The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

This forum is the ideal place for all discussion relating to X4. You will also find additional information from developers here.

Moderator: Moderators for English X Forum

Phoynix
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 07:18
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Phoynix »

Gah had a long post and it disappeared...

Points
Air has 16* as much oxygen by volume then water and ~780 times or more by mass.
Humans couldn't get enough oxygen from water even if we used skin and gills to respire.

Of course its a game so the developers can say whatever they want it just isn't really possible.

About the only way... and this is WAY WAY improbable would be if they cracked Ammonia for oxygen, but they would need some organic device in their body that exceeded ~1000c to do it.
Axeface wrote: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 15:53
Phoynix wrote: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 07:35 No real reason exists why the Boron shouldn't breathe air if they are an evolved species, as far as real biology suggests is that they SHOULD have the capacity to breathe air.
Their is a functional limit to how much oxygen intake of more primitive oxygen exchange methods can take in that directly relates to how large and active they can grow, human brains use 20% of the total oxygen intake, a fish may use 3%.
From the Argonopaedia
Planet Boron is a vast distance from Argon Prime, with a very different atmosphere and planetary conditions. Its surface is covered with deadly chemical swamps and the atmosphere is based upon an ammonia compound that, to any Humanoid, would mean instant death. The planet also has a great many huge oceans in which the Boron race evolved and lives up to the present day.
Real biology on earth. The makeup of their home planet is vastly different to earth, wouldnt they evolve in a very different way?

And thank you for getting me to search for that info because I had forgot to check the Boron argonopaedia (thought the info was the same as the Wiki which ive been looking at), and there is a wealth of information there! Heres some of it, which answer a lot of the other questions/speculations in this thread. Looks like some of this info hasnt been updated to the latest concept though, but its great nevertheless.
The suit idea should be retconned though :p

The Borons today
Boron live in water. They have six main limbs, of which four are stronger built then the others. Additionally, they have a varying number of very small tentacles. They have snouts and those big eyes on stalks like.

There is a third, relatively rare gender to the Boron, which is called Lar. The Lar are mostly extremely intelligent and are in many important positions within the parliament and the royal family. Lars never have the short, playful names "normal" Borons like. They tend to use beautiful names of honour, sometimes adopted from other species. Lar are addressed as female, although humans can't distinguish Boron of different gender anyway.

Boron use environment suits if they are outside their element. These environment suits are made of white translucent and flexible polymer material. The suits have extensions only for the four main limbs. But you can see the other two limbs and the small tentacles as they press from inside the suit, since it's not completely opaque. On top of the suit is a round see through "globe" (like glass – but made of a durable plastic) where their head is. While inside their suits, they do not 'walk' (they're much too weak for that, since they're used to float under water). The suits are equipped with an anti-g device that makes them float everywhere, but they try not to float too obviously, as not to irritate others.

When floating in the same water, Boron's can 'taste' RNA molecules from other Borons and so get a (hazy) concept of what's on the other Boron's mind (does not work with other species). The Boron RNA stays in the water for a long time.

Boron turn their stalks inwards towards each other when they are amused. Their way of smiling.

They have an ability with their four main tentacles to snap small bones together thereby creating an appendage (arm, leg) with small grips (very small thin fingers). This gives them the ability to lift or move things around more easily. Adults can do this selectively (just one tentacle for example) while younger "children" can only perform all at once. They get the selective ability as they mature.

They are just over a meter in length with the largest males reaching about 1.3 meters.

They have a "jet" like propulsion system that resides in the bottom of their torso. They suck water in through their snouts and pass it into their "gills" to extract oxygen. The water is then pushed out through this "hole" and this creates the jet like behavior. This gives them the ability to move around very quickly in water.

They take food through the snout (mainly plankton type organisms or small *fish*) and their suits have devices to allow the items to be introduced into their "mini" water environment. Although in their native water they would glide to eat plankton or actively hunt for small fish.

They dislike most drug inducing products but it has been known for them to introduce spaceweed derivatives into their environment suits.

The Borons tend to talk in very longwinded, awkward sentences that are full of repetitions. Also, they love strange sounding metaphors. They can, however, talk very to-the-point when in danger for their live.
Some bulletpoints from that:-

- Boron can effectively read eachothers frikkin minds!
- Some of their communication is by movement of their eye stalks.
- They can snap their limbs around and make them semi-rigid (important for X4)
- THEY HAVE ANTI-GRAVITY DEVICES AND CAN FLOAT (can we forget the whole mech suit/walking stuff now please?)
User avatar
JSalzbrunn
Posts: 145
Joined: Wed, 21. Dec 05, 13:08
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by JSalzbrunn »

Axeface wrote: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 15:53 Some bulletpoints from that:-

- Boron can effectively read eachothers frikkin minds!
- Some of their communication is by movement of their eye stalks.
- They can snap their limbs around and make them semi-rigid (important for X4)
- THEY HAVE ANTI-GRAVITY DEVICES AND CAN FLOAT (can we forget the whole mech suit/walking stuff now please?)
According to the books, Borons can smell under water. They smell the feelings of the other borons near them.
AC_Black
Posts: 121
Joined: Tue, 22. Sep 09, 01:51
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by AC_Black »

nieprawda wrote: Sat, 17. Nov 18, 22:13 The way to introduce Boron in the X4 would be (in my opinion):

They built docking platforms/hangars for other "walking" races on their stations but since they live in some water tanks only way to communicate with them is via computers/terminals/holodancers :) You can't hire Boron crew (Boron model in some flying water bubble sounds ridiculous).

You can buy any Boron ship - it will be outfited with cockpit (they need money so why not design ships for other races), any Boron ship you encounter in the world can't be claimed/boarded because it's not possible to dock/pilot with all the water inside ;) (simillar to Xenon in XR) - hacking Boron ships might be possible if you buy some expensive "illegal" software that can help operate stolen Boron ships (without a crew inside) but it will damage reputation with their faction.

If they would be introduced this way in the game (with some DLC) I would not have any complaints - I just like their ships.

Cheers
Reading about the Boron in this thread and knowing we have two(2) DLC's coming, is it not possible that one of them MAY contain the return of the Boron race? A possible new Upgrade mission for the PHQ could lead us to a new system of Boron? This would be very cool indeed!! To OP: Fantastic Model work very well done Axeface..
Honor is the Only thing to Hold True.

Value comes from the Space you have and what you make of what Space you got.

H.I.E.R.
Honesty, Integrity, Equanimity and Respect.
Phoynix
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 07:18
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Phoynix »

I hope the Boron return... I hated most of their ships to be fair in x3 but jumping into kingdoms end the first time with the music and asteroid field was a whoa atmospheric moment that endeared the fishy little twerps to me for all eternity.
AC_Black wrote: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 20:33
nieprawda wrote: Sat, 17. Nov 18, 22:13 The way to introduce Boron in the X4 would be (in my opinion):

They built docking platforms/hangars for other "walking" races on their stations but since they live in some water tanks only way to communicate with them is via computers/terminals/holodancers :) You can't hire Boron crew (Boron model in some flying water bubble sounds ridiculous).

You can buy any Boron ship - it will be outfited with cockpit (they need money so why not design ships for other races), any Boron ship you encounter in the world can't be claimed/boarded because it's not possible to dock/pilot with all the water inside ;) (simillar to Xenon in XR) - hacking Boron ships might be possible if you buy some expensive "illegal" software that can help operate stolen Boron ships (without a crew inside) but it will damage reputation with their faction.

If they would be introduced this way in the game (with some DLC) I would not have any complaints - I just like their ships.

Cheers
Reading about the Boron in this thread and knowing we have two(2) DLC's coming, is it not possible that one of them MAY contain the return of the Boron race? A possible new Upgrade mission for the PHQ could lead us to a new system of Boron? This would be very cool indeed!! To OP: Fantastic Model work very well done Axeface..
AC_Black
Posts: 121
Joined: Tue, 22. Sep 09, 01:51
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by AC_Black »

Phoynix wrote: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 21:32 I hope the Boron return... I hated most of their ships to be fair in x3 but jumping into kingdoms end the first time with the music and asteroid field was a whoa atmospheric moment that endeared the fishy little twerps to me for all eternity.
AC_Black wrote: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 20:33
nieprawda wrote: Sat, 17. Nov 18, 22:13 The way to introduce Boron in the X4 would be (in my opinion):

They built docking platforms/hangars for other "walking" races on their stations but since they live in some water tanks only way to communicate with them is via computers/terminals/holodancers :) You can't hire Boron crew (Boron model in some flying water bubble sounds ridiculous).

You can buy any Boron ship - it will be outfited with cockpit (they need money so why not design ships for other races), any Boron ship you encounter in the world can't be claimed/boarded because it's not possible to dock/pilot with all the water inside ;) (simillar to Xenon in XR) - hacking Boron ships might be possible if you buy some expensive "illegal" software that can help operate stolen Boron ships (without a crew inside) but it will damage reputation with their faction.

If they would be introduced this way in the game (with some DLC) I would not have any complaints - I just like their ships.

Cheers
Reading about the Boron in this thread and knowing we have two(2) DLC's coming, is it not possible that one of them MAY contain the return of the Boron race? A possible new Upgrade mission for the PHQ could lead us to a new system of Boron? This would be very cool indeed!! To OP: Fantastic Model work very well done Axeface..
I cannot agree more :D
Honor is the Only thing to Hold True.

Value comes from the Space you have and what you make of what Space you got.

H.I.E.R.
Honesty, Integrity, Equanimity and Respect.
Steel
Posts: 1905
Joined: Wed, 6. Nov 02, 20:31
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Steel »

Taken below from Dominion (Chapter 7)

If that helps at all.
She moved towards the edge of the rock, sweeping vegetation out of
her way as she went, her four long thin legs propelling her along the
uneven seabed. Two more protrusions reached out and forwards,
moving back and forth in front of her to move the highest parts of the
plants out of her way. Three long thin digits protruded from the two
arms, grabbing at the undulating branches when she needed more
leverage.
Her skin was a mottled grey, thick, like rubber and appeared wet.
However, it was dry and leathery to the touch. Her head sat atop a long
thin neck and above that, two stalks with eyes moved independently of
one another as she surveyed her path. She took in gasps of oxygen rich
water through a small trunk on the front of her head. Heavily tainted
with ammonia, her internal organs processed the fluid and extracted
the oxygen required to breathe.
She was nearing the rock edge now, hoping to get there soon so
that she could take in some of the deeper waters pleasant oxygen and
refresh herself. Too long spent working in the underwater village in the
forest where her family and the rest of the hive lived. She had been
given time to play, to refresh before returning to her chores after the
sun went down and then came back again the following day.
She was propelling herself as fast as she could and her brother was
trying his best to beat her to the outcrop. But she was older, stronger
than he was and she wouldn’t be beaten.
As she reached the rocks edge, she pushed off with all her might
and flew into the open water. Pulling her legs and arms behind her so
they swept away in the air as she flew. It looked so graceful, the one and
half metre figure moving through the water while the yellow sea mists
swirled alongside.
Then she plunged deeper into the water, just as her brother began
his jump from the side. Heading downwards into the depths, she took in
water through her snout. Large amounts, again and again she snorted.
The water was cascading into her body when the richer droplets began
to invade her ammonia-hardened lungs. The body automatically snapped
shut the opening to her lungs and the water continued its journey
through a newly opened tunnel. Then it splashed against the micromesh
of her gills and they began the job of extracting the oxygen sealed within.
Then the remainder of the liquid, minus most, but not all of it’s
oxygen, was pushed deeper into her torso until it came to the opening
between her four “legs”. She felt the sweetness of the oxygen and the
urge to push deep inside her. She relented, let her muscles take over
and the water was pushed out at considerable force. She moved
deeper into the water, away from the swamp edges, propelled by the
small jet.
The dark rings on her legs and arms began to swell, to open like
flower buds and her thin bones began to disconnect themselves all
along her torso. It took only moments but she changed from a seabed
running, insect like figure, into the soft pliable form most suited to the
depths. The transformation complete, she flexed the suckers that ran
the length of her six tentacles. It felt good. She threw all six tentacles
forward and the negative force quickly slowed her down. One eye stalk
peered upwards, the eye moving side to side, looking for the brother
she knew was coming.
There he was, sweeping down towards her in the same form she
had moments before. He completed the same stopping manoeuvre and
came to rest at her side. She moved towards him and touched her
head against his. Loud sounds came from her snout, like someone
clearing their throat to you and me. The sound travelled well in the
water but the meaning could sometimes be lost and touching heads let
them communicate better.
“Told you I’d win.” She said to her smaller brother.
User avatar
Axeface
Posts: 3034
Joined: Fri, 18. Nov 05, 00:41
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Axeface »

Steel wrote: Mon, 19. Nov 18, 17:22 Taken below from Dominion (Chapter 7)

If that helps at all.
She moved towards the edge of the rock, sweeping vegetation out of... -snip-
Wow! Loads of info there! Thanks a lot for the quote.
So the overall image I get from that, is that the writer is thinking of an octopus. The way they are describing the Boron crawling along the floor almost like an insect, and then 'flying' with grace is exactly how octopus get around... even to the detail of how they spread their tentacles to stop. They are so graceful, man I wish I could animate so I could make a short video of my Boron swimming... *opens youtube*.
Awesome stuff! Gonna have to read that book.
Gallery of my X ships and fanart eg, Boron Megalodon
My wishlist
Disclaimer: Axeface will ignore 'don't like it don't use it' responses :wink:
Phoynix
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 07:18
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Phoynix »

Wow...
:evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :rant: :rant: :rant:
Lungs breathe air, gills breathe liquid, lets mix them up completely while talking about them breathing liquid...

This could be taken so many ways
The writer meant gills all along and didn't know their is a very distinct difference between gills/lungs and they cannot be used interchangeably.
Or
They have Lungs that can also act as gills meaning they evolved to breathe air/liquid.(but makes little sense as they require two entirely different structures to extract oxygen from air/liquid)
Or
They have both lungs and a internal gill system with the water passing through the lungs first before moving on to the rest of the system...

So lets try to go along with it in a way that makes biological sense...

They have Lungs and breathe air,to put this in perspective whales never bothered to develop gills and they will dive down 2000m, some whales can hold their breathe for over 2 hours(because its that much more efficient to get the oxygen from the air then the water) So we need a reasonable explanation on why they still need gills one answer I can think of is subterranean caves, oceans, and lakes. This would create a situation where they can't easily get to the surface and so gills would both extend how long they can go between breaths allowing them a longer delve time.

As I stated previously their just isn't enough oxygen in water for something the size of a human with a developed brain, much like insects can't get over a certain size without developing lungs.

I am also not trying to rain on anyone's parade so to speak, I just like to work out how Sci-fi could be "real" and fit in the real world and in this case its the Boron.
To really exist they need lungs, so we should take it they have both lungs and gills :P
Steel wrote: Mon, 19. Nov 18, 17:22 Taken below from Dominion (Chapter 7)

If that helps at all.
She moved towards the edge of the rock, sweeping vegetation out of
her way as she went, her four long thin legs propelling her along the
uneven seabed. Two more protrusions reached out and forwards,
moving back and forth in front of her to move the highest parts of the
plants out of her way. Three long thin digits protruded from the two
arms, grabbing at the undulating branches when she needed more
leverage.
Her skin was a mottled grey, thick, like rubber and appeared wet.
However, it was dry and leathery to the touch. Her head sat atop a long
thin neck and above that, two stalks with eyes moved independently of
one another as she surveyed her path. She took in gasps of oxygen rich
water through a small trunk on the front of her head. Heavily tainted
with ammonia, her internal organs processed the fluid and extracted
the oxygen required to breathe.
She was nearing the rock edge now, hoping to get there soon so
that she could take in some of the deeper waters pleasant oxygen and
refresh herself. Too long spent working in the underwater village in the
forest where her family and the rest of the hive lived. She had been
given time to play, to refresh before returning to her chores after the
sun went down and then came back again the following day.
She was propelling herself as fast as she could and her brother was
trying his best to beat her to the outcrop. But she was older, stronger
than he was and she wouldn’t be beaten.
As she reached the rocks edge, she pushed off with all her might
and flew into the open water. Pulling her legs and arms behind her so
they swept away in the air as she flew. It looked so graceful, the one and
half metre figure moving through the water while the yellow sea mists
swirled alongside.
Then she plunged deeper into the water, just as her brother began
his jump from the side. Heading downwards into the depths, she took in
water through her snout. Large amounts, again and again she snorted.
The water was cascading into her body when the richer droplets began
to invade her ammonia-hardened lungs. The body automatically snapped
shut the opening to her lungs and the water continued its journey
through a newly opened tunnel. Then it splashed against the micromesh
of her gills and they began the job of extracting the oxygen sealed within.
Then the remainder of the liquid, minus most, but not all of it’s
oxygen, was pushed deeper into her torso until it came to the opening
between her four “legs”. She felt the sweetness of the oxygen and the
urge to push deep inside her. She relented, let her muscles take over
and the water was pushed out at considerable force. She moved
deeper into the water, away from the swamp edges, propelled by the
small jet.
The dark rings on her legs and arms began to swell, to open like
flower buds and her thin bones began to disconnect themselves all
along her torso. It took only moments but she changed from a seabed
running, insect like figure, into the soft pliable form most suited to the
depths. The transformation complete, she flexed the suckers that ran
the length of her six tentacles. It felt good. She threw all six tentacles
forward and the negative force quickly slowed her down. One eye stalk
peered upwards, the eye moving side to side, looking for the brother
she knew was coming.
There he was, sweeping down towards her in the same form she
had moments before. He completed the same stopping manoeuvre and
came to rest at her side. She moved towards him and touched her
head against his. Loud sounds came from her snout, like someone
clearing their throat to you and me. The sound travelled well in the
water but the meaning could sometimes be lost and touching heads let
them communicate better.
“Told you I’d win.” She said to her smaller brother.
User avatar
Drewgamer
Posts: 536
Joined: Fri, 27. Aug 10, 08:39
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Drewgamer »

If you're serious about doing this (and it definitely seems like you are), I'd love to be a part of it.
My artistic skills are a bit lacking, but I have a decent bit of experience with scripting (not Egosoft games, but I'm definitely a quick learner). I've really only ever done mods for myself, but I think it would be fun to get into a project that could benefit the community (especially if I'm getting into it from the beginning).
Check out my mod Crystal Rarities
Steel
Posts: 1905
Joined: Wed, 6. Nov 02, 20:31
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Steel »

Phoynix wrote: Mon, 19. Nov 18, 21:27
To really exist they need lungs, so we should take it they have both lungs and gills :P
Steel wrote: Mon, 19. Nov 18, 17:22 Taken below from Dominion (Chapter 7)

If that helps at all.
snip...Then she plunged deeper into the water, just as her brother began
his jump from the side. Heading downwards into the depths, she took in
water through her snout. Large amounts, again and again she snorted.
The water was cascading into her body when the richer droplets began
to invade her ammonia-hardened lungs. The body automatically snapped
shut the opening to her lungs and the water continued its journey
through a newly opened tunnel. Then it splashed against the micromesh
of her gills and they began the job of extracting the oxygen sealed within.
Then the remainder of the liquid, minus most, but not all of it’s
oxygen, was pushed deeper into her torso until it came to the opening
between her four “legs”. She felt the sweetness of the oxygen and the
urge to push deep inside her. She relented, let her muscles take over
and the water was pushed out at considerable force. She moved
deeper into the water, away from the swamp edges, propelled by the
small jet.
The dark rings on her legs and arms began to swell, to open like
flower buds and her thin bones began to disconnect themselves all
along her torso. It took only moments but she changed from a seabed
running, insect like figure, into the soft pliable form most suited to the
depths. The transformation complete, she flexed the suckers that ran
the length of her six tentacles. It felt good. She threw all six tentacles
forward and the negative force quickly slowed her down...snip
Yes, they have both. Seems like the gills are more efficient than the lungs so the preferred habitat is liquid. They also have the ability to be in a "liquid" state (like a squid) or an "insect" state where they can snap the bones back together to create appendages. Clever. Who knows how much O2 they require to function and even if O2 is the main part of their metabolism.

It was written 15 years ago and I lot of time was taken back then to ensure continuity and that it did indeed obey the rules of "lore" to then become "lore". Although its quite possible things have changed since then I am unaware of.
Phoynix
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 07:18
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Phoynix »

Lungs would have to have an efficiency of less then ~ 1/780 to gills for gills to be more efficient in terms of energy used to pass water over the gills and extract oxygen compared to breathing in air. Lungs that can extract 1% of the oxygen in the air are more efficient then gills that can extract 90% of the oxygen from water.

As stated previously they can't exist on oxygen in water alone as a sapient creature, their is simply not enough oxygen to supply a human sized brain unless they spend most of the day in a "coma" like state with minimal brain activity while they build up the oxygen levels needed for higher functioning.

They either breathe primary by lungs and use gills to extend their delve time, or they can't exist as an oxygen using creature.
Steel wrote: Tue, 20. Nov 18, 16:26
Phoynix wrote: Mon, 19. Nov 18, 21:27
To really exist they need lungs, so we should take it they have both lungs and gills :P
Steel wrote: Mon, 19. Nov 18, 17:22 Taken below from Dominion (Chapter 7)

If that helps at all.

Yes, they have both. Seems like the gills are more efficient than the lungs so the preferred habitat is liquid. They also have the ability to be in a "liquid" state (like a squid) or an "insect" state where they can snap the bones back together to create appendages. Clever. Who knows how much O2 they require to function and even if O2 is the main part of their metabolism.

It was written 15 years ago and I lot of time was taken back then to ensure continuity and that it did indeed obey the rules of "lore" to then become "lore". Although its quite possible things have changed since then I am unaware of.
Steel
Posts: 1905
Joined: Wed, 6. Nov 02, 20:31
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Steel »

Phoynix wrote: Wed, 21. Nov 18, 08:37
They either breathe primary by lungs and use gills to extend their delve time, or they can't exist as an oxygen using creature.
Fair point. Well made.

But based upon "life on earth"....who knows how alien races evolve.
Phoynix
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 07:18
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Phoynix »

Chemical bonds only have so much energy and only so much energy can be used efficiency.

We know the boron use the same hydrocarbons as humans because they eat the same foodstuffs in the X universe.

Water can only hold so much oxygen(based on atmospheric pressure/oxygen content/water temperature)

Given this you can work out the maximum amount energy to do work.
Steel wrote: Wed, 21. Nov 18, 09:34
Phoynix wrote: Wed, 21. Nov 18, 08:37
They either breathe primary by lungs and use gills to extend their delve time, or they can't exist as an oxygen using creature.
Fair point. Well made.

But based upon "life on earth"....who knows how alien races evolve.
User avatar
Axeface
Posts: 3034
Joined: Fri, 18. Nov 05, 00:41
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Axeface »

Phoynix wrote: Wed, 21. Nov 18, 10:30 Water can only hold so much oxygen(based on atmospheric pressure/oxygen content/water temperature)
Thats the trick though right? If we want to design creatures that dont abide by the rules we know on earth. Eg, at risk of sounding completely ignorant, if planet boron is more massive than earth could water hold more oxygen? The text also mentions oxygen rich areas of water, could that water be much richer in oxygen that any water on earth? This could solve the issues you've mentioned before, I think? Also arnt Octopus really intelligent? Seems like you know a lot about this stuff!
Setting aside the 'could complex life evolve on a planet that has less/no oxygen' arguement the text still answers a lot of doubts I had and actually shows that they are MUCH less impractical (I hate saying that) to impliment than previously thought, the only impracticality left is the getting around issue, and thats a simple solve, even their ships dont need water at all if they have lungs!


Also, an update. I've spent the last couple of days learning about hard surface modeling in Zbrush, some of my first real attempts at it - its important to see if i can do it because the ship is going to be made with this technique. Testing/prototyping what his suit might look like, not final in the slightest - I'm a very 'iterative' modeler so things may change drastically. Trying to figure out what his suit is like in that concept is hard, especially considering the resolution I have of it.

Image

:boron: :boron: :boron:
Gallery of my X ships and fanart eg, Boron Megalodon
My wishlist
Disclaimer: Axeface will ignore 'don't like it don't use it' responses :wink:
Phoynix
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 07:18
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Phoynix »

Cephalopod intelligence is a perfect example of out of context. Most life on Earth is not conscious, it lacks the intelligence to be self aware and to act on thought rather then instinct. This is where the idea that Cephalopods are intelligent comes from, for their biological niche and size they show far higher intelligence then other creatures. Stack them up against the average bird and they are stupid overall, stack them up against other sea creatures that have the same biological niches and they are smart.

Boron live on a world with Liquid Ammonia and water, that gives us a need for 20 times Earths atmospheric pressure at sea level.
Earth isn't large enough to support such an atmosphere it would expand to the point the sun would exert more control over much of it then Earth and what was left the solar winds would blow away. As a matter of fact Earth has lost 2/3rd of its atmosphere since dinosaurs walked the Earth.

Could you make a frankenstein monster of a planet, with 15 times Earths gravity and 20 times its atmospheric pressure so you could get sufficient oxygen diffusion from atmosphere to water.
Maybe...
But then the Boron use 15 times as much energy to move, so they need 15 times more oxygen for movement... and far greater caloric intake ontop...

Anyways not much point going on with it, Im sidetracking your thread.

AS for your art, I like it overall but it seems to me the Boron are social species so in regards to colour I would actually expect they would have more colour and pattens.

Axeface wrote: Wed, 21. Nov 18, 16:24
Phoynix wrote: Wed, 21. Nov 18, 10:30 Water can only hold so much oxygen(based on atmospheric pressure/oxygen content/water temperature)
Thats the trick though right? If we want to design creatures that dont abide by the rules we know on earth. Eg, at risk of sounding completely ignorant, if planet boron is more massive than earth could water hold more oxygen? The text also mentions oxygen rich areas of water, could that water be much richer in oxygen that any water on earth? This could solve the issues you've mentioned before, I think? Also arnt Octopus really intelligent? Seems like you know a lot about this stuff!
Setting the 'could complex life evolve on a planet that has less/no oxygen' arguement, the text still answers a lot of doubts I had and actually shows that they are MUCH less impractical (I hate saying that) to impliment than previously thought, the only impracticality left is the getting around issue, and thats a simple solve, even their ships dont need water at all if they have lungs!


Also, an update. I've spent the last couple of days learning about hard surface modeling in Zbrush, some of my first real attempts at it - its important to see if i can do it because the ship is going to be made with this technique. Testing/prototyping what his suit might look like, not final in the slightest - I'm a very 'iterative' modeler so things may change drastically. Trying to figure out what his suit is like in that concept is hard, especially considering the resolution I have of it.

Image

:boron: :boron: :boron:
User avatar
Axeface
Posts: 3034
Joined: Fri, 18. Nov 05, 00:41
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Axeface »

Phoynix wrote: Wed, 21. Nov 18, 18:26 AS for your art, I like it overall but it seems to me the Boron are social species so in regards to colour I would actually expect they would have more colour and pattens.
Completely agree! The texture you see is just polypaint, its just a base, he will have a lot of patterns. This model was white and /greyblue at first, based on the old concept. I've changed it to try to match the newest concept which looks like it was based on a shrimp or lobster? I was looking at cuttlefish and other really colourful creatures for inspiration at first, and still have plans for loads of variation. No reason why they cant have drastically different colours as they do in the old games, right?
White/blue one I had in mind was based on this. But I have plans for variations based on this and this and others.

I also have plans for big differences for age/sex and some really special plans for the Boron Lar- going to have the spinal crest like the old concept has, like seahorses. Been thinking about bioluminescence too :)
Gallery of my X ships and fanart eg, Boron Megalodon
My wishlist
Disclaimer: Axeface will ignore 'don't like it don't use it' responses :wink:
Fleabum
Posts: 159
Joined: Wed, 24. Dec 03, 21:44
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Fleabum »

It does make me chuckle when so much thought is put into how an alien species would convert water based oxygen into usable oxygen, yet no one tries to explain both the faster than light travel, and the massive amount of energy it would take, not to mention the pressures of zero to over 670 million miles per hour in a few seconds on a biological skeleton and brain matter.

Just accept it for what it is, Sci-Fi in action. :)

Nice art on the Borons, if they are deep aquatic creatures, would they not have bio-luminance aspects of their biology?

Regards
Flea
Phoynix
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun, 18. Nov 18, 07:18
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Phoynix »

Difference exists between technology such as FTL and inertia dampeners which are "possible" but outside of our technological ability and something that is outright impossible based on our current understanding of the universe.

Further this was not a thread talking about X universe technology, it was a thread talking about a single alien x universe race, your assumption that I think the X universe technology is "acceptable" is just that, an assumption with no basis in fact. You assuming motives and belief, deciding your assumption is fact, and then chuckling at what you decided is reality with no evidence to support it :P... Whatever floats your boat :P

Fleabum wrote: Wed, 21. Nov 18, 20:50 It does make me chuckle when so much thought is put into how an alien species would convert water based oxygen into usable oxygen, yet no one tries to explain both the faster than light travel, and the massive amount of energy it would take, not to mention the pressures of zero to over 670 million miles per hour in a few seconds on a biological skeleton and brain matter.

Just accept it for what it is, Sci-Fi in action. :)

Nice art on the Borons, if they are deep aquatic creatures, would they not have bio-luminance aspects of their biology?

Regards
Flea
User avatar
Axeface
Posts: 3034
Joined: Fri, 18. Nov 05, 00:41
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by Axeface »

Trying a different look for his suit. Video

Image
Gallery of my X ships and fanart eg, Boron Megalodon
My wishlist
Disclaimer: Axeface will ignore 'don't like it don't use it' responses :wink:
birdtable
Posts: 2128
Joined: Sat, 7. Feb 04, 20:42
x4

Re: The Boron - Discussion, Speculation and Fanart

Post by birdtable »

Sorry if I appear a little unsure (well dim) but are you not going to have a problem with body mass balance in a waterless environment...?

Return to “X4: Foundations”