X4: Cradle of Humanity (Release Date March 16, 2021, 6pm CET; Livestream at 5pm CET)
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Exploitable weakness yes, underpowered for the sake of balancing no.
The Xenon are indeed a good example, they are overpowered, but they also fight all other factions at the same time on half a dozen different sectors. That's their gameplay, it is different from all others. They have their own economy and different goals.
Terrans could be confined to their space, not expanding, but also overpowered in their defense. That was their thing in X3: isolated and protected space, vastly superior tech and weaponry, no interest in expansion. Their gameplay and way of interacting with the universe could be "control of forbidden tech and fighting AGI (Xenon)". To that end they could build a fleet, fly over and punish whoever they want and then return home. All in all they stay where they are. No need to weaken and programming them to do what all other factions also do.
Just like Xenon, different tools for different tasks.
Another story is what the player does with it, but as it is a singleplayer sandbox, the player can either help the Terrans, wipe them out, use their op tech, not use it etc. If you ruin your sandbox, that's on you and not on the sandbox.
The Xenon are indeed a good example, they are overpowered, but they also fight all other factions at the same time on half a dozen different sectors. That's their gameplay, it is different from all others. They have their own economy and different goals.
Terrans could be confined to their space, not expanding, but also overpowered in their defense. That was their thing in X3: isolated and protected space, vastly superior tech and weaponry, no interest in expansion. Their gameplay and way of interacting with the universe could be "control of forbidden tech and fighting AGI (Xenon)". To that end they could build a fleet, fly over and punish whoever they want and then return home. All in all they stay where they are. No need to weaken and programming them to do what all other factions also do.
Just like Xenon, different tools for different tasks.
Another story is what the player does with it, but as it is a singleplayer sandbox, the player can either help the Terrans, wipe them out, use their op tech, not use it etc. If you ruin your sandbox, that's on you and not on the sandbox.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Nah... just make it chase you inside a bunch of asteroids. You do that at the start of the game, it will come out by the time you have your second shipyard up and running!!!
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Agree! In X3, Terrans are even more powerfull than the Xenon, but who think the game is unbalanced and boring?xant wrote: ↑Fri, 4. Dec 20, 13:37 Exploitable weakness yes, underpowered for the sake of balancing no.
The Xenon are indeed a good example, they are overpowered, but they also fight all other factions at the same time on half a dozen different sectors. That's their gameplay, it is different from all others. They have their own economy and different goals.
Terrans could be confined to their space, not expanding, but also overpowered in their defense. That was their thing in X3: isolated and protected space, vastly superior tech and weaponry, no interest in expansion. Their gameplay and way of interacting with the universe could be "control of forbidden tech and fighting AGI (Xenon)". To that end they could build a fleet, fly over and punish whoever they want and then return home. All in all they stay where they are. No need to weaken and programming them to do what all other factions also do.
Just like Xenon, different tools for different tasks.
Another story is what the player does with it, but as it is a singleplayer sandbox, the player can either help the Terrans, wipe them out, use their op tech, not use it etc. If you ruin your sandbox, that's on you and not on the sandbox.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
X3TC does not have conquest, and AP in a very limited fashion (although it clearly shows Terrans are not a defensive faction).
Xenons have better tools in X4, not different tools. Their goal is conquest, in fact they do not do anything else.
The bottom line is some people want Terrans to be OP for the sake of it, or misplaced self identification, but that will hurt the game.
Remember, the whole X4 economy is about war.
Xenons have better tools in X4, not different tools. Their goal is conquest, in fact they do not do anything else.
The bottom line is some people want Terrans to be OP for the sake of it, or misplaced self identification, but that will hurt the game.
Remember, the whole X4 economy is about war.
Right on commander !
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Lorewise terrans have been technologically superior, but ingame they weren't all that different from the other races.Geek wrote: ↑Fri, 4. Dec 20, 14:56 X3TC does not have conquest, and AP in a very limited fashion (although it clearly shows Terrans are not a defensive faction).
Xenons have better tools in X4, not different tools. Their goal is conquest, in fact they do not do anything else.
The bottom line is some people want Terrans to be OP for the sake of it, or misplaced self identification, but that will hurt the game.
Remember, the whole X4 economy is about war.
We'll see how they're now when CoH is actually out.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Price and efficiency can balance everything, especially in large scaled wars. Terran's ships and weapons can be superior to other races', at the cost of being more expensive.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
OK then insert "time to build" where I have written "cost". It' simple logic: If faction x can build four destroyers while faction y can only build one destroyer (needing the same amount of resources and time), than destroyer y should be better - not exactly four times, I know balancing is more complicated, but at least significantly. We will see...Geek wrote: ↑Fri, 4. Dec 20, 12:42 The Xenons is a good example actually ; *every* game turns into a race to prevent them to destroy everything.
So no, it is not a good idea.
Cost is only a facor if the faction does not have more resources than the others.
Remember, NPC faction have (practically) infinite budget.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Mind you - the Xenon ruling the universe is a possibility, not a fact in every game. I e.g. started a game with Beta 4.0 and "my Xenon" are hammered in every single conflict. Especially Teladi erradicate them early on in the Matrix sectors and keep campaigning into "the red south east". ARG and ANT battle the Xenon AND keep HOP at bay. Last frontier is blue, not red.
The only race which has some trouble is ZYA - but they are retreating to the Free Families. Meanwhile both ARG & TEL pouring into the Split border sectors and build defense platforms there. The poor Xenon who enters those "contested" sectors is greeted with a light show.
So balancing can't assume Xenon is overpowered as this is situational. Give me OP Terrans!
A turtle faction strategy for the Terrans with a Xenon only agenda along with a vast new Xenon play ground only reached by Terran space would be awesome. All Egosoft has to do is to design the Terran faction relation with all other races but Xenon / Khaak to - friendship.
The only race which has some trouble is ZYA - but they are retreating to the Free Families. Meanwhile both ARG & TEL pouring into the Split border sectors and build defense platforms there. The poor Xenon who enters those "contested" sectors is greeted with a light show.
So balancing can't assume Xenon is overpowered as this is situational. Give me OP Terrans!

A turtle faction strategy for the Terrans with a Xenon only agenda along with a vast new Xenon play ground only reached by Terran space would be awesome. All Egosoft has to do is to design the Terran faction relation with all other races but Xenon / Khaak to - friendship.


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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
I bet there will be at least one Xenon region near Terran space. It was like that with Sectors next to Aldrin in X3:AP.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Oh I think there will be a lot more than that

My bet on the name, as it was stated the name was mentioned here, is Loki. Im assuming this is an ATF ship as the styling is quite different to the other terran ships we've seen, so nordic name. Although, I hope its Tachi.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
If they use a japense name, Yamato seems pretty obvious. What else would it be.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
This is beatiful.
Its looks like the one of the powerest ship in X4.
The name "Titanic" came to my mind
But if take into account M2 ship names from X3 series. It can be named like Hiroshima / Fukoka / Nagoya / Komamoto i guess
Its looks like the one of the powerest ship in X4.
The name "Titanic" came to my mind
But if take into account M2 ship names from X3 series. It can be named like Hiroshima / Fukoka / Nagoya / Komamoto i guess
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Titanic will be it's condition the moment it enters my game... as for names, going with the Norsk mythology Loki (the God of mischief, ridicule and disaster) fits perfect, while if it is USC then two good Japanese names for it would be Hiroshima or Nagasaki (for obvious reasons)...
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Let me take a wild guess, the terran construction ship is going to be the same model as every other faction...
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
My best guess for the new Battleship - Valhalla (As in the Terran's most powerful ship in X3:TC/AP). As a second guess I would probably go for Odin (As in the ATF M2 from X3:TC/X3:AP). In any case, I would fully expect the ship to be of Norse origins if historically linked to the ATF, or Japanese origins if linked to the USC.
As for the balancing debate, in my game the Xenon are nearly wiped out (mainly by the Split, Teladi, and Paranid - I control one of the ex-Xenon sectors), and the Kha'ak are under control - Pirates are the biggest problem due to the plot choices I have made and the economy seems stable and prosperous enough. I control a number of sectors myself and have several ship production facilities (with at least some of them having a level of self sufficiency).
Where the Terrans are concerned, I would expect there to be options for how they impact existing games. Initially, I would expect them to be cautious and defensive of their own territory. After TC and AP, their relations with the Argons and Split are likely to be strained but peaceful in the first instance. Argon or Split presence in their territory is likely to be met with suspicion and possibly violence without some kind of diplomatic and/or military event which could result in them either supporting or opposing the Argons depending on choices made.
As for the balancing debate, in my game the Xenon are nearly wiped out (mainly by the Split, Teladi, and Paranid - I control one of the ex-Xenon sectors), and the Kha'ak are under control - Pirates are the biggest problem due to the plot choices I have made and the economy seems stable and prosperous enough. I control a number of sectors myself and have several ship production facilities (with at least some of them having a level of self sufficiency).
Where the Terrans are concerned, I would expect there to be options for how they impact existing games. Initially, I would expect them to be cautious and defensive of their own territory. After TC and AP, their relations with the Argons and Split are likely to be strained but peaceful in the first instance. Argon or Split presence in their territory is likely to be met with suspicion and possibly violence without some kind of diplomatic and/or military event which could result in them either supporting or opposing the Argons depending on choices made.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Asgard if the beta text files are to be believed. Or it could be the kyoto and we're getting 2 battleships, and 2 destroyers. But i doubt that.Roger L.S. Griffiths wrote: ↑Sat, 5. Dec 20, 21:42 My best guess for the new Battleship - Valhalla (As in the Terran's most powerful ship in X3:TC/AP). As a second guess I would probably go for Odin (As in the ATF M2 from X3:TC/X3:AP). In any case, I would fully expect the ship to be of Norse origins if historically linked to the ATF, or Japanese origins if linked to the USC.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Aren't text files contain also many placeholder names for ships never made? I think it was like that in all previous games.Matterom wrote: ↑Sun, 6. Dec 20, 09:06Asgard if the beta text files are to be believed. Or it could be the kyoto and we're getting 2 battleships, and 2 destroyers. But i doubt that.Roger L.S. Griffiths wrote: ↑Sat, 5. Dec 20, 21:42 My best guess for the new Battleship - Valhalla (As in the Terran's most powerful ship in X3:TC/AP). As a second guess I would probably go for Odin (As in the ATF M2 from X3:TC/X3:AP). In any case, I would fully expect the ship to be of Norse origins if historically linked to the ATF, or Japanese origins if linked to the USC.
This ship looks more USC and much more like modernised Kyoto. It's hard to see any ATF traces here, so I doubt for Asgard name.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
You should put that in spoiler tags, as it is hard to argue against game files, even when they're just beta/placeholder. Don't ruin the fun of speculation.
On that note, while there are many names in the file, some of them have already a full description, including this battleship. That gives it some credibility, so I think the name is most likely correct.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
Was Asgard ever a real ship in previous X games? I can't find it in any ship database.
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Re: X4: Cradle of Humanity *UPDATE* Fresh from the shipyard: unveiling a new battleship
No, it wasn't. But ATF ships were named after figures from norse mythology, and "Asgard" is home to the Aesir (i.e. gods from norse mythology).
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