X-Tended -Terran Conflict V2.2 Released. [06/09/2013] (X3:AP prototype available)

The place to discuss scripting and game modifications for X³: Terran Conflict and X³: Albion Prelude.

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Requiemfang
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Post by Requiemfang »

missing ships, plots, all the works, also some ships aren't complete yet and still need to be worked on and completed. Imo ships with wrong stats, not enough shields an hull amounts ect, ect.

course some of this can be rectified by a mod if you know what you are doing.

Gotta get around to the hull mod I did for v1.1 and update it to v1.2 at some point.
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X2-Eliah
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Post by X2-Eliah »

Missing ships will be completed, ofc. As for stats... well, that depends on if we see that as a bug or not, opinions can differ, you know (especially on balancing) :) The plots, we'll get as much done as we physically can, same with scripts - most missing things (if not all) will be done for 2.0..

Along with some (imo massive) new stuff - There's a reason we're working on 2.0 and not 1.3 ;)

So, yes, we're trying to make 2.0 as complete as we can - ofc there can be bugs and stuff we missed - that happens to the best game companies (see all the patches etc.), and we're no less human than those devs are ^^ But getting 2.0 out before Rebirth is a very, very strict goal for us :)

I think that's as much as I would reasonably be allowed to say :roll:

Ofc we'd appreciate any reports on obviously-wrong ship stats (like 10 hull instead of 10000), just to make sure we are aware of these ;)
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Aragon Speed
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Post by Aragon Speed »

Sorkvild wrote:So... 2.0 will be complete mod with all the missing ships and plugin features ?
Yes, and a bit more as well. ;)
Requiemfang
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Post by Requiemfang »

hmmm OTAS TM class ship I can see sticks out like a sore thumb, though I know you guys probably already know about that lol has less shields compared to the other races TMs

One of the pirate destroyer stats are really low, don't know about shields but it's hull is low, think it's same for the secondary pirate carrier as well :P

don't get me started... I have a WHOLE list of things you guys probably already know about with ships that need fixing and balancing. Which I believe I've reported over at the forums
chris_1979
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Post by chris_1979 »

So you want some unbalanced ships?? Sure!

Pirate Polacca is worth as much as frigate or heavy m6 (this might not be a problem to you, because you think capping them shouldn't be too rewarding but think when you actually build them in your shipyard...... and the corresponding resource costs and build time)

The pirate morrigu is way unbalanced as yet again this one costs as much as a heavy m6 or small frigate.

The K and J don't really matter to me, these are as cheap as a cheap m6. But you really need to do something to get these ships armed, so mass producing them is useless anyway.

In fact i've just looked up that the polacca m2 is cheaper then the tepukai m7. I believe it was something like 23 ml credits selling value. Which is ofcourse ridiculous.

You might argue that pirates have exotic ways of creating their ships and equipment, but even these super intelligent and innovative (and super cheap as it seems) people would take an m2 over an m7 any day.

Now i said i didn't see too much problems with the xenon capital ships being far too cheap. thinking well computers can make things cheap as they really don't need any luxury. That thing has to fly and shoot. It doesn't need any panels, sanitation, comfort of pilot seats or a kitchen or whatever. But what does bother me is the short build time of the xenon ships. I mean a xenon J is like 13Ml credits. Thats a small corvette ship. These things produce in no time. A K is double the amount i believe. A small frigate.

So even if it doesn't matter cost wise, it does matter that these things build in no time.
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Killjaeden
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Post by Killjaeden »

the prices are not yet adjusted. The xenon prices are still vanilla, so blame ES for them :P To be more precise, the xenon prices are still vanilla reunion :)
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chris_1979
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Post by chris_1979 »

Maybe this next one is vanilla too, but the xenon J and K have odd shield power generator values. The J has 3 times the shield generator power output. 15000 vs 5000 Mw. The Morigu and polacca too. The morigu has 8200 i believe and the polacca 5000 Mw

Now here is something i don't really understand. In description it says that all these changes should work seemlesly together. Now thats where i do not understand why the factory ships can produce any weapon (by some sort of reverse engineering) and the factory stations cannot. Would it be nice if the factory ships would actually tax you for reverse engineering a weapon and the factory stations would have a command to reverse engineer a weapon and customise its production accordingly, having it cost some big bucks too.

I mean reverse engineering being far more costly then actually aquiring a license from a friendly race, as i can't imagine researching it yourself being as costly as purchasing a license.

I mean this seems like 2 different mods thrown into the plot and they work entirely different. It could also be nice if the factory would produce some hidden non existent prototype weapon which requires massive amounts of resources, remove that product when it finishes and change to the final assembly line of the new product. The result being that producing xenon weapons becomes a challenge and now just throwing 10 million credits at it and their tech is yours.
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Sartorie
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Post by Sartorie »

chris_1979 wrote:Now thats where i do not understand why the factory ships can produce any weapon (by some sort of reverse engineering) and the factory stations cannot.

It could also be nice if the factory would produce some hidden non existent prototype weapon which requires massive amounts of resources, remove that product when it finishes and change to the final assembly line of the new product.
stationary factories require licenses being bought, mobile factories are more flexible - thats a design decisions we made and will not change ;) next you want crystal free spps too :D

also this is not a player-centric mod therefore research & development is a no-go, it just does not fit in there at all
chris_1979
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Post by chris_1979 »

Sartorie wrote:stationary factories require licenses being bought, mobile factories are more flexible - thats a design decisions we made and will not change ;) next you want crystal free spps too :D

also this is not a player-centric mod therefore research & development is a no-go, it just does not fit in there at all
Well i understand and i respect that. I believe it to be an answered question then. And as there is only one race on which such a system would actually make a difference, as you can appease any race, aquire their weapons and missile licenses, build factories and then afterwards declare all out war against that race, and the factories don't lose their "license". But keep producing their wares........

Well it's not that great a deal. I believe flying around in stolen xenon ships with stolen xenon weapons and missiles is a niche market anyway and i've not seen many non xenon npc flying around in them xenon ships. So if thats a big deal then thats already very player centric. Also being able to create race relationships which are unbound from your own race seems player centric or at least, as if your race only accounts for a specific game start and is flexible/irrelevant afterwards. [edit] But maybe that changes in hardcore dificulty mode right...

But i respect your answer, good day.
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X2-Eliah
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Post by X2-Eliah »

Also being able to create race relationships which are unbound from your own race seems player centric or at least, as if your race only accounts for a specific game start and is flexible/irrelevant afterwards.
Hey, don't blame us for sticking to a hardcoded core design framework of the X games ;) You are still an individual, not a political power or government - that's simply how the entire X engine is written. This is not about player centric or not, this is simply about how the game itself works like. If you couldn't change your reputation to any race, then what purpose is there to any reputation system at all - why not have permanent 'hostile/nonhostile' division instead, eh? And if your actions alone could change the entire relationship of two races - well, isn't that horribly player-centric, placing the player on a key decisionmaking role of an entire race?

I hope we don't have to explain why such a choice is not considered appropriate...
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Sartorie
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Post by Sartorie »

I think there is a misunderstanding as to why we introduced these "licenses" for weapon / etc. production - the sole purpose is this : we did not felt like defining 200+ additional factories for this stuff and let players scroll trough heaps of those on shipyards ;)
chris_1979
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Post by chris_1979 »

X2-Eliah wrote:
Also being able to create race relationships which are unbound from your own race seems player centric or at least, as if your race only accounts for a specific game start and is flexible/irrelevant afterwards.
Hey, don't blame us for sticking to a hardcoded core design framework of the X games ;) You are still an individual, not a political power or government - that's simply how the entire X engine is written. This is not about player centric or not, this is simply about how the game itself works like. If you couldn't change your reputation to any race, then what purpose is there to any reputation system at all - why not have permanent 'hostile/nonhostile' division instead, eh? And if your actions alone could change the entire relationship of two races - well, isn't that horribly player-centric, placing the player on a key decisionmaking role of an entire race?

I hope we don't have to explain why such a choice is not considered appropriate...
Then explain to me how i can be friends with both split and paranid. Doesn't anyone hate me for being friends with the enemy?? Actually i'm everyones heroe. One might think that being the hero of the enemy might make you our arch enemy.

Actually you do what you are good at and i'm enjoying it. I'm just dropping in some suggestions. You don't have to apoligise for Egosofts design choices, thats not what modders should do. They alter them to their own wishes. And thats all i have been trying to suggest. So do with it what you will or don't. Thinking about hasn't hurt anyone. Btw, i saw that some corrupt police took advantage of me being a different race which is a nice change. Which makes race seem more relevant. Maybe that concept could be somewhat expanded upon, maybe not. I'm just thinking what i'd like, doesn't mean you have to like it.

You can always look at a problem 2 ways. 1 as a lack of. 2 as it being necassary.

for example pirates don't go boarding ships that often and they do sell mercinaries, rifles and stuff. And what do pirates do all day???? Just kill anyone they see?? Now 1: you could create pirate fleets which actually do board ships in hostile territory. 2: You imagine it happening all the time while your OOS and just not seeing it. Just like the racial wars. Actually i had a mission where i had to annihalate a boron invasion....

I think this racial thing is a lack of. Not just nessacary like you suggest.
A lack of malicious enemies who hate you no matter what you do for their race. As they do not seem to be individuals but borg collectives.
Last edited by chris_1979 on Thu, 11. Aug 11, 19:05, edited 1 time in total.
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EmperorJon
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Post by EmperorJon »

Then explain to me how i can be friends with both split and paranid.
Well they are allied. ;)
You don't have to apoligise for Egosofts design choices, thats not what modders should do. They alter them to their own wishes. And thats all i have been trying to suggest.
They can't alter it. The only other thing they could do would be make it more 'realistic'. Which would mean you'd take years, or have to do something REALLY amazing, for anyone to make you a hero, and the moment you shot anyone you'd instantly (and probably permanently) be their enemy.
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chris_1979
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Post by chris_1979 »

EmperorJon wrote:
Then explain to me how i can be friends with both split and paranid.
Well they are allied. ;)
You don't have to apoligise for Egosofts design choices, thats not what modders should do. They alter them to their own wishes. And thats all i have been trying to suggest.
They can't alter it. The only other thing they could do would be make it more 'realistic'. Which would mean you'd take years, or have to do something REALLY amazing, for anyone to make you a hero, and the moment you shot anyone you'd instantly (and probably permanently) be their enemy.
Well we arived here because i suggested that research would be cool. And i was told that this makes the mod too player centric, as the idea of XTM was to erase the player centric feel of the game. So i gave my views on that. I have no clue and no intention on learning to mod X3TC. For me this game is relaxation and i want to keep it that way. I've modded other games and don't have the time or energy to learn this one. So sorry if i step on toes here, but that was what i felt was player centric in X3TC and ofcourse xtended too.
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Killjaeden
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Post by Killjaeden »

the player has one race and that is called "playerrace" ... What you choose as start just sets your relations to the races, nothing else.
That's how the game works. Blame Egosoft for it.
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InFlamesForEver
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Post by InFlamesForEver »

I can't wait to get home and try this out.
The only problem I see with this mod is the simple fact that I can't use the cheat mod so that I can save anywhere or try the ships before I get them but oh wells. This is worth the hassle I recon.
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X2-Eliah
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Post by X2-Eliah »

If you have the salvage insurance AL-option enabled, you can in fact save anywhere in friendly space (it will cost you a bit, ofc) - no need to go out of your way and explicitly buy the insurances from stations.
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InFlamesForEver
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Post by InFlamesForEver »

X2-Eliah wrote:If you have the salvage insurance AL-option enabled, you can in fact save anywhere in friendly space (it will cost you a bit, ofc) - no need to go out of your way and explicitly buy the insurances from stations.
Oooh thanks I'll have to remember that.
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_Zap_
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Post by _Zap_ »

"buying" a salvage insurance with the AL-plugin only costs 560 credits instead of 3000 as I've read somewhere.


I've got a few questions on my own: (theXuniverse doesnt work for me since days)
  • - Is it correct that the scram cannon does actually use way more energy then stated?

    The whole point of having an ammo-based weapon was for me to have (almost) no energy drain.
  • - Does the production of ammo with the ammo generator cost anything?

    The manual states using a missile generator to produce missiles would be very expensive, so i guess that it'll drain your money as it works. I wonder if that applies for the ammo generator too? some information there might be nice...
  • - Will red units at some point eventually turn blue again?

    I've appearantly upset part of the split military, and even with me at rank 10 with the split, those ships will shoot at me sometimes if i get to close. Has been this way for a couple of game days now.
  • - How to script my reputation with the aldrians up?

    Since nothing can affect the relation with them, there is no other way.
  • - How to further train marines?

    The training menu doesn't show up in EQD's, military outposts and mercenary stations. Guess there has to be another way, or the player is intended to use the pre-trained marines.
  • - I'm not able to complete the new combat missions. What am I supposed to do?

    I mean the ones added with the mod "blabla apply for sector defense duty here!", not the vanilla patrols)
    There is no yellow bracketed target to intercept...
    Even if i kill all pirates in sector and no freighters die the mission ends as a "failure" as stated in the message i get after ending the mission with sending the report.
  • - There are sometimes missiles surviving the usage of chaff/ecm. is this intended?

    The manual states chaff would only kill anti-fighter missiles. it most certainly also kills m8-missiles and hornets.
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Northern Comfort
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Post by Northern Comfort »

Is OOS combat completely broken for anyone else or am I just horribly missing something?

I ah... took charge of a pirate sector and built up a nice little complex there. Since pirates are scripted to spawn at the gates, I have 2 fully geared Titans and a Thresher sitting on a gate, ready to intercept anything that comes through. I have them set to defend position in front of the gate.

Now, IS, they slaughter the everliving hell out of anything and everything red that comes through in seconds, hardly taking any damage-yet the minute I go OOS, a single Sharks Thresher instakills all three and proceeds to burn anything in the sector within seconds. Any idea what's going on? (titans armed with PPCs and B-flaks, full shields, etc. Thresher armed with the boron equivalent.)

This is just getting immensely frustrating, as it seems I can't actually leave the sector without losing everything I've built up to this point.

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