Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

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donzi
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Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by donzi »

Trade Mk3 being rolled into X3R/TC/AP I am wondering about updates in this initial thread.

Since playing through the plots in TC and observing my single Mk3 trader from birth to level 25 I decided to refresh my memory of how it differs from what I recalled in X3R. Seems for the most part they're both still quite flawed in the base/vanilla game after all this time.

Follwing are problem cases and notable differences among the different Trade Software Mk3 implementations. It's unknown if fixed versions can be expected for existing games but this information might help improve what, if any, Mk3 appears in Rebirth... Might help script/mod authors when writing alternative Mk3 type trader scripts, and lastly can help players better understand some of the things these Mk3 pilots are doing with their stuff.

X3AP: (Game: v2.5 - ST: 36.20 - LT: 24.20 - UT: xx)

(Case 1)
Emergency jump (feature of skilled enough Mk3 pilot) does not function.
(too bad the Mk3 apparently overrides the Advanced Jump feature as a so-so alternative ship work-around..)

(Misc)
  • Mk3 will trade in illegal wares, potentially loosing cargo and player money if scanned during delivery route (feature? assumed..) Unsure at this point if player police license at risk in TC/AP due to Mk3 actions (not at risk in X3R).
X3TC: (Game: v3.2b - ST: 36.20 - LT: 24.20 - UT: 24.20)

(Case 1)
The pilot sold some ore at a Tomahawk Heavy Missile factory. Then decided they wanted to buy some of the missiles*. I do not have the rep though.. So the pilot sits there 'buying' the missiles eventhough the station will not sell them because of my rep.

After waiting 5 minutes to see if it was just 'busy' I killed it and restarted the Mk3. Immediatly back trying to buy the Tomahawk missiles.

* It's unclear which deal was primary initially. Selling the ore then finding the missiles or if it saw a buyer for the missiles in argon space, saw the factory could use ore and took some for extra profit.

* However, since I repeatedly killed/restarted the Mk3 software in this sector, and it went for the Tomahawks each time (and hung there), it stands to reason that at this later point the missiles are being considered as the primary deal.

(Case 2)
I don't have top rep for Terran.. Most items are available, I am able to buy a Springblossum, yet some stuff is not available to me.

Level 25 Mk3 pilot hangs trying to buy prototype starburst shockwave cannons.. this ware is red to me. Restarting Mk3 repeatedly some 20 times got it to pick missiles once... made the trade, then back trying to buy PSSC. Stall..

Easily reproduced:

Do TC plot for Aldrin access without maxing terran rep.
Plop a fresh Mk3 (or whatever level you want) into aldrin sector and tell it to work as a 'sector trader' (with a range of 0 if an experienced Mk3).

(Differences)
  • Appears to be aware of and avoid pirate, khaak and xenon sectors out of the box. Not so in X3R version.
X3R: (Game: v2.5 - ST: 35.00 - UT: 17.00)

(Case 1)
I commonly observed the Mk3 going stupid on a ware and price. It found a stalled factory (output bin full) with a best price situation. It bought up all that could be carried and sold them elsewhere in the universe. It immediatly jumpped back to the same factory to buy more and bought none since the price went up after the previous purchase. It then moved on with other trades. Furthermore, the process above will happen even if buying the item a second time -is- a good deal. EG: buy 1 GPPC since that is all the EQ dock it's routed will take. Comes back to a 7 of 8 left factory, still profitable deal, but just docks and decides to move on.

(Case 2)
I have had to break the meatsteak cahoona loop a few times. I've witnessed up to 4 sequential trade runs by a level 25 UT, of buying 3 meatsteaks to sell at the trade station in Treasure Chest. Basically the UT pops into Treasure Chest and becomes a ST for as long as the IS cahoona loop lasts.

(Case 3)
Seems to get sector bound. I have a single level 25 Mk3 and I've watched it hang around a sector doing e-cell runs and other somewhat frivolous trades. There is without question better deals elsewhere in the universe it could be doing. Perhaps this is somehow related to the problem with the meatsteak loop?

(Case 4)
Ware purchase location sometimes illogical. Three SPP in sector, goes to fetch e-cells at the largest, yet furthest SPP. All in sector are at 12cr. In large sectors this can be a real slowdown and even a missed deal. Since it appears to be selecting destination via best buy software this could be just an inherited problem. Appears that intelligent looking 'choices' are just lucky. Assume this sort of thing may be present in TC and AP unless Mk3 does not use BB or the BB software has been changed.

(Differences)
  • After locating various similar ware + rep situations as those that caused trouble in X3TC I was unable to observe the Mk3 stall on a rep-disallowed ware or other rep related stall. Tested as noob and low level ST, beginner UT and level 25 UT.
  • Will create trades route into any sector with a station player could dock with. I am uncertain anymore, at one time IIRC the Mk3 was tied to a Sat network and could be influenced by the player by sat placement. Perhaps I am thinking of X2..
  • Low level UT will begin jumping to closest point, including sector center. Forgot about this one but noticed pretty quickly the center sector jump destinations were not present in TC.
  • TS Mk3 ship with level 25 UT pilot selling based on *player* / global F/F setting (?) and not Mk3 ship setting.
    UT purchase of spaceweed in legal (teladi) sector with destination route to pirate base in illegal (argon) sector. Mk3 ship is set with Pirates = Foe. Possible results lost money/ware if customs or police scan Mk3, loss of *player* police license for race Mk3 caught (I think), destruction of ship by hostile pirates/laser tower (unwitnessed as in my case I didn't have a recent save when I saw the Mk3 destination and turned the ship F/F to pirate friendly when it got ~15km). Unfortunately the Mk3 didn't get scanned so can't confirm license loss. Seems this could be the cause of unexplained losses of police license though..
    Update: Confirmed the goods lost when a Mk3 is scanned but no loss of police license or discernable amount of race rep. Tried a couple F/F things: Left F/F of Mk3 ship, also set global and broadcast and last tried just changing *player* ship to -- Pirate = enemy. No trouble with laser towers or docking. Unsure if existing Mk3 route overrides what I tried or if Mk3 just ignores F/F. (moved to differences as this is probably by design, unsure how it differs in other X games at present)
X2: (Game: v1.5 - ST: 34.10 - UT: 16.09)

(Case 1)
Level 13 Mk3 trader assigned with factory homebase. Factory credits were hovering around 100k cr with a 250k flush to player. Total credits from all factory and player was around 500k cr. The trader decided it found a deal on Beta PPC at a Boron PPC forge, which I have satisfied all rep related factors.. The BPPC were selling for just over 1 million. Pilot flew 2 sectors distance (despite e-cells and JD available) and docked realized he was a fool and moved on. I guess it's a plus that the Mk3 didn't just stall at the station though. ;)
Last edited by donzi on Wed, 3. Oct 12, 14:44, edited 12 times in total.
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by Nanook »

donzi wrote:...
The pilot sold some ore at a Tomahawk Heavy Missile factory. Then decided they wanted to buy some of the missiles. I do not have the rep though.. So the pilot sits there 'buying' the missiles eventhough the station will not sell them because of my rep..
Generally, the MK3 pilot needs to see a place to sell an item before they will buy it. Chances are, there are no locations that are offering a good price for those missiles, so the pilot goes into a wait mode.

And as far as I know, the MK3 traders don't operate based on your rep. After all, they'll buy jumpdrives by themselves even when the player can't. It's a known workaround for getting jumpdrives if your rep with those selling them is too low.
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Post by Karmaticdamage »

A difference between TC and AP. In TC if the trader is attacked it will emergency jump out. In AP they do not.
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by Da-V-Man »

Nanook wrote:And as far as I know, the MK3 traders don't operate based on your rep. After all, they'll buy jumpdrives by themselves even when the player can't. It's a known workaround for getting jumpdrives if your rep with those selling them is too low.
At what level/how long does it take for a Mk3 trader to buy a jumpdrive? Does this happen with the bonus pack CLS and CAGs as well?
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Post by Graaf »

Universe Trader only, and at level 12 iirc.

I always make sure to put one on the UT myself since delivery can be interrupted...
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by donzi »

Nanook wrote:Generally, the MK3 pilot needs to see a place to sell an item before they will buy it. Chances are, there are no locations that are offering a good price for those missiles, so the pilot goes into a wait mode.

And as far as I know, the MK3 traders don't operate based on your rep. After all, they'll buy jumpdrives by themselves even when the player can't. It's a known workaround for getting jumpdrives if your rep with those selling them is too low.
I see the forward looking behaviour in the X3R Mk3 too. Perhaps that is where the problem is.. Seeing a deal to queue based on prior location but not considering all locations before galvanizing the route. Then again, that doesn't fit with the failure on aldrin or the stop/restart with the tomahawk situation, as I elaborated on in the other thread.

IE: rep in argon allows Ore and sell some, also tomahawk and wants some. Mk3 see this and presumed to have checked argon rep.. But stops there.. or something.. not checking the downstream parts of the route for rep.

It must check player rep, after all if it doesn't factor rep it'd just fail all the time and be next to useless -or- be part of the cheat scripts package (if it were to be able to buy sell regardless of player rep).

I think the JD is a special case. It's part of the ship upgrades they do.. Automatic provisioning for hands off operation. Supposed to cost more too. I've always equipped the ships myself so not really sure what sort of premium.

In any event I wouldn't imagine that part of the provisioning functionality related at all to the buying and selling part. Hence just because it'll source me a JD if I am unable to myself, certainly doesn't equate to throwing out all the rep mechanics too. They are a big part of the whole game, Mk3 isn't just going to discard all that.

The other possibility I can think of is the fact that we're able to sell some wares (IE: certain missiles) to equipment docks despite them not being normally sold there and/or the player doesn't have the rep to buy them. Perhaps the new Mk3 is taking this quirk into account and it's actually causing these problems. Although that is great for dealing with loot from space it's not been adequatly considered in the Mk3 -- if that is what is the root of the problem.
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Post by donzi »

Karmaticdamage wrote:A difference between TC and AP. In TC if the trader is attacked it will emergency jump out. In AP they do not.
Interesting. I'd have figured the Mk3 would have been virtually untouched between TC and AP, for some reason.. I guess since AP requires TC, again for some reason.. :gruebel:

Are you certain it's the Mk3 and not a trader using a ship with built-in emergency jump options. Also this is sort of unclear to me through my own Mk3 + TC play. I've seen ships deploy drones and also attacked during their jump-oout sequence. I'd not really figured out if emergency jump was actually in the TC Mk3 or not because of the various factors and the lack of explicate "I emergency jumped to sector xx" messages.
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by pjknibbs »

donzi wrote: Will post when I get to X2 and if it's part of vanilla, forget and too lazy to check right now. ;)
Sort of. Even a fully-patched X2 only allows you to have sector traders--to get full universe traders you need the bonus pack installed.
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by donzi »

pjknibbs: Ah, thanks. Shame on me -- 2-3 clicks too many is really lazy on my part. :oops:
donzi wrote:The other possibility I can think of is the fact that we're able to sell some wares (IE: certain missiles) to equipment docks despite them not being normally sold there and/or the player doesn't have the rep to buy them. Perhaps the new Mk3 is taking this quirk into account and it's actually causing these problems. Although that is great for dealing with loot from space it's not been adequatly considered in the Mk3 -- if that is what is the root of the problem.
The more I think about this, it seems like the above could be a perfect match for the difficulty I've been seeing with Mk3 in X3TC.

..not trying to be redundant here, just trying to clarify to myself and anyone reading this speculation. If you happen to be aware of any other 'latitudes' than the two listed below that could be related, do tell.

Anyone who has played a little while probably has found that selling found loot does have some latitude. AFAIK this is a money making, loot disposal feature in all versions -- at least from X2 forward.

Two (at least) quite useful exceptions of 'normal' rules exist to help *player*:
  1. can sell items which are not normally sold at a station
  2. can sell items which player is unable to buy
The whole matrix of what wares and which stations I am unsure of. Most players will be familiar with selling off missiles though.

I -think- the Mk3 in X3R may use these *player* 'features' if the opportunity arises. This I base on a hazy reccollection of (old forum conversations) the Mk3 selling to trade stations and/or eq docs, wares which were not normally sold there. If correct, the X3R Mk3 implementation has not created any sort of obvious problem(s) as a result.

Perhaps the TC Mk3 has been enhanced to take more advantage of these undocumented trade opportunities or simply failed to fully translate these equivalent X3R portions of the script(s) if they exist.

Realistically, the 'undocumented trade opportunities' aka loot disposal is pefectly under control when it's used by *player* but certainly is more a challenge if trying to work into automation such as the Mk3.

I haven't been able to vision a clear way to test this specifically, but the aldrin stall I've described previously should be easy enough to recreate.

FYI: My observations are based on unmodified games, also no bonus pack use.

This thread isn't about work-arounds, etc but an investigation/comparison of 'out of box' base games.
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by Snafu_X3 »

donzi wrote: is the fact that we're able to sell some wares (IE: certain missiles) to equipment docks despite them not being normally sold there and/or the player doesn't have the rep to buy them.
FWIW AFAICR <player> has always been able to /sell/ stuff to a station (provided they can land there) regardless of rep limits; it's buying stuff where rep comes into force. However, Mk3 traders need to be a certain level before they'll trade at EQDs/TSs (see the guide - can't remember if it's the same for both or not), & they will only trade wares /they/ have picked up while running the Mk3 script, so preloading them with wares will not wiork (& uses up cargo space that could be used for stuff they /will/ trade). Oh, & they /must/ make a profit, so for testing purposes I'd suggest NPC trades are turned off (or even set to 'enemy of station'), & prices set at average-1 for most wares (eg tractor beams are pointless since there's nowhere that buys them)
FYI: My observations are based on unmodified games, also no bonus pack use.

This thread isn't about work-arounds, etc but an investigation/comparison of 'out of box' base games.
I appreciate your research WRT OoB games, but in this case the Bonus Pack provides the Dockware Manager script that will save you a lot of time by being able to change wares available from your TSs/EQDs automagically (ie without you having to fly back & transfer a ware manually). Once it's listed in the EQD/TS you can change its price as you wish.

If you don't want to use any other part of the BP then don't install the scripts (the option is available upon first use) or ignore them, but DWM will make your research a lot easier & affects no other part of the game
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by donzi »

Nanook wrote:
donzi wrote:...
The pilot sold some ore at a Tomahawk Heavy Missile factory. Then decided they wanted to buy some of the missiles. I do not have the rep though.. So the pilot sits there 'buying' the missiles eventhough the station will not sell them because of my rep..
Generally, the MK3 pilot needs to see a place to sell an item before they will buy it. Chances are, there are no locations that are offering a good price for those missiles, so the pilot goes into a wait mode.
Since I didn't respond specifically about this before.. Although I follow the deal making process you describe:

1. find (known) buyer in despirate need
2. look for best (known) source
3. connect the two
4. work in a side/complementary trade if possible

It sounds as if you reversed that logic "no locations that are offering a good price for those missiles" so it sits at an eager seller (of whom will not sell to him anyhow..) waiting for a buyer?

I see them in "Standby" mode when they've ehausted all deals, usually when running in ST mode. Is this the 'wait mode' you are referring to? ..or waiting on me to up my race rep so the guy will sell him the missiles he so despirately wants to buy? ;)

Some confusion on the Mk3 making the best deal is that sometimes it seems #3 and 4 flip around. Often it seems 4 is more important then 3.

One thing seems clear though, there is a LOT of time spent e-cell buying. Sometimes 5 mins to top off the supply by buying a paltry amount. ;)

I realize the bugger isn't perfect and understand it's probably intentional. In the long run with many of these guys I expect most people don't even notice much more than when they get destroyed and despite considerable waste they end up making money.

In the minimalistic game I have with 1 (or two in TC) Mk3 it's easy to spot some of this stuff.

Ultimately I can't quite see the connection of what you're saying since A) an unwilling seller is -not- a seller and B) waiting for a buyer to match up with a good purchase possibility isn't part of the Mk3 workflow AFAIK.

Keep in mind, as mentioned in both the missiles case and the aldrin case there -are- many other oppurtunities for the Mk3 they're ignoring in favor of these impossible ones.
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by donzi »

Snafu_X3 wrote:FWIW AFAICR <player> has always been able to /sell/ stuff to a station (provided they can land there) regardless of rep limits; it's buying stuff where rep comes into force.
AFAIK also. You worded it more clearly I think though. Thanks.
Snafu_X3 wrote:they will only trade wares /they/ have picked up while running the Mk3 script, so preloading them with wares will not wiork
AFAIK it's still possible, although most practical for ridding yourself of small volumes. Drones, e-cells (both a little different cases than normal wares) and other wares it later makes a deal with and stack into the preload. ..I know what you meant though. ;)

RE: DWM

I have 1 paranid ore mine to hold e-cells for me. Full ore hopper to keep it from blinking. Without BP I don't intend to do anything more with factories, let alone trade station or eq dock. Besides I am way too poor. ;)

I can hardly wait to get to the plateau of the vanilla game I want, so I can then make things easier. My primary objecttive though still remains to advance in vanillas to create a set of base starting sandbox games with the adornments of the plot(s). Logic is that I want to have them to fall back on with no/minimal worry of corruption, upgrades or digging up scripts in order to have plot rewards without doing it again or facilitated by other means.

It just happens also to lend itself to making observations and comparisons between games. Figured I'd just share / discuss findings as I plow along. Present goal of ~28 mil for the argon trade dock and only 20 mil shy. :) I think it'll be a little easier to manage the tala la delivery (IIRC) which follows that.

PS: To pull this back into some investigation, do you know if Mk3 is using this "<player> has always been able to /sell/ stuff to a station (provided they can land there) regardless of rep limit" to it's advantage?
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Re: Trade Command Mk3 - Quirks, Bugs and Variations among X Games

Post by Snafu_X3 »

donzi wrote:
Snafu_X3 wrote:they will only trade wares /they/ have picked up while running the Mk3 script, so preloading them with wares will not wiork
AFAIK it's still possible, although most practical for ridding yourself of small volumes. Drones, e-cells
I think you'll find that it's only trading stuff that it will pick up for itself; you could test this by (depending upon the level of trader) say removing its 25Mj shields (thus leaving shield bay(s) free) & teling it remotely to.. oh no that wouldn't work either :( Umm... OK. load it up with whatever you have in stock & see what it trades in.. but you've just done that, haven't you?

Sorry, it's too late/early & I've indulged in too much alcohol to think this through.. maybe tomorrow will be a better day :)
RE: DWM

[...]Without BP I don't intend to do anything more with factories, let alone trade station or eq dock. Besides I am way too poor. ;)
Unfortunately without your own TS or EQD I don't see how it's possible to continue your testing without RNG coming into play. With them you can set prices below average to see whether your Mk3s do as you expect or otherwise; without them you're reliant on NPC trades so you're not going to see that happen except with a lot of luck & a lot of time monitoring ships
I can hardly wait to get to the plateau of the vanilla game I want, so I can then make things easier. My primary objecttive though still remains to advance in vanillas to create a set of base starting sandbox games with the adornments of the plot(s). Logic is that I want to have them to fall back on with no/minimal worry of corruption, upgrades or digging up scripts in order to have plot rewards without doing it again or facilitated by other means.
I think you mean '/without/ the adornments..', but I suspect I know where you're going. You want to set up a 'base start' for each ..umm.. game start so you don't have to be bothered by the initial rushing around trying to get credits/avoiding enemies, yes? So if necesary the 'interesting times' bit can be avoided by a reload, & you can get on with what you decide /this/ new game should be like. Correct?

Not a bad idea. I think I still have a couple of pre-Hyp saves lying around from PP start. just in case I decide I'd like (eg) an overtuned Medusa P or some different marines rather than an overtuned Hyp, but I can't remember ever going back to them. The start is the most fun (as in a Dwarf Fortress definition); after that it becomes pretty much 'same old same old'.. until you start again :) However, YMMV!

I'd still advise installing BP though.. if nothing else MMD should make your (ship's) life easier, & since BP is an Ego recommended install (it's only not installed by default due to assorted copyright/legal reasons) there should be no problems there.. unless you're a journalist reviewing a genuine OoB experience :)

Oops - sorry, didn't spot your PS. Due to mental impairments noted above I'll coment later if necessary
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Post by Kockaspiton »

In my newest game in AP I have 3 UT-s, but they are rather lazy, they spend 90% of their time docked to a station in "Standby", regardless of the huge trade opportunities right under their noses. For example I had one docked doing nothing while there was a Sun Oil Refinery with like 10 flowers in stock, while 10km away there were a completely full Flower Farm in the same sector. No matter how many times I restarted it. (their home base is always filled with credits and I'm only hostile with the argon, and have the full universe explored). Am I doing something wrong? Game is vanilla.
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Post by RedEclipse »

Out-of-the-box MK3 in AP don't jump at level 25 when launching drones after an attack.

They first launch their mk1 drones (yup, mk1), then are blocked by the soverainty they have on drones.
If you make them manually jump when they launched their drones, you'll have the popup of something like "this ship is abandonning drones, would you still want to make it jump ? yes/no" and I guess this popup blocks the jump out.

All my mk3 are getting destroyed if I don't react very fast, I'm seriously considering dl-ing the new mk3 optimisation mod to fix that problem alone. Otherwise, I don't care waiting, this is passive "launch and forget" cashflow (when you managed to get it work).
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Post by donzi »

Snafu_X3:

RE: preloading Mk3 - I was thinking that maybe I'm remembering wrong or possibly an earlier script, or it's very iffy. Based on the probability the Mk3 sells the QTY it bought normally. The deals that fall through which leave ware freight in the ship or other oddity may revert to sell all QTY on-board. However I still think it'll use a manual e-cell injection fine and burp out all drones when in distress. ;)

RE: DWM etc, I will continue Mk3 testing with the advantage of more resources once I get to that point. EG: PHQ

RE: I think you mean '/without/ the adornments..' -- script wise, at this point. The objective is having acquired the yacht and get to the ~30mil for the trade dock (PHQ) and see if that is a reasonable stopping point.
Want my 'base' game to start something like: 1) pick the free M3+ of choice 2) deliver the station for the PHQ 3) pick where to build it. I may only be able to gather what is needed and store it to keep the choices open. ..or it may be that the base starting game will require gathering the rest of the supplies etc to get the PHQ. Depends on various things how far I can progress before galvanizing the vanilla game into a sandbox springboard archive.

Kockaspiton:

Although I have not played AP yet..

Are the UT all level 25?
..certain they are in UT mode?
Seems like they should be moving wares..

You may have better luck setting them to ST mode jump 0 in a good sector or LT with a good sector cluster with a short jump range (2-3).

Not sure if applicable anymore but in the past sometimes moving the Mk3 pilot into a new ship (then back to the previous ship if desired) would help with whacked Mk3 pilots.

RedEclipse:

In AP does the Mk3 automatically pick up their drones when the danger is past?

Seems particularly ate up they won't jump if they don't (gather up drones automatically) since they basically abandon them anyhow in X3R and IIRC TC.

Still quite silly anyhow since the drones are, to a large extent, a distraction to allow escape AFAIK. Is the ship at least seeking refuge at the nearest, dockable station?

In any event it is strange despite how drones are handled. It's assumed the main objective at hand is to survive and the JD with fuel is how to do it with the most certainty.


MISC:
Tried some hostile situations in X3R with a Mk3 (25) -- Occurred to me that there is some possibility the defenses are utilized in an order of sorts. Resulting in a seqnece like:

attacked..
have drones? (deployed IS or in cargo hold)
Y: deploy and fly to closest station and wait a bit
N: jump to queued seller in route, facing danger in attempt to jump if required

So maybe it's simply that the emergency jump potential of the Mk3 is actually the last thing it'll do.. Funny, if so since they have no problem jumping all over the place for other things which do not jepardize their ships. ;)

In a few quick tests and on naturally occuring escapes I'd witnessed the Mk3 has jumped to the station it intended to go to before the danger.

Further, in X3R, manually controlling the ship with the Mk3 pilot seems to -NOT- lend Mk3 pilot skills. Being attacked under manual control did not result in deployed drones or jumping.
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RedEclipse
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Post by RedEclipse »

donzi wrote:RedEclipse:

In AP does the Mk3 automatically pick up their drones when the danger is past?
Each time there is a danger they explode AFAIK so who knows. I'm using a Boron TS+ who have no turrets, I don't remember the name. They shouldn't buy any drones to begin with : they see one pirate they should automaticly jump away but they are dumb enough to think they will crush 2 M3 with 8 mkI drones.
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Alan Phipps
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Post by Alan Phipps »

In X3TC and if the the pilot is senior enough, the UT/LT when attacked will deploy drones (if carried) and then (try to) jump away leaving any drones behind until they time-out or are destroyed. If senior enough, the pilot will eventually replace the drones and jumpfuel.

In X3AP, the UT/LT jump away on attack is actually bugged/broken and so deploying drones is about the best you will get for now. Even if the ship survives and all enemies are killed, a TS or other ship with no free ship dock has no coded way of picking up the surviving drones automatically so they will try to follow and protect the ship until time-out. The jump away on attack bug has been reported so may hopefully be fixed in a future X3AP patch.
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RedEclipse
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Post by RedEclipse »

There is someone who made some MK3 optimisation, maybe using some more modern implementation of that algorithm, algorithm which is still unsolved (one of the 7 millenium math problem - #1 P vs NP, $1 million for the guy who fix the UT woohoo).

The link is here. When I asked the question gnasirator, the modder, said it was solved because he launchs drones in a new way.
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donzi
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Post by donzi »

I've begun an bare bones AP game now (although have scripted in some cash and rep to get straight the Mk3) and will digest and adjust the first post accordingly.

So far my first Mk3 is level 7 and limited to ST and LT w/0-1 radius.
It's acquired 4 drones on it's own and is using JD (I manually seed e-cells due to current sector placement) No jumping efficiency yet though.. IE: destination a few clicks from discovered N gate but jumped to S gate and flying north.

So far have seen no ware + rep related stalls as in TC. Seems full aware of which wares are 'red' and doesn't attempt to deal in them as a ST or LT operator.

Any comment, etc welcome. Particularly on known quirks and suggestions for problem situations -- and setting them up if possible. I'll train at least one Mk3 to level 25 and work with it for a while thereafter.

Aside from that, I'll be trying to allow natural evolution for the universe from here on out but my unfamiliarity with AP may lead me to tweak certain things for the sake of faster testing and not spoiling my future (first time) plot playthrough.

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