[SCRIPT] NPC Bailing Addon v1.7.8 [2010-09-21]

ThisIsHarsh · Post by **ThisIsHarsh** » Fri, 21. Nov 08, 00:47

999-JAY-999 wrote:I noticed that even with updated version i am getting READ TEXT error in menu...

Check your X3TC\t folder and delete 7101-L044.xml, if it exists. Sometimes plugin manager doesn't update the xml (as I've literally just been finding).

Tiberiumkyle · Post by **Tiberiumkyle** » Fri, 21. Nov 08, 01:26

999-JAY-999 wrote:
ThisIsHarsh wrote:
999-JAY-999 wrote:I noticed that we have an option to self-destruct our vessel.... has this been implemented as a valuable of chance with the NPC's ?
I'm not sure what you mean here... I haven't implemented any self-destruct option. And I would like to know where there is one if you found one?

I capped a 'Pirate Ship' which is a useless ship, and can't be sold at SYs, so I had to sent it to a Xenon sector and ask if they would be kind enough to destroy it for me. They seemed happy enough to do it, but it would have saved time if I could have just self-destructed it.

Well I have def a SELF DESTRUCT option, trying to recall which icon i need to select.

Its from the side bar on the left.

I've noticed that some of my ships, I get a self destruct option in the Advanced menu, when I target and left click ->Advanced -> Selfdestruct

would have to check, but I'm thinking I mostly see it on capital ships

EDIT: Looks like it only shows up for the ship you are currently flying.

Graxster · Post by **Graxster** » Fri, 21. Nov 08, 03:45

Which is just plain silly. Why would you want to self-destruct the ship you're IN? lol. IIRC, that was something added in X3R to allow you to "self destruct" a Complex, which would destroy the hub and connecting tubes, so you could reconfigure your complex.

-G

999-JAY-999 · Post by **999-JAY-999** » Fri, 21. Nov 08, 21:35

Graxster wrote:Which is just plain silly. Why would you want to self-destruct the ship you're IN? lol. IIRC, that was something added in X3R to allow you to "self destruct" a Complex, which would destroy the hub and connecting tubes, so you could reconfigure your complex.

-G

Tis odd, perhaps if you wanted to go down with the ship instead of it getting captured..... all movie going stuff !

Sunrayn · Post by **Sunrayn** » Mon, 24. Nov 08, 17:20

I have been playing vanilla and wanted more of a sandbox game than the regular starts offered, no plots, no excessive mission icons, all that, so I started a custom X-Universe game.

I thought it stupid that I was the only one in the universe scary enough to make a pilot bail so I downloaded your script (ver 1.6)

With big and huge bails on and all rates set at 40% with default damaged goods I am finding it perfect after about 8 hours of playing. Note that all these are non-player caused bails.

1 Raijin Sentinal(?)
2 Discoverers (1 Pirate, 1 Argon)
1 Express
1 Vulture
1 Nova Vanguard
1 Nova (pirate)
1 Mercury

And the bails of the night, 1 Perigrine and 1 Ranger.

This may seem an excessive amount but, with the tremendous hull damage, all hulls but the ranger (will get to) at less than 10%, it is not a hand-me-money-for-free deal. Even after spending an obscene amount of time free floating in space repairing the hulls up to even 30% and sending the caps to a shipyard to sell, I still didnt have the cash to repair the one ship I decided to keep, the Perigrine.

As for the Goner Ranger. This was the only anomoly. It still had its 200mj shield and the hull was about 78%.

I dont use any sort of remote claiming and personally flew from sector to sector exploring and manually claiming the abandoned ships so, I find it to be a realistic, stable code.

**Lesson Learned** After setting the hotkey for the Community Script Package, you have to be Undocked to actually have the hotkey do something (i.e open the menu). It isnt stated anywhere in that package or in the thread. Confusing for a first time mod user like me. Just a note for those posts in this thread that said 'nothing happens when I press the hotkey'.

*edit* Because I could have sworn I saw a 1.61 somewhere in this thread and its not there now.

Tiberiumkyle · Post by **Tiberiumkyle** » Mon, 24. Nov 08, 17:40

I have noticed that the Goner ships, being flown by pacifists, tend to bail if you so much as point a gun their way.

xiriod · Post by **xiriod** » Mon, 1. Dec 08, 21:03

How is the bail rate and bravado calculated really? For the sake of the argument, lets say you set bail rate of big/huge ships to 50%. Then those 50% are again modified by the bravado?

I am trying to find the best suitable rate for bailing. I have found that 30% for small ships is good. Not too many bails, just what I have had in the previous games really.

But with the big/huge ships it is another matter. If I set the rate too high they bail too early, if I set it too low it never happens. Any input?

EDIT: I just noticed a big ship floating by me with that small dot of an icon signifying it is a civilian ship. I scanned it and it was a Split Elephant named Split Casino. It had no weapons what so ever, and a bravado of 17. It bailed real fast.

I am not sure, but maybe some check if it is a civilian ship and big maybe add some bravado? Or if it is a TL, add some fighter support in the launch bays? I dunno. It was like taking candy from a child

But I kept it

EDIT: Tired, typo. Sorry.

ThisIsHarsh · Post by **ThisIsHarsh** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 03:42

xiriod wrote:How is the bail rate and bravado calculated really? For the sake of the argument, lets say you set bail rate of big/huge ships to 50%. Then those 50% are again modified by the bravado?

I am trying to find the best suitable rate for bailing. I have found that 30% for small ships is good. Not too many bails, just what I have had in the previous games really.

But with the big/huge ships it is another matter. If I set the rate too high they bail too early, if I set it too low it never happens. Any input?

EDIT: I just noticed a big ship floating by me with that small dot of an icon signifying it is a civilian ship. I scanned it and it was a Split Elephant named Split Casino. It had no weapons what so ever, and a bravado of 17. It bailed real fast.

I am not sure, but maybe some check if it is a civilian ship and big maybe add some bravado? Or if it is a M1, add some fighter support in the launch bays? I dunno. It was like taking candy from a child But I kept it

Below are some quotes of posts I've made detailing the calculations in previous pages. Also there are a few people posting through these pages on their settings, page 11 has some reports. It's very varied, everyone has their own opinion.

Personally I'm now using 50% for both normal and big ship, along with NPC salvagers at default settings. I find my Universe Salvager is sat mostly on standby (with most non-hostile sectors containing a satellite), grabbing only a couple of heavily damaged small ships every hour.

I have only managed a single big ship, a Nemesis (M6) with practically no hull left. I haven't been in any huge battles myself, so can't comment there, almost everything I have is capped from NPC vs. NPC battles where I wasn't present.

As for the civilian TLs, I have been tempted myself by the easy picking, but not tried one yet. I don't really see any reason to make them more difficult, seems realistic that a big ship used by civilians would be much more likely to bail than one used by military. There is still the notoriety hit as well as the sector patrols coming after you.

ThisIsHarsh wrote:As for the bravado rating, its simply the sum of morale, aggression and fight skill. The full range is from 0 to 300, but typically you only find from 20 to 90 in the game.

The formula is fairly straightforward, I played around with gnuplot (graph plotting program) quite a bit to find a function that worked for me:

Spoiler
Show
modifier = (bailrate/10)^2
chanceofbailing = modifier / (modifier + bravado)
-- check random number for probability of bailing *at all*
hull%tobailat = 100*chanceofbailing

minimum: 1 / (1 + bravado) = very low chance of bailing for all but absolute lowest bravado, and even at bravado of 1, only a 1/2 chance.

maximum: 100 / (100 + bravado) = approx 1/2 chance the highest bravado, and near a 1/1 chance for low bravados.

ThisIsHarsh wrote:OK some numbers - but first I'll point out bravado isn't percent, it's out of 300, but almost all ships lie between 20 and 90. Civilian ships and some traders tend to be around 20, whereas most military ships are around 90. Traders and some pirates and patrols most often fall somewhere in-between.

Spoiler
Show
Bravado = 80
- bail rate 100% -> 11% probability of bailing
- bail rate 50% -> 6% probability of bailing
- bail rate 10% -> less than 1% probability of bailing

Bravado = 50
- bail rate 100% -> 17% probability of bailing
- bail rate 50% -> 9% probability of bailing
- bail rate 10% -> 2% probability of bailing

Bravado = 20
- bail rate 100% -> 33% probability of bailing
- bail rate 50% -> 20% probability of bailing
- bail rate 10% -> 5% probability of bailing
Hopefully that helps. As you can see the probabilites aren't that high even for the most liberal setup.

. . .

Right now the hull damage has no randomness. The probability % given in the spoiler tag above doubles as the maximum hull % the pilot will bail at (will probably be less as the ship will continue taking damage for a short while before the pilot has a chance to bail). I left it like this since noone seemed to complain.

A small minority of ships have a very very low pilot bravado so you will find some ships with over 30% hull, but most will have less than 30% when they finally bail. This to me makes some sense, since it would be an exceptionally cowardly person indeed who would bail prematurely. Such pilots do exist in the game, but are rare.

Sunrayn · Post by **Sunrayn** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 05:49

Ok, Now I am terrified of hitting the claim button on an abandoned ship.

I have been chased by Cerberus, Ray's, Centaurs on a few occasions. Fortunately, I dont have to outrun the pissed off ship, I just have to outrun the defenseless ship I claimed.

Something is turning certain ships red after claiming some ships. I have checked the freight immediately and there is no illegal goods on board.

I even had a Cerberus chase down a badly wounded claimed buster from 20+ km away as soon as I claimed it.

It is making me wonder if the ships turning red are the same ships that 'killed' the ship and are somehow still 'on the hate list' of that ship.

In one case, a Boron Ray and it's two escorts, Mamba and Mako turned red upon me claiming a Hermes, They went straight for the Hermes and the Ray got the final shot and destroyed the Hermes, it then turned back to friendly but, the Mamba and Mako stayed red and followed me until I out distanced them and left the sector.

I went back a couple hours later and the Mamba and Mako were once again friendly to me. In all cases, the red ships stayed red and agressive to me the entire time I stayed in the sector.

xiriod · Post by **xiriod** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 05:53

I always give that bailed ship a jumpdrive, energ and Nav 1 and jump it somewhere I know it is safe before I start to rep it

@ThisIsHarsh
Thank you for explaining, it all makes perfect sense now. Well, almost

I still think it could benefit from a check when the AI turns a TL in to a Casino and it ends up with 17 in bravado though. Or I could just shut up and be happy for it

hehe.

EDIT: Too tired, and typo.

ThisIsHarsh · Post by **ThisIsHarsh** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 05:57

@Sunrayn: Yeah a few people have reported this and I have experienced it once or twice myself. I'm really not sure what could cause it. Though..

It is making me wonder if the ships turning red are the same ships that 'killed' the ship and are somehow still 'on the hate list' of that ship.

..is a good point, there might just be a script command regarding this. I'll look into it, but don't get your hopes up yet.

ThisIsHarsh · Post by **ThisIsHarsh** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 06:00

xiriod wrote:I still think it could benefit from a check when the AI turns a M1 in to a Casino and it ends up with 17 in bravado though.

An M1? Are you sure? I thought the only civilian big ships were TLs? An M1 is a different matter though and I might just have to cap the bravado for such ships.

ThisIsHarsh · Post by **ThisIsHarsh** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 06:25

Update v1.6.2

Attempted relations fix for when claiming a ship suddenly causes other ships in sector to turn red.

This is extremely difficult to test given that the bug cannot be duplicated without simply playing the game for hours on end. So please let me know if this does or does not appear to fix the issue.

xiriod · Post by **xiriod** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 16:14

ThisIsHarsh wrote:
xiriod wrote:I still think it could benefit from a check when the AI turns a M1 in to a Casino and it ends up with 17 in bravado though.
An M1? Are you sure? I thought the only civilian big ships were TLs? An M1 is a different matter though and I might just have to cap the bravado for such ships.

Oh crap, I was too tired in the morning playing for 16 hours straight....

I of course meant a TL class ship. It is in Rhonkar's Might, and another one in Seizewell. Sorry guys. But still, it is a big catch for such a low morale and no weapons. I'll edit my previous post so it makes sense.

xiriod · Post by **xiriod** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 17:00

Errrr, I load my game today and all Teladi are now read to me. I did not capture any Teladi ships, but I captured two Split ships yesterday. They do not shoot at me, and they confirm it when I say I fired by mistake. But they stay red, even the stations.

Is this the bug that was fixed now? They where all blue to me before I captured the Split ships. I will install the update, and hope it fixes it. Or else I have to start a new game...

Ok, now I have found the source of the problem. I captured a Q a couple of days back. When I transfer to the Q, all Teladi turn red on me. When I transfer to my Boa they all turn blue again.

The update did not fix that though. Is it possible to write a quick-fix script that somehow nulls all your ships rep to any race so I/we can continue to use our ships? Or do we just have to sell them and lick our wounds?

EDIT: What I did, was to undock all my ships and transport between them. Somehow this made the Teladi blue to me again. But I am not sure if it will come to bite me in the behind later on anyway though. There is definitely something strange here.

kipstafoo · Post by **kipstafoo** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 17:23

ThisIsHarsh wrote:Update v1.6.2

Attempted relations fix for when claiming a ship suddenly causes other ships in sector to turn red.

This is extremely difficult to test given that the bug cannot be duplicated without simply playing the game for hours on end. So please let me know if this does or does not appear to fix the issue.

Rock on! Sucked when I cap'd that Xenon J only to have 5 Paranid M1/M2s blast it into oblivion.

ThisIsHarsh · Post by **ThisIsHarsh** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 18:00

@xiriod: That sounds more like your Q has the relations set to enemy for Teladi still, since they are not attacking you but still turn red. You can get a similar effect if you order your own ship to attack a race ship then stop before firing. All race ships/stations will turn red because that sets your relation to them to enemy and you have to set it back to friend manually - other than that nothing changes. This issue has also been fixed in the new update.

The fixes will only work with newly capped ships I'm afraid. That is, assuming they work at all (i.e. need feedback).

xiriod · Post by **xiriod** » Tue, 2. Dec 08, 18:20

ThisIsHarsh wrote:@xiriod: That sounds more like your Q has the relations set to enemy for Teladi still, since they are not attacking you but still turn red. You can get a similar effect if you order your own ship to attack a race ship then stop before firing. All race ships/stations will turn red because that sets your relation to them to enemy and you have to set it back to friend manually - other than that nothing changes. This issue has also been fixed in the new update.

The fixes will only work with newly capped ships I'm afraid. That is, assuming they work at all (i.e. need feedback).

Well, I've been riding around in my Q since I got it, even through Teladi territory. It wasn't until after I captured the Split Elephant and at the end of the day yesterday a Split Python that I found when I loaded the game this morning the condition I described earlier.

So my guess it was somehow connected to the bailing for either or both of those ships. But then again what do I know

EDIT: Not to make a new post, so I put it here. It tried to cap the orbital weapons platforms and it worked but they always explode after a while. Is this pure coincidence, or are we never meant to capture them? If at all possible.

xiriod · Post by **xiriod** » Wed, 3. Dec 08, 05:09

I discovered a bug that may still persist. I captured a Split M1, and the ships that it had previously owned still insisted docking with it. I could not access them in anyway, they just landed and stayed that way.

Also, after I apologized for firing my weapons the remaining forces turned blue as "normal". Then after a short while other places in the universe they turned red again. My reputation is 9, so quite high.

Sunrayn · Post by **Sunrayn** » Fri, 5. Dec 08, 15:27

Dont you just hate when the timeline changes?

I had the perfect opportunity to test out the newest version with regards to ships turning red.

Was running 1.61 still and found a demeter that turned a zues and its escort red upon claiming it. Quit out and updated to 1.62 since I had saved about 10 minutes prior.

History changed though and the ship never got attacked in the new timeline. However, I havent had any ships turn red since installing the newest update, even the ones that looked suspect. I.E--had a big ship hovering around it.

egosoft.com

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[SCRIPT] NPC Bailing Addon v1.7.8 [2010-09-21]