Query: Station assigned Freighters sector range

[Scoob]

Hey all,

I'm currently using version 2.2 Beta 3, but wanted to double check with people if an issue I'm experiencing is in the current release version 2.0.

Basically, I started a fresh game in 2.0 Release, but only got around to assigning Freighters to my station after 2.2 was applied.

So, as I capture / find most of my ships, I had two M-Class Tern Vanguard Freighters I'd assigned Captains to that were basically zero stars. I manually traded with these guys for many many hours while doing other things, but they didn't even gain their first star doing this. Anyway, as production at my station had been going well and I had a good stock of Microchips - massively in demand in my game - I assigned these two Freighters to trade for my station, but they just sat there unmoving other than to undock. Checking their orders it seems they had a 1 gate limit due to their low-level, so were unable to get to any buyers. That's a bit rubbish, as flying through a gate is hardly a significant skill!

As a result of this, I bit the bullet and cheesed buying two poverty-spec S-Class ships just for their skilled Captains. I got lucky, I thought, and gained a 3.5 Star Captain and a 4 Star. Nice. After some juggling around, the two Tern Vanguard Freighters gained experienced Captains, and I re-assigned them to Trade for my station. However, once more they just sat there idle. Looking more closely, I see these 3.5 and 4 star Captains have a sector range of just Four, which is NOTHING. This is not enough to get them near the profitable trade locations - or even a single buyer it seems.

My question is, was this MASSIVE skill-related range limitation a 2.0 thing, or is it new to 2.2 as I suspect? In my Prior 1.6 game, which I abandoned due to performance issues, I had low-level Captains selling wares from my Station all over, without issue. Now however, if I were to load that game, my entire transport infrastructure would be BROKEN. I don't know how such a change could be introduced, as it's going to cripple most peoples games in progress if the use station-assigned ships.

I'm aware that Manager level has an impact on subordinate performance and that my Manager on this station is only one star - though not quite one star in Management. This is despite this Manager having worked on my station for many hours (likely a real-world day almost) so I wonder if I need to cheese myself a Manager too, if that's possible.

Anyway, I was just looking for feedback on this, as if this is a 2.2 change then people are in for a MASSIVE shock if they try to continue their current saves and expect their empire to be running as smoothly as it was before. Even in my prior long-term game, none of my Captains were that experienced - experience gain is sloooooooowwwww - so that game is unworkable, even if its performance hadn't dropped.

Scoob.

[Alan Phipps]

You should read this thread.

[Scoob]

You should read this thread.

Thanks, I'll have read now...

Edit: Ok, I've had a read and it confirms what I'm seeing. However, I'm utterly stunned by this change as it really is a game-breaker for me, and I suspect many others. I was ok with the mining changes at first with a "free miner" (no station assignment) being quite limited and needing manual intervention for selling. That sorta made sense as they were working alone. However, once assigned to a station - having gained some experience - they still sucked. So, I had to "train" them some more with manual mine and sell to my own station for several more hours. That got a bit old.

For this range limitation to also apply to station-assigned Freighter is daft, the whole point of them is carrying goods over longer distances so NPC's don't have to come to you. Does this limit apply also to ships not owned by the player? If so, it'd explain why the economy is stalling as goods are simply not getting to their destinations, despite ample supply.

I'm really rather frustrating by this change. The game's performance has been improving, with my current game - started in 2.0 - not suffering the same substantial slow-down by prior game did, despite comparable fleet-size and overall assets. However, one of the more fun elements for me - seeing my Freighters roaming far and wide shipping goods - is gone.

My lack of time to play, and a subsequent restart soon followed by a new Beta, meant I missed the impact of this change right away.

Scoob.

[radcapricorn]

Take the below with a pound of salt, as I've yet to start my own station business, but:

Looking at the map, 5 gate limit doesn't seem that low. Heck, even the low-end 3 gates cover good ground. It does limit choices in starting a business with inexperienced crew, but that's about it.
I see, at the moment at least, a much bigger problem in training pilots up rather than in distance limit. And, the one thing we wouldn't be able to do is ferry wares all the way between the extremes of the map, but I suspect they have something planned for this in the future.

[GCU Grey Area]

From what I can tell Management is the key skill which determines ship range for station-based freighters & miners - i.e. a 5* manager can give a ship with a 1* captain a 5 gate range. It appears in testing a high level pilot can override the range limit of a poor manager, though it is also possible a crap manager might not be good at selecting good trades, even if they have a ship with the range to conduct it (not sure yet how to test that last bit, it is speculation).

Furthermore, it has proved considerably easier to generate high level mangers than pilots in my game - a 1* manager (ex-service crew) reached 5* after around 2 days managing an 8x Smart Chip production complex located in close proximity to MIN shipyard & wharf, both of which needed large amounts of them. Think level gain for managers may be a consequence of number of trades and/or profitability of those trades. In contrast most of my pilots aren't all that much better than when I hired them (& had some of them for well over a week).

[Scoob]

Ships that aren't assigned to a station having a low Sector range limit isn't quite so restricting as, from what I've seen with my autominers, they'll mine a sector, travel no more than n sectors to sell, then they'll travel another n sectors to another resource area etc. I assume Autotraders are much the same. When however, a ship is assigned to a Station, it's tied to a static point so it's always n sectors from that station, never n sectors from where you were last.

Observing my autominers, sometimes they'd get stuck when they'd mine an area, travel a few sectors to sell, mine the same / a new area and not be able to sell within their current max range. it's then I'd issue a manual command to sell.

I firmly believe that Station-assigned ships at least should have a more generous maximum range. Perhaps have Manager skill multiplied by Captain skill to work it out, or a variation (0.5x Manage skill x 0.5x Captain skill) of that. If a skilled manager provided a decent bonus to a Captain than that'd work better in my view. A weak Manager cannot enhance a Captain at all, but he'd equally not hold the Captains back. A good manager however would enhance things.

I don't really get the sector limits at all really if I'm honest, it seems a silly artificial limitation to link to skill. Speed of work would be a good one to use, even quality of work in regards to getting the best price / distance away ratio right. It's fine a station-assigned freighter captain getting the "best" price for a ware, but if there's an over stock and he could have made three runs at a slightly cheaper price in the same time...well, when talking profits per hour one of those is the smarter choice.

I do hope this is looked into and refined a little better as the current implementation is unworkable for me. Indeed, I basically quit play to do other things this eve it annoyed me so much. I've no plans to play over the weekend unless there's some way around this, likely mod-based.

Scoob.

[GCU Grey Area]

Perfectly happy with the range limits myself, particularly since I worked out how to train good managers. Build near the centre of the map & a 5* manager can send ships almost everywhere, build right on the edge of the map & there's still around half the map within range. If the limits were much higher there would effectively be no limit at all & consequently less Think about where to build different types of complex. Stations for purely local consumption, e.g. food, are fine on the fringes (not going to sell much Nostrop to the Argons or Paranids anyway), whereas ship-building components really benefit from a central location in order to be able to reach all of the shipyards.

[pref]

Build near the centre of the map & a 5* manager can send ships almost everywhere,
..
no limit at all & consequently less Think about where to build different types of complex.

There isn't that much "think" about having to place production in a central sector. This limit just reduces the think part, and makes lots of empire configurations simply unworkable.

If the limit was implemented along with some solutions like XR warehouses, or X3 CLS scripts then it would be fine - but without it the whole thing just means you have to build several same smaller stations, do the same config for each, repetitive copy paste config.

And as relations change with races during a playthrough having to spread production can be a bigger problem. I bet you play all peaceful scenarios only, but that's just your preference.

There is much more think in creating a good and effective logistical network, having resource miners somewhere close to resources, high-end production somewhere else where no one can hurt you, and having ships which are set up to keep own ship production going, move wares between your stations, supply your chosen races, and others that just make cash.
Having to count to 5 (even if 5 is a bit ambiguous concerning pathing) hasn't much to do with think.