Defence Platforms w/ Admin Module - How to use launch tube?

[Duncaroos]

The administration module has both S and M launch tubes. I get the S tubes are used by the Defense Drones in the event of an attack (sucks you can't set the station to be aggressive / non-defensive only, but I digress), but the M tubes are a mystery. I assign a couple of M-class corvettes to a defense wing, manually put them into dock, then put them into internal storage. If I command them to fly to a position, or attack targets within range - the ships just use the normal dock to exit and don't utilize the tubes.

• How to make use of these tubes properly? Does it have to be an actual attack command?
• How to set subordinate defense fleets to dock when idle / setting rules of engagement (i.e. launch against fighters, not capitals)?

[Virtualaughing]

My theory is that the Station Manager "manages" these things. The idea is behind the manager that they doing minor things so we don't have to. On the Map Loadout Tab we already have plenty of options for the station turrets. Selecting in between those may make the "life" of the drones easier.

[taztaz502]

The administration module has both S and M launch tubes. I get the S tubes are used by the Defense Drones in the event of an attack (sucks you can't set the station to be aggressive / non-defensive only, but I digress), but the M tubes are a mystery. I assign a couple of M-class corvettes to a defense wing, manually put them into dock, then put them into internal storage. If I command them to fly to a position, or attack targets within range - the ships just use the normal dock to exit and don't utilize the tubes.

• How to make use of these tubes properly? Does it have to be an actual attack command?
• How to set subordinate defense fleets to dock when idle / setting rules of engagement (i.e. launch against fighters, not capitals)?

You can't set station subordinates to dock like you can with carriers right now so they just fly around like headless chickens (They used to do this on carriers before egosoft fixed it). Your best bet is just to park a carrier close to your defence station and hopefully egosoft add the same carrier logic to stations.

Secondly i've never noticed launch tubes on any station modules.

[Duncaroos]

It's only on the Admin Modules. Example: Split Module has 3 M-tubes and I think 6-S tubes

[Duncaroos]

My theory is that the Station Manager "manages" these things. The idea is behind the manager that they doing minor things so we don't have to. On the Map Loadout Tab we already have plenty of options for the station turrets. Selecting in between those may make the "life" of the drones easier.

Unfortunately the defense wings are constantly flying around, so any non-drone ships really do not use these launch tubes automatically. I managed to get them to use it only when I specially do an attack command on a specific enemy (not attack targets in range - this doesn't work) and they launch through the tube, but there is no way I can see to have these defense ships docked until needed; this is to protect the ships from undue harm / no clutter the space, for example a Xenon I that comes in where S/M ships under AI control have no chance unless you have like 50 of them. Stations, especially one with Admin Modules, should have more options for military subordinates (like attack, intercept, bombard, etc.).

[j.harshaw]

Ships should already prefer launch tubes if undocking from internal storage to Attack. Added Attack targets in range. Should be in a future update.

[Y-llian]

Ships should already prefer launch tubes if undocking from internal storage to Attack. Added Attack targets in range. Should be in a future update.

Thank you. Just to confirm, does this mean that subordinates will remain docked until they spot an enemy? And once done, will they redock?

I think many of us have wanted our defence stations to work like static carriers. Rearming and repair would be an added bonus but personally, I’d prefer they use resources for that. This will force the player to develop supply lines for the territory they intend to claim / hold i.e. it’s a ‘think’ element.

[j.harshaw]

We're talking about when ships use launch tubes, not whether ships stay docked.

And yes, we're aware that some members of the community want ships to stay docked at stations and launch to respond to threats. That was shot down a while back since there's nothing preventing players from assigning so many ships to stations that all docks and internal storage are filled rendering the station non-functional. And no, "I know the limits, I'll be good" isn't good enough.

[Y-llian]

Ok. Understood.

[Duncaroos]

Ships should already prefer launch tubes if undocking from internal storage to Attack. Added Attack targets in range. Should be in a future update.

Yup confirmed after I tried out a few commands earlier last week. Thanks!!!! Marvelous

[Duncaroos]

That was shot down a while back since there's nothing preventing players from assigning so many ships to stations that all docks and internal storage are filled rendering the station non-functional. And no, "I know the limits, I'll be good" isn't good enough.

Thanks for the context. I can see how that case would mess up stations, especially where production modules and admin modules are on the same plot.

I'll have to work around this fact

[LameFox]

That was shot down a while back since there's nothing preventing players from assigning so many ships to stations that all docks and internal storage are filled rendering the station non-functional. And no, "I know the limits, I'll be good" isn't good enough.

This is... weird? I mean you let us do this on purpose; people regularly report it as a tactic to plug up AI shipyards and wharves they don't want building. But it's too far if we can do it to ourselves by accident?

[GCU Grey Area]

This is... weird? I mean you let us do this on purpose; people regularly report it as a tactic to plug up AI shipyards and wharves they don't want building. But it's too far if we can do it to ourselves by accident?

Makes sense to me. Someone who does this deliberately to an NPC station is not going to get frustrated when their plan works exactly as intended, whereas someone else who did this by accident to their own station may well get frustrated not knowing why their station has stopped working. Avoiding a potential source of frustration for players seems like a sensible thing to do.

[LameFox]

This is... weird? I mean you let us do this on purpose; people regularly report it as a tactic to plug up AI shipyards and wharves they don't want building. But it's too far if we can do it to ourselves by accident?

Makes sense to me. Someone who does this deliberately to an NPC station is not going to get frustrated when their plan works exactly as intended, whereas someone else who did this by accident to their own station may well get frustrated not knowing why their station has stopped working. Avoiding a potential source of frustration for players seems like a sensible thing to do.

On the scale of things people can accidentally screw up, "I left too many ships docked" seems incredibly trivial to resolve. It's like setting up your trade prices or blacklists wrong and finding your ships don't do what you intended. I wouldn't want to be deprived of those functions just because someone could make an easily reversible mistake with them.

edit: and consider the kind of things you *are* allowed to screw up. This game lets you start deconstructing docks with your ships in them and then just deletes the ships.

[Eyeklops]

We're talking about when ships use launch tubes, not whether ships stay docked.

And yes, we're aware that some members of the community want ships to stay docked at stations and launch to respond to threats. That was shot down a while back since there's nothing preventing players from assigning so many ships to stations that all docks and internal storage are filled rendering the station non-functional. And no, "I know the limits, I'll be good" isn't good enough.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but would the benefits of figuring out carrier dock/undock logic for station defense ships be an increase game performance? Would eliminating defense ships from the active map and stowing them into station storage be less to simulate?

Could the player be allowed to dedicate some percentage (maybe limit to 50%?) of the available ship S & M internal storage to "defense" units. These units would function on carrier dock/undock logic. Once the 50% quota is met any remaining ships function as the do currently, patrolling around the station.

I make no assumptions that this would be an easy task to code or implement, or that there still isn't another obstacle. It was just basic idea proposal.

[j.harshaw]

increase game performance?

If we're still talking about fighters, won't expect much since the expensive bit they do is combat and you'll still expect them to fight when they currently do. The gains could be significant if they could be folded into a single inert number when docked which is what defence drones do but isn't an option in X4 with ships with arbitrary loadouts and pilots. Might save some GPU power, but I expect most of the load going into that with player stations are the stations themselves. The gains would be in areas that aren't bottlenecked.

[Scoob]

You know, I've not once noticed a Ship use Launch Tubes to deploy, I wasn't aware that they ever did. I thought they were 100% Drones only. Now, ships like the Colossus Carrier does use its launch tubes to GREAT effect of course, but ships like the Nomad Support Ship do not.

I actually "Cheat" by using a third-party mod to have Station-based Fighters launch as needed. It really is rather cool to see a Station deploy a load of FIGHTERS rather than Drones.

As an aside, if I have Fighters assigned in a Defence Role on a Station, said station does not appear to deployed Combat Drones at all.

The best vanilla use in my view is to ensure that your Defence Platforms also have an S/M Ship Maintenance Bay fitted. Keep it supplied - easy with closed-loop - and subordinate fighters will dock to repair and rearm, greatly improving their effectiveness and survival chances. Sure, they stay deployed except when returning to repair and rearm, which mean they can still be mopped up by targets they're not equipped to fight, but it works quite well none the less.

I would love to see a special Station module that allows a Station to behave more like a Carrier. I.e. Fighters stay DOCKED between sorties if on Intercept duty, attack only Capitals on Bombard etc. I use to use Carriers a LOT, but they're a later-game option for me - I like to build my own - whereas a well-placed defence platform can be a game-changer relatively early. Being able to enhance it to make it smarter with more asset deployment options would be dead cool. Imagine a station where you could set patrol zones for specific wings like you do with Carriers? A heavily-armed station able to project its power further would be epic - both when utilised by the Player AND by other Factions.