Why is the X3 copy protection such a big secret?

Crystalblood^ · Post by **Crystalblood^** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 13:45

Its a shame that the publishers want to ruin games with these intrusive copyprotections again... I remember it used to be bad during the C64 times, when the tape games were purposedly recorded with bad quality so that you couldn't copy them. The side effect was that it was often difficult to get the games working even when you have a legal copy; a little bit of dust on the read head, flex on the tape or drive motor, and the game doesnt work. And what was the solution to get these legally bought games working that the kid that I used to be used his last pennies to buy? A "pirate" copy from the neighbor, which is recorded with better quality. Plus that version uses a turbo loader which made the game load faster! Why didn't I spend my money on candy instead when the free version actually works and loads faster?

Today with Starforce things seem to be going back to that again. It may be the minority who have problems with it, but that is no reason to ignore them. I have skipped three games now because of Staforce (Silent Hunter 3, Trackmania Sunrise, GT Legends) and it seems X3 will be the fourth one, which is a shame since it seems like it could have been great. My only hope to get to play the game now is that the US version would use some other protection, and if so that I could order that version from somewhere at a reasonable price (I live in the EU). The last time I had Starforce on my system (Some demo installed it without telling me anything) I got a weird problem, every time I rebooted Windows found a new IDE channel which wasn't working according to the device manager. Remove staforce and the problem is gone. A slight annoyance, but enough to tell me that the stories of Starforce wrecking RAID arrays could very well be true. Not to mention the problems running these games in the 64bit version of Windows XP. I dont use it personally, but I might upgrade to Windows Vista next year when it comes, and that would mean any Starforce game I have would not work anymore. Yeah the Staforce people will propably make a Vista compatible driver, but the game publishers/developers aren't going to release patches for their old games anymore, most haven't done so for 64bit Windows XP either. I'd hate to have a game box in my shelf, knowing that it is a great game, I really want to play it now, but I cant because it doesn't run on my Windows version because of some copy protection.

Oh well, at least something good comes from Starforce too, that is I have already saved over 100 euros because of it

Barred · Post by **Barred** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 14:00

esd wrote:
Zanchito wrote:Starforce... Is your version DeepSilver's or Enlight's?
Deepsilver. Enlight's isn't out yet.

My pre-order states book as well

The version that I have is DeepSilver.

Shintai · Post by **Shintai** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 14:58

It´s along time since I bought a game, and no..I´m no pirate. But I have been playing MMO solely for the last year.

I tried installing and play one of my older starforce protected games on my x64 Windows since I´m bored right now. But Starforce fails and I can´t find any updates. Only thing with x64 and starforce is Farcry where they removed the protection on their x64 version.

My question is...will X3 with it´s starforce protection run on my x64 windows? Or do I have to wait for some new starforce?

I am really looking forward to play X3 as an elite alternative, but can I?

The_Abyss · Post by **The_Abyss** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 15:09

Starforce is already x64 ready, from version 3.5 IIRC.

MiSP · Post by **MiSP** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 15:11

Crystalblood^ wrote:Not to mention the problems running these games in the 64bit version of Windows XP. I dont use it personally, but I might upgrade to Windows Vista next year when it comes, and that would mean any Starforce game I have would not work anymore.

Doesn't StarForce work on 64-bit systems?

Shintai · Post by **Shintai** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 15:19

Yes, but the problem is, sofar I read on www.star-force.com aswell as getting help there. That both the developer needs to code it to use x64 aswell as using starforce v3.5+.

So the question is twofold, does X3 use starforce 3.5+ and does the implementation in X3 support x64.

The_Abyss · Post by **The_Abyss** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 15:22

You should ask the relevant publisher. But from preview builds, yes the Starforce version is higher than 3.5.0

Mopy · Post by **Mopy** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 15:31

Protect.dll that comes with the Deepsilver version says it's version 3.5.10.6

Shintai · Post by **Shintai** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 15:41

Mopy wrote:Protect.dll that comes with the Deepsilver version says it's version 3.5.10.6

Sweet..then I can go pick it up tomorrow

HawK53 · Post by **HawK53** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 15:52

Hi all
not been here for awhile..
Well I have 2 starforce protectedgames already GTR + GTL, and never had anytrouble with starforce, please do not beliefe these cowboystories, i run it with Alcohol120% with a virtual DVD in the drive and SF never stopped me from playing
Trouble can arise when you have/had star****er/nuker (or whatever its name is) on your system before, or by having a very old DVD drive..
but there always is very good support from Starforce if you need it

Hopefully my copy arrives with the mailman tomorrow I can't wait

Jasper · Post by **Jasper** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 16:31

While I understand the publisher feels the need to protect their investment, I also feel the need to protect mine.

Starforce in the past has messed up my systems, I do and have run raid/scsi disks in the past. So I am very reluctant to let them have any more shots at my system.

But the need to protect my investment really hit home two nights ago when my CDROM drive decided it was time to die in a major way. When I placed my cd in the drive, the drive made a horrid grinding noise and literally broke the CD into many many pieces. Luckily it was not my new X3 CD which I have not received yet.

I ordered the CDROM version from Gogamer, we will see what protection scheme it has, hopefully one that will let me protect my investment, not just in money but also my time.

Jasper

Zanchito · Post by **Zanchito** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 17:22

I had a CD explosion once too. Mechwarrior 4. Since then I always make backups (it is legal here as long as you own the original, of course).

Barred · Post by **Barred** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 17:25

In reply to the threads title "Why is......."

I now have the answer

To take peoples minds off the bugs

Da_Junka · Post by **Da_Junka** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 18:49

Zanchito wrote:Thank you so very much for the information!

I guess it was to be expected that DeepSilver would use Starforce, I read somewhere they had a contract for so many titles or somesuch, so they don't really have a choice anyways.

So, I wanna preorder from Enlight as soon as possible, but i'm in Europe. Does anyone know how to do it? Any online shop that would send the american version here? I fear Amazon will just deliver the british version.

Thank you in advance.

............................................................
I will be ordering the Enlight un-starforce-virus version from the link below. I have used them often and are totally reliable.
http://www.sps-systems.co.uk/index2.htm

Deep Silver must be barmey daft up a tree to use SF, don't they know how many sales they are about to lose?

Stealth · Post by **Stealth** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 19:19

To shortly comment on the Starfarce interview's summary: The article's author needs a reality check. FreeSpace and Fallout didn't drop out of the bin because of the massive clonin of the games, that was the mess created by Interplay who weren't competent enough to keep the game studios running. The number and quality of games did diminish, but NOT because of piracy - it's because of the lack of imagination, innovation and creativity in the game studios - after all, there's only so many FPSes you can create without having a worn-out story with high graphical content and zero replayability.

The moral of the story is, don't take things at face value, especially in this case. I've been a gamer since the days of the old Commodore 64 (both tape-drive and FDD) - that doesn't give me much leverage in saying I know best, but I've witnessed some of the finest moments in game development. Rare came in the past two/three years, and copy-protection's not to blame.

MiSP · Post by **MiSP** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 19:19

Da_Junka wrote:I will be ordering the Enlight un-starforce-virus version from the link below. I have used them often and are totally reliable.
http://www.sps-systems.co.uk/index2.htm

Deep Silver must be barmey daft up a tree to use SF, don't they know how many sales they are about to lose?

They are? They don't show... The site looks really amateur-ish!

Shintai · Post by **Shintai** » Thu, 27. Oct 05, 19:53

The interview with the starforce makers lacks quite a few things. no wonder..it´s a commercial push. Also when checking I haven´t seen any starforce game NOT cracked yet.

However I don´t favour piracy, and I wont do it myself. However when a X3 crack comes out I will use it on my original installation and remove the starforce drivers.

Starforce have still some serious issues with anything that is between an application and the files. This is usually seen as AV programs and other tools. Starforce is always behind and there is always alot of things it´s incompatible with.

Also the second part is more future oriented. When I tried looking for patches for my pre SF v3.5 games I can´t seem to find any, cept for 1 game. It´s the developers that need to make these patches, not the starforce makers. And updating the drivers alone doesn´t do the trick. So I have a few useless games with SF protection now, since they will never get to work on my x64 Windows. Tho the games without starforce protection would work just fine. But hey..a few cracks solved that issue.

My point is, why do we LEGAL buyers always get screwed

Starforce is a blind faith protection, it usually only buys them hours. SecuRom7 seems to be alot harder than SF. And they don´t have drivers that mess up your system and prevent any future changes.

Anyone know if Enlight is for release in the US only? Else it could be alternative as second copy so you didn´t need a crack to remove the SF infestion.

DJSoulJammer · Post by **DJSoulJammer** » Fri, 28. Oct 05, 04:23

Damn even here Deepsilver suply the game , hmmm use the removal tool for SF .

Avis · Post by **Avis** » Fri, 28. Oct 05, 04:39

just want to point out mention or condoning of the use of cracked exes is against the law in the hosts country and consequently explicitly against forum rules.

sq_paradox · Post by **sq_paradox** » Fri, 28. Oct 05, 04:49

Shintai wrote:SecuRom7 seems to be alot harder than SF.

Ah, but Securom 7 is brand new, and has definently taken a page out of Starforce's book. It is just as highly invasive, even though it doesn't install drivers. Most people I with both I have heard talking it say that Securom 7 is worse then Starforce. If you want some proof go to the relicnews.com forums and look at the amount of trouble people are having getting Dawn of War: Winter Assault to work. It claims the game installation is "corrupt", and it all stems from the copy protection.

However, unlike Starforce, I haven't heard any instances of Securom 7 breaking anyones computer; so it does have that on its side.

egosoft.com

egosoft.com

Why is the X3 copy protection such a big secret?

Worried about starforce and x64 compatibility...