X3TC 2.5 - Number of decks on TMs and M6s

LeSash · Post by **LeSash** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 21:19

I am a little confused.

I have read several times on this forum that in TC Vanilla 2.5 TMs have 3 decks and M6s have 2. However, in my game (vanilla 2.5) it is the other way around - which makes more sense, realy.

A few weeks ago I mentioned in a post that I used TMs for marine training as they only have 2 decks; I was corrected by several people that under 2.5 TMs had 3 decks. So I went home and boarded:

- several Helios (2 decks)
- two Zephyros (2 decks)
- a Pleco (2 decks)

- 2 HCP (3 decks)
- 1 Hyperion Vanguard (3 decks)
- 1 Nemesis (3 decks)
- a whole bunch of Pirate Centaurs and Ospreys (all 3 decks)

My question is: how can it be that people playing 2.5 have different decks on TMs and M6s?

The only explanation I could come up with is that i got TC in the Gold Edition where it was already patched to 2.5. Could there be a difference between that version and players who have patched their game from earlier versions?

Post by **Alan Phipps** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:25

X3 Gold was around in Jun 09 which is well before patch 2.5, so are you sure your version came patched to 2.5 and that you are strictly vanilla? (Duplicate of my post in a Spoiler thread - but relevant here I think.)

I think in Gold it is X3R that is at 2.5 version.

LeSash · Post by **LeSash** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:27

My Gold edition came with 2.5 installed for both R and TC

EDIT: yes, I'm strictly vanilla. I have the toned down complex tubes installed, but only after testing and it hasn't changed the deck numbers

Post by **Geek** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:28

There is no problem with your game.

Prior to 2.5 TM had 3 decks and M6, 2 (maybe you read old boarding posts ?). Egosoft swapped those figures in the 2.5 patch in order to make M6 boarding more difficult.

PS : i play with the original DVD release, if you care

Post by **Alan Phipps** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:40

@ Geek: Now I'm confused! In early X3TC versions, TMs had 4 decks. In vanilla 2.5 (DVD Eng + latest patch) they have 3. M6 have 2 - their boarding was made more difficult by the spacewalk group splitting in 2 and not by more decks. What is going on here?

Post by **Nanook** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:41

LeSash wrote:....
A few weeks ago I mentioned in a post that I used TMs for marine training as they only have 2 decks; I was corrected by several people that under 2.5 TMs had 3 decks. ....

They were probably still capturing ships that were generated before they patched to 2.5. Pre-existing ships don't normally change configuration after a patch, unless the patch specifically does that in order to fix a bug.

jonbuttle · Post by **jonbuttle** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:41

can someone post a list of all the 2.5 decks for board able ships?

LeSash · Post by **LeSash** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:42

@Geek: You are the first person I have seen confirming that. I have suggested to people before that the decks might have changed in 2.5, but some insist that in their 2.5 game, TMs still have 3 and M6s 2 decks.

This seems to only leave two possibilities:
1) those people haven't boarded anything smaller than an M7 since 2.5 and therefore not noticed, or
2) some 2.5 games are different to others (sounds funny, though).

Anyway, i suppose it's not that important...just a point of interest

BTW, even if my game was weird, I wouldn't see it as a problem. 2 decks on a TM makes more sense and makes boarding TMs for training purposes worthwhile again

@ Nanook: aaah, now that makes sense. Thanks for the info

EDIT: edited for readability

Post by **Nanook** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:43

Alan Phipps wrote:@ Geek: Now I'm confused! In early X3TC versions, TMs had 4 decks. ...

What early version was that? Since at least v1.2, TM's had 3 decks until v2.5. I don't remember ever seeing one with 4 decks.

Carlo the Curious · Post by **Carlo the Curious** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:43

Nanook wrote:They were probably still capturing ships that were generated before they patched to 2.5. Pre-existing ships don't normally change configuration after a patch, unless the patch specifically does that in order to fix a bug.

iirc, the number of decks is in the code rather than TShips or similar, which I think would mean that an update affects everything right away. Although it might not, of course...

LeSash · Post by **LeSash** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:44

jonbuttle wrote:can someone post a list of all the 2.5 decks for board able ships?

TM - 2
M6 - 3
M7 - 4
TL - 5

I'm not sure about M1/2, but i presume its 5 or 6

Rednoahl · Post by **Rednoahl** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:45

I don't do that much boarding anymore, but I thought in 2.5 the number of decks depended on the individual ship - not it's class.

LeSash · Post by **LeSash** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 22:49

Rednoahl wrote:I don't do that much boarding anymore, but I thought in 2.5 the number of decks depended on the individual ship - not it's class.

I haven't noticed that ... but then, I have only boarded 30-40 ships yet, and nothing bigger than an M7 (and the occasional defenseless TL), so am still pretty much a noob

Deadbeat_Spinn · Post by **Deadbeat_Spinn** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 23:01

M1's and M2's each have 5 decks IIRC, granted the only M1 I've boarded as of yet was the #Deca (I've only done 13 boarding ops so far). Everything else I've boarded have been M7/M7M's and the TLS. Oh and M6's belonging to the Syndicate.

Post by **Alan Phipps** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 23:03

Let me start by saying that I have done a lot of boarding in vanilla 2.5.

If Nanook's theory is correct and Carlo's is not then that might explain the confusion but I have two comments. Firstly that I have captured M6 spawned in missions post 2.5 and they only had 2 decks - I would assume that the missions would spawn to any new model. Secondly that I have captured a lot of Caravels and Chokaros post 2.5, often in the same area and surely some of those would be new-spawns, yet all had 3 decks.

If the legacy ship issue is indeed the reason for this then I would think that there would be total confusion in your boarding tactics since you will never know from the ship stats whether you are targetting an old or a new version. Indeed your strategy for capturing Xenon M6 would probably fail because you can only initially launch 6 marines, you will lose at least 1 per deck, so with 3 decks you will never get the essential 4 marines through to hacking the core and without which you will fail.

Surely one of the game/patch Dev's can put this issue of 2.5 TM/M6 deck numbers to rest once and for all?

@ Nanook: I think 1.01 out of the box, TMs had 4 decks.

Post by **Nanook** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 23:25

Alan Phipps wrote:Let me start by saying that I have done a lot of boarding in vanilla 2.5.

If Nanook's theory is correct and Carlo's is not then that might explain the confusion but I have two comments. Firstly that I have captured M6 spawned in missions post 2.5 and they only had 2 decks - I would assume that the missions would spawn to any new model. Secondly that I have captured a lot of Caravels and Chokaros post 2.5, often in the same area and surely some of those would be new-spawns, yet all had 3 decks...

Odd, since this totally contradicts the OP's finding in the first post. His mission M6's all had 3 decks. I haven't done much boarding since 2.5, but my results tend to confirm LeSash's.

LeSash · Post by **LeSash** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 23:28

Alan Phipps wrote: Indeed your strategy for capturing Xenon M6 would probably fail because you can only initially launch 6 marines, you will lose at least 1 per deck, so with 3 decks you will never get the essential 4 marines through to hacking the core and without which you will fail.

I thought that for core hacking only the top three hack skills were used?

Post by **Geek** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 23:34

I have capped dozens of M6 of all kind in 2.5 (new game, if that matters)so i am sure they have 3 decks now.
Maybe the number of decks are stored in saves ?

@LeSash : when boarding Xenon ships, marines still get attacked after clearing the last deck. That is the reason why you need a minimum of xxx marines (depending on the ship) when reaching the core in that case.

LeSash · Post by **LeSash** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 23:38

Could it have something to do with new game starts?

If you started a game under 2.5 M6s have 3 decks, if you play a game which started 2.1 or earlier and you patched to 2.5, M6s have 2 decks?

Deadbeat_Spinn · Post by **Deadbeat_Spinn** » Mon, 15. Mar 10, 23:52

My M6's have 2 decks, but then again I'm not using 2.5.

egosoft.com

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X3TC 2.5 - Number of decks on TMs and M6s

X3TC 2.5 - Number of decks on TMs and M6s

Re: X3TC 2.5 - Number of decks on TMs and M6s