[MOD] Ship Rebalance Mod ver 0.59 [30/08/2009] + 2 COCKPIT PACKS + Alkeena's BSD!!!!

[someone else]

the only thing that changed on centaur was the Turning rate and the weapon compatibility in the turrets.

three things:
-maybe that was a Pirate Centaur, and it is a different ship.
-the advertized turning rate is the max turning, maybe the one that you have has not enough turning upgrades.
-try to respawn/buy it again (kill it and then create a Centaur using cheat package) it should work.

[Wintermist]

Yeah, I did summon one through the Cheat menu, and it didn't have the improved turning rate. Does the false patch have to be a specific number?

[someone else]

do the Centaur spawned had 4 as turning rate? that is its turning rate without tunings.

what is the manouverability of that Centaur?

in the Tships of the Mod the value is correct... so...

the false patch needs to be the last number. the exact number does not matter.

try to summon/look at other ships and see if they comply to my mod specifications. If they don't you may have screwed the "install" part.

redownload and reinstall the Mod, this should fix the issue if the file you downloaded got corrupted someway...

[Lancefighter]

IBL was removed from Commonwealth M1 and M2, the TL and M7 can still mount it... a M7 without IBL is a pussycat... noone wants that. TL cannot use them in a useful way (to kill more than a couple M6) so who cares of them.

'
gogo fail reading comprehension
i thought you said you removed IBL from all commonwealth ships, my bad.


Ill check out the bugfix thing, because its bugging me that a ship rebalanced put civ ships back into my game >.<

[Skite]

I haven't had the time to test this out but;
Using the rebalance mod that's in the CMOD3 thread, you have to manually replace all your ships with the rebalanced ones, if they already had max tunings before applying the script. For some reason, you could not buy more tunings to get ships to their new maximums. Is this in play with your script, or not?

[Lancefighter]

if they have too many tunings, you can actually sell them..

but if you go to an empty sector, save, remove cmod patch, load, save, apply SE"s sihp rebalance, then load again, its the best you can do really.

[Wintermist]

do the Centaur spawned had 4 as turning rate? that is its turning rate without tunings.

Aha, no it wasn't the last number, since I'm also using MARS and the repair drones happened to be the last number. But, I just never imagined that would matter?

I'll have another look.

EDIT: Ah, that was it; now it works. Thanks for the tip.

[someone else]

6.Removed IBL compatibility from ALL Commonwealth M1 and M2, (except pirates and yakis of course)

Ill check out the bugfix thing, because its bugging me that a ship rebalanced put civ ships back into my game

well.. if that is only a "no civilian mod" (so only a Jobs.pck mod) just install it as the last cat/dat and it will override this jobs file, you will have no Marlin hauler that moves around though...

@Skite: warning, the "improved ships" that comes with Cmod3 is not 2.1 compatible, the new plot adds a ship and that mod has not that ship... so causes a bit of mess.
Anyways I tried to modify the starting values leaving the same number of upgrades/tunings of Vanilla, so that shouldn't be necessary (at least not on ALL your ships). Lancefighter is right, you can sell the too much tunings (if some ships require that please tell me... I want to reduce the number of these annoyances)

I'm also using MARS and the repair drones happened to be the last number

MARS has a modified Tships file to add repair laser compatibility to all drones... but this mod has that already (Gazz asked me to add it in the 4th or 5th post) so even if you override/remove MARS Tships file everything should be Ok. (you just did that )

[Pisces1]

EDIT: how about something on deca# ships? they look quite useless by now... they should be better... anyone has some ideas on the "feel" they should have stats-wise? Maybe slower, very very manouverable, very heavily shieded? (they say that they are terraforming drones modified to fit defensive purposes and they are AI, if we suppose that CPU ship knows that his AI drones are dumb... and makes the perfect ships for AI control?)

EDIT2: I was thinking of the Teladi one that could go a bit faster and can shoot all the commonwealth missiles (all missiles that Teladi can find from dropped freight... to cut resupply costs), the Minotaur still needs something special... manouverability is quite useless if you are that slow.

For AI steering is essential. The deca ships are a bit weird ATM. They are very cheap, counter balanced by the doubled price for weapons, and both the M3 & M4 can equip an ammo based courvette weapon, which makes them very powerful against larger targets. The eEMPC are a bit on the weak side however.

[JrK]

I have found that this mod overrides the Complex Cleaner modfiles. So I'm left wondering what went wrong in the compatability. Is it perhaps the changes to OWP's?

[someone else]

damn.. more problems...

that should be the Tfactories file from draffutt's bug-player-fixes mod (integrated into my ship rebalance Mod)

thanks to Gazz it is easy to integrate the two, updating.....

update complete, download ready. tell me if that works.

[JrK]

So what does the merge mean? Does this include the bugfixes and complex cleaner now? Or does it just have the same files if you use those other mods?

I use the Cmod3 version, you updated that one as well?

[someone else]

the merge allows compatibility with complex cleaner, install complex cleaner and then install my mod. (my mod needs to be the last cat/dat)
(mmmh... better to say this in the first post)

you are lucky, the files I uploaded contain some new things I was adding, i decided to take out the 2 modifies that made the khaaks too powerful for use in Cmod3. (and because I'm using improved races script, they begin to annoy me too much... they need high numbers, they swarm on things... no need to have super powerful capitals.)
so it is Cmod3 compatible, no more 2 version now.

[JrK]

Okay tested, it works! Thanks for the fast correspondence!

[someone else]

New version! 0.54! updated with new fixes from draffut's bug-fix mod!

Rebalance of all ships of the same Class/Race done so far:
1.Enhanced Turning rate on those M6 in need:
Centaur 6 Hvy Centaur 4,9 Hvy Cent. Prot. 5,2 Dragon 8,1 Hvy Dragon 6,7 Hydra 5,6 Hvy Hydra 6 Nemesis 6,7 Hvy Nemesis 5,3 Osprey 5,3 Hvy Osprey 4,8 Otas Skiron 6,1 Katana 7,4 ATF Vali 5

2.Paranid M6/M6H can mount PSG everywhere. (but not the Hyperion)
3.Terran M6/M6H can mount SSC everywhere.
4.Split/Argon/Paranid M6H can now mount their prototype beam cannons in the main slot.
5.All M6/M6H turrets with an odd number of guns now should have an even number of guns.
6.Removed IBL compatibility from ALL Commonwealth M1 and M2, (except pirates and yakis of course)
7.Removed IC/IPG compatiblity from Pirate and Yaki Capitals.
8.Terran/ATF frigates are now able to load only 4 guns on main, but they can now use PSP on main.
9.Added PBG's to Pirate and Yaki M1/2 turrets.
10.Increased the cargo capacity of all M1 by 60 % (they are BIG and require massive stockpiles of ammo and missiles for the fighters...) (not on Teladi)
11.Increased cargo on M2 by 30 %. (they need to carry a lot more weapons, the current Ego loading sistem requires a good cargo bay to spawn a decent weapon selection on enemy M2) (not on Teladi)
12.All Xenon ships now have better stats... (like in Reunion) but no modifies have been done to the turrets placement of the K.
13.All Kha'ak Big and Small ships have better speed and turning. I want them ass-kicking.
14.All Teladi “military ships” have double the original Cargo Bay (TS and TL excluded), now they make sense.
15.Removed compatibility to all Anti- capital weapons on all M1. (They are Carriers! And only the Raptor was able to use them effectively)
16.TS, TP now are upgraded to 200 Mj shields and have a scaled-up shield generator.
17.TL are upgraded to 1Gj shields and have a scaled-up shield generator.
18.OWP are now more powerful and heavily shielded, a small OWP has the same firepower of a M7 without IBL, a medium OWP is dangerous as a M2, a big OWP kicks anything.
19.All drones now have half energy recharge. tell me how they perform.
20.All boron small ships have better turning, bigger shields, bigger shield/weapon/generator,
and bigger acceleration but same weapons and speed.
21.All M4 go 20% faster than Vanilla now
22.Bigger differences between standard/Raider/Vanguard/Sentinel in M3 and M4 (no, not gonna mod M5):P:
Raider=fast, maneuverable, good weapon gen., low shields
Vanguard= better in any respect than standard, half cargo bay, same shields.
Sentinel= more shields, very maneuverable, slower (perfect for AI pilots)
23.Added PBG's to Pirate M6 turrets.
24.Pirate ships are a lot more pirate now... all fighters are fast and maneuverable, but have less shields and weapon gen. (not all XD), Pirate Capitals are now the fastest of their class and very maneuverable (for their class). All the Pirate Capitals can shoot Boarding Pods... get ready to board that TL you dogs! Har Har...

Single Ship rebalanced so far:

1.Springblossom's speed tuned down to 250, price up to around 35 milions, front weapons down to 6.
2.All Drones CAN mount Repair laser (useful for MARS scripts, otherwise ininfluent) making another type of drone is beyond this Mod's scope, but now you can give repair laser to them by scripting means.
3.Boreas is now a Light destroyer, speed to 82, manouverablility to 3.2, 2x 2 Gj shields, 4 weapons front/right/left/side turrets, less shield/laser generator, capital weapons only on front/rear/side turrets.
4.Increased the weapon slots for each Python's side turrets to 8, PPC and Gauss compatibility on all other turrets.
5.Tokio has laser energy and regeneration closer to that of Odin/Woden. And its cost has raised...
6.Zeus has 4x 2GJ shields and a 9000KW shield generator.
7.Odin has 2000MW of laser regeneration to cope with its 4 more PSP than other Terran M1
8.Odisseus will have 5x 2Gj shields and 14400KW shield generator.
9.Cerberus is now a REAL anti-fighter platform. Added Flak to the cockpit lasers (and tweaked the laser selection of other turrets), increased rear/up/down turrets to 6 lasers each, and boosted the laser generator, increased cargo bay to 4500 to account for more weapons. Speed increased to 135-140 manouverability has also been increased to be able to catch fighters.
Increased hangar bay to 10 fighters (just to have some wings in it).
10.The falcon sentinel loads 5x 25MJ shields.
11.The kite vangaurd loads 2x 25MJ shields and has a 265 shield generator, weapon generator up to 1000.
12.The Tyr has a bigger cargo bay (but it will be still small if compared to other M2).
13.The Yokohama has now 4 guns per turret.
14.Increased the cargo bay on Panther to 5000
15.Removed the compatibility to PPC on Q's side turrets
16.Raised the number of frontal guns on Heavy Hydra, raised the cargo hold to 1000 and toned down the price
17.Done something on Xperimental shuttle, but waiting to do more on it.
18.Raised laser energy pool on Galleon to 73200 kw
19.Minotaur maneuverability raised to 1.5-1.6-ish
19.Gannet speed up to 68, can now launch ALL and I say ALL Commonwealth missiles, Tomahawk included.

thanks to all contributors that posted ideas until now... it is your ideas that make this possible!

Removed that annoying Khaak weapon boosts, they fit better as faster and swarming ships. And life was tooo difficult with Improved Races by 1ate7tin911s. Not to mention for those that use Cmod3.

Now this mod is compatible with Gazz's Complex Cleaner and features an exclusive Xenon K with fixed turrets, a Carrack that has fulcrum in the right place, a Tokio that is more targettable by turrets and AI in general (thanks to gazz for this last one).

WARNING, it is better to do the installation procedure as said in fist post even if you have already this mod installed... or risk visual glitches.

[lrd99]

Excellent mod!

By the way... What about of returning 25mj shields for basic TS(s)? They are just tins with engines, so installing expensive shields on them looks strange. Haulers and XLs are different matter.

[someone else]

Thanks!

What about of returning 25mj shields for basic TS(s)? They are just tins with engines, so installing expensive shields on them looks strange

what do you mean for "basic TS"? the standard version (the one without Tanker/Super Freighter ecc)?
This is the reasoning behind that global TS/TP/TL change:

The ship is expensive about as a M3 if we count the necessary upgrades for best function, and it can't defend itself. (the peashooter turret on the back is there just to scare off space flies)
The civilians=paperships is a thing I never understood, you pay milions of credits to build and outfit a ship and then comes a random pirate/xenon/Khaak that kills you in seconds. You lose all the profit for what? Because you cannot fit a more expensive generator and shield when they cost a fraction of the value of the ship...

to make things short: universe is now deadlier than the o'l X2, lots of new weapons, missiles and enemies. Pacific traders need to be safer, so they decide to increase the shield level on their ships.

anyways, feel free to continue this discussion, if we find out a more "realistic" TS I'll be happy.

[X2-Eliah]

Actually, the Superfreighter versions differ from small versions only in the length of the tank modules they have - the engine block and the cockpit block are the same, therefore the only difference between them should be cargo space, speed and acceleration/steering (due to mass and inertia differences).

Furthermore, the trading business relies solely on delivering the cargo. If a trader is attacked by pirates, he will not want to shoot back, but he will want good shielding so that he can survive long enough for the military to rush in.

Besides, the size of a TS is far larger than an M3, and it is a far easier target, so the shielding should scale accordingly.

[lrd99]

what do you mean for "basic TS"? the standard version (the one without Tanker/Super Freighter ecc)?

All TS with standard cargo bays (they also may be called "tankers" for some reasons unknown for me).
A 200.000Cr TS mounts 3х200 shields of 450.000Cr total cost? I don't think it's reasonable.

The ship is expensive about as a M3 if we count the necessary upgrades for best function, and it can't defend itself.

We can stop right here. Standard TS not even close in total ownership cost to any M3. Nor M4 to be honest (weapons and missiles include). Max tuning is an option, not requirement.

(the peashooter turret on the back is there just to scare off space flies)

As it should be. It's transport, not corvette. Turret effective against some missiles, stupid M5 and dumb M4's... Exclude OTAS transports maybe.

to make things short: universe is now deadlier than the o'l X2, lots of new weapons, missiles and enemies. Pacific traders need to be safer, so they decide to increase the shield level on their ships.

Universe is dangerous. Everyone wants to be safer. M5's pilot wish to die no more than a simple trader. But this is not a reason to turn M5 into flying fortress. Everyone must follow their duties.
So... I think safety should be provided by player efforts in patroling, intelligence and quick responding to any threats.

(Had said and looked around for .50 and kevlar outfit - going to buy some bread for lunch)

anyways, feel free to continue this discussion, if we find out a more "realistic" TS I'll be happy.

I'll do my best.

[Lancefighter]

I kinda agree - shields to the tune of 1gj on ts is overboard. Also, i think TLs need a small drop in shields, im thinking low m7 range.. At the moment, TLs seem as tough as any capship, which seems wrong.

TS, on the other hand, need balancing. My proposal is this - TS be given at the most, 2x 200mj shields for the XL variants (SF and the like)
Other, smaller TS would receive 25mj shields putting them in the 75-125mj range.
Would make sense to me that as you increase cargo space, you increase shields.