think, and I, and undoubtedly many others still on the fence, will be a Steam convert:


Lose DiD save game thread

This problem has gone around for 3 months +, and Xenon_Slayer has said he could reproduce it, to no avail.

As of currently, I don't believe Steam will work for me 100% of the time. That's why I have been adamant about having a non-Steam choice.
Last edited by VincentTH on Thu, 27. Oct 11, 22:23, edited 1 time in total.
henkbein
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Post by henkbein »

I'm still unclear about Steam offline mode.

As said earlier, the Steam change log states:
27 Sep 2011: Fixed switching into offline mode
06 Sep 2011: etc...

My questions:
Did anyone at Egosoft check offline mode after the 27 Sep 2011 fix ?
Can you confirm that offline mode now functions properly ?

If so, my next question in reply to
Bernd wrote:You should be able to play offline.
Can you - Bernd - now state: 'You *ARE* able to play offline' ?
Last edited by henkbein on Thu, 27. Oct 11, 22:36, edited 1 time in total.
VincentTH
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Post by VincentTH »

Texhnolyzed wrote:I think even more so now, the anti-Steam people will grab and hold onto every single bit of straw they can find. I'm glad to see some really good posters in this thread though... I pretty much gave up on trying to argue with the people here.
You keep attacking anti-Steam people's opinion, but you kinda ignore the real tests that are related to Steam+Egosoft. Those are real problems with X3TC-on-Steam - and acknowleged by an Egosoft dev - that are currently un-resolved after 3+ months.

Just the facts maam!!!

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