Fully simulated economy?

[conquestor]

I don't know what it is you are seeing but the game is definitely NOT warping or spawning ships near you because you are so far away.

md/Encounters.xml will warp select ships to the player position based on whatever encounter type it selects, eg. moving some khaak over to attack the player. The affected ships have the "encounters" node in the jobs.xml file; it looks like there are 42 of them (out of 342 jobs, so 12% by job count). Ship warping is based on distance from the player getting too large, among other condition checks (eg. Lone_Miner won't warp if the player is in a Xenon sector). It actually appears to warp potentially quite close the player, +/- 5km on y-axis and +/-20km on x-axis.

That's probably the behavior I've been seeing. I wound up 12,000km out into deep space and it was pretty active.

That entire system should probably be removed IMO.

[Ovni]

That entire system should probably be removed IMO.

No, it should just have some conditions added so the parts that don't make sense don't trigger if you end up far from civilization.

[JakubCW]

So much for simulated economy then, I don’t recall previous x-games warping ships to my location out in deep space.

[MegaJohnny]

md/Encounters.xml will warp select ships to the player position based on whatever encounter type it selects, eg. moving some khaak over to attack the player. The affected ships have the "encounters" node in the jobs.xml file; it looks like there are 42 of them (out of 342 jobs, so 12% by job count). Ship warping is based on distance from the player getting too large, among other condition checks (eg. Lone_Miner won't warp if the player is in a Xenon sector). It actually appears to warp potentially quite close the player, +/- 5km on y-axis and +/-20km on x-axis.

Well spotted! I guess this isn't so bad - if the ships are warping they still obey jobsfile spawning/building rules, and if the encounters are in their own file it should be a quick fix.

[Motör]

I realized the same. The difference is that i didnt get anywhere through a bug. I flew one hour in the wrong direction cause wasnt able to orientate and ...... thought there are always ships coming from there direction. So there must be a hidden gate, or a mainstation at least a giant puff. Because Bernd told us everything is part of the economic simulation. The problem with this spawning ships is you dt feel lonely in space. You feel like being at the stachus in Munich. It destroys atmosphere.

I believe, they make the ships spawning to make us feel this world is busy. Especially in the beginning the economic runs very small. Many stations miss needed ressources. Probably to give us players time to explore and build slowly. Even our trades give easier profits when everything is empty in the stations. But this is pure speculation. But so they need spawning ships in our enviroment to cheat the economy always running. And players shouldnt fly 250000km far, so why restrict spawning.

By the way. The systems have classical edges. you cant get 25000km far away. there is a blue wall at the radar. Thats itl.

[Liath]

Keep in mind that the game does start with *an* economy. Just like you have the ability to fly a ship right from the start, with guns and all in it.

While not as bad as X:R, X4 is in sad shape at launch, so I think what may have happened for you is that all of the ships spawned in the wrong spot for your game.

How the game proceeds from there I don't know. So far the economy feels too 'solid'. One of the things I liked in X2/3 was the utterly broken economy in the beginning of the game. Some items were basically gated by this, and you had to fix the economy to get a reliable supply of mid and high tier gear.

[MegaJohnny]

How the game proceeds from there I don't know. So far the economy feels too 'solid'. One of the things I liked in X2/3 was the utterly broken economy in the beginning of the game. Some items were basically gated by this, and you had to fix the economy to get a reliable supply of mid and high tier gear.

It's probably because the NPCs have to build their ships and equipment now, too. The materials have to be plentiful in order for them to have a steady supply of ships to smash together in big battles.

[Perahoky]

This is the code here.

As for others commenting, I feel like I am being ignored lol. I am explaining how it is done and some people are doubting me for no good reason. I already looked into the code. I am telling you exactly how it works.

Dont you think, some people are just writing negative stuff and hiting back because they are still angry due to some 4 years old mistake or just haters?

But it's ok to ask and test how far the economy is simulated and works. As in every X-Game.
So far i just hope there's no ecenomies dead end again. I Don't care about some ai ships getting spawned.

What i dont like is that weapons are strongly attached to ships and not constructed at factories.
That doesn't feel really "x-lly".
So i cannot build a big weapons factory, ship them to a carrier, equip the fighters and send them into a fight.

Complement:
i dont understand why Egosoft is using Xml files for data, content and savegames. Its so slow and has a big space overhead... i would use json.

[TempestZ]

There is still something weird going on with the deep space stuff. They are just too common. I was around 10.000 km going up and I was still seeing regular ships. I met a miner and scanned it, it had no orders, a few seconds it started a new order to go to grand exchange to mine gas. I was in sector north of Argon Prime. There was no gas around the area where I found him.

[Wou]

What i dont like is that weapons are strongly attached to ships and not constructed at factories.
That doesn't feel really "x-lly".
So i cannot build a big weapons factory, ship them to a carrier, equip the fighters and send them into a fight.

yeah, not a great fan of that either. You can't just keep some few extra weapons for a rainy day.
Or when you replace your fighter with a bigger fighter you can't just move the good stuff, you need to go back to the Dock that sells it.

[TempestZ]

So yea, md/encounters.xml

The ships you encounter 1000000km away are just spawns

Code: Select all

<library name="SelectEncounterManagement">
          <actions>
            <do_if value="$NewShip">
              <do_if value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'lone_plunderer'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Lone_Plunderer" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_if>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'resource_scout'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Resource_Scout_Low" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'lone_miner'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Lone_Miner" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'mining_group_small'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Mining_Group_Small" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'mining_group_large'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Mining_Group_Large" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'xenon_s_lone'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Xenon_S_Lone" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'xenon_s_group'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Xenon_S_Group" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'khaak_s_lone'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Khaak_S_Lone" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'khaak_s_group'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Khaak_S_Group" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
            </do_if>

[maxolina]

I guess their plan for the game was a fully simulated economy, however when the release date neared and they realized the bare-bones state the game was still in they had to come up with something quick and easy to make the universe seem populated.

I hope they keep working and expanding on this because I can see this eventually becoming the best X game ever made.!

[BlackRain]

So yea, md/encounters.xml

The ships you encounter 1000000km away are just spawns

Code: Select all

<library name="SelectEncounterManagement">
          <actions>
            <do_if value="$NewShip">
              <do_if value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'lone_plunderer'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Lone_Plunderer" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_if>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'resource_scout'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Resource_Scout_Low" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'lone_miner'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Lone_Miner" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'mining_group_small'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Mining_Group_Small" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'mining_group_large'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Mining_Group_Large" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'xenon_s_lone'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Xenon_S_Lone" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'xenon_s_group'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Xenon_S_Group" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'khaak_s_lone'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Khaak_S_Lone" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
              <do_elseif value="$NewShip.encounterid == 'khaak_s_group'">
                <signal_cue_instantly cue="Khaak_S_Group" param="$NewShip"/>
              </do_elseif>
            </do_if>

I guess this was made so that people who want to fly out forever still can encounter something out there. If you don't go out there then most likely these won't happen. Otherwise you would just be flying forever in nothingness?

[TempestZ]

Yes but I think deep space should be empty imo. Right now I think it's overdone, the encounters are a bit too common. They are set to around min: 20s and max 40s. They seem warp in front of the player just outside the radar range

[BlackRain]

Yes but I think deep space should be empty imo. Right now I think it's overdone, the encounters are a bit too common. They are set to around min: 20s and max 40s. They seem warp in front of the player just outside the radar range

Well, at least this is something that is easily removed through some simple file editing.

[conquestor]

Does this mean if I fly around out there for 40 hours straight, the game will have thousands of miners?

[BlackRain]

Does this mean if I fly around out there for 40 hours straight, the game will have thousands of miners?

Most likely those ships will disappear (destroy off). I doubt they will affect gameplay

[DragonEye501]

So, I'm about 26hrs into my game and I have yet to see any ships being built at shipyards despite them being full of wares. Whats restraining the factions from building more ships if they can according to the scripts?

[BlackRain]

So, I'm about 26hrs into my game and I have yet to see any ships being built at shipyards despite them being full of wares. Whats restraining the factions from building more ships if they can according to the scripts?

There is a quota, so if a faction already meets the quota, they won't build more ships.

[DragonEye501]

Ah, I see. I wish Factions would send out incursion forces just so ships would blow up and create a better sink for the economy. Oh and thanks for the quick reply Black Rain.