[Request for Feature] Increase Xenon presence by story choice early in game

[Goatsnek]

I have 30+ new games and Xenon are always weak and losing! My latest play I focused just on story and did not interact with xenon but by my 24hr into game matrix #451 and matrix #9 were conquered by teladi! I would like a “story choice” available early game to make the Xenon more powerful while still remaining their enemy. I have yet to have a game where Xenon is threatening to take over the galaxy, even though i have tried things like blocking shipyards with 5 L sized ships. It would be easier to have a set trigger make Xenon x2 or x4,x6,x8 powerful. I want to have to SAVE the galaxy

Story mission: boso ta tells you to destroy these Xenon generators, opps! They are actually Xenon inhibitors, xenon is now up to x10 as powerful based on how many you destroy

[LameFox]

This seems more like an issue with the overall balance of Xenon IMO. It's the same way for me, over and over and over. With one seed someone provided in another thread, I did occasionally (but even then, inconsistently) get them surviving, but still really just hanging on, not relevant the way they used to be. I don't think it ought to be that way by default, the standard condition in the game should ideally be fairly static to account for the different ways players might act.

However I do think something like this would make a good additon/extension to the "crisis" because that turned out pretty unimpressive in the end. I'd be much more inclined to use it if it offered me some way to buff Xenon or even restore them to games where they're exterminated (and this would also make exterminating them to begin with less of a commitment to long term boredom).

[Senaika]

I have 4 games running, started with version 1.0 and 4.0. Xenons are all over the place !
In one game, they took everything from Turquoise sea to Hewa's Twins. On another one they wiped out everything from Litany of Fury to Wretched Sky. On another one, they took 2 sectors in Zyarch's Dominion and are still pushing. I don't know if I'm being lucky, but Xenons are giving me hard time on my games. It really gives me the feeling of "I have to save the Galaxy from Xenons".
The only thing I did is to not bother with them in early game (at least 2-3 days in-game play), and in all my 4 games they were able to wipe out some part of the Galaxy.

Try to start a custom games, and put satellites everywhere. I did a few tests, and every time there is 2 big Xenons battles in early game (2-3 hours in-game play). One in Fault Logic, where every time HOP win the battle. Another one in Emperor Pride IV, where PAR will send 6-7 destroyers and lose the battle against Xenons. You could try to participate in the HOP battle and gives Xenons some help and see what happen, or go to Litany of Fury and hack PAR stations once they lost the battle in Emperor's Pride to give Xenons a chance to push and wipe out more sectors.

Hope you get more luck with Xenons !

[LameFox]

I have 4 games running, started with version 1.0 and 4.0. Xenons are all over the place !
In one game, they took everything from Turquoise sea to Hewa's Twins. On another one they wiped out everything from Litany of Fury to Wretched Sky. On another one, they took 2 sectors in Zyarch's Dominion and are still pushing. I don't know if I'm being lucky, but Xenons are giving me hard time on my games. It really gives me the feeling of "I have to save the Galaxy from Xenons".
The only thing I did is to not bother with them in early game (at least 2-3 days in-game play), and in all my 4 games they were able to wipe out some part of the Galaxy.

This is what I mean when I say they used to be relevant. In older versions they were a lot stronger than they are now (or more accurately, everyone else was weaker). They didn't always take over everything, but it wasn't out of the question either. Now in my custom start tests, only the Split are ever in any danger.

If you want to give them an early game boost maybe sabotaging other factions' production would be the more effective way. But it does make the whole thing feel a bit silly. The game presents them as a much bigger threat than they currently are, and it's kind of weird I have to help them to even pretend that's the case anymore.

[flywlyx]

I’d say it might be due to updates in capital ship AI, particularly for low-attention combat. NPC factions’ destroyers can now reliably take down Xenon fleets and stations with minimal losses.
Since Xenon hasn’t received stronger fleets to counter this change, their extinction becomes inevitable.

[PersonyPerson]

I have 30+ new games and Xenon are always weak and losing! My latest play I focused just on story and did not interact with xenon but by my 24hr into game matrix #451 and matrix #9 were conquered by teladi! I would like a “story choice” available early game to make the Xenon more powerful while still remaining their enemy. I have yet to have a game where Xenon is threatening to take over the galaxy, even though i have tried things like blocking shipyards with 5 L sized ships. It would be easier to have a set trigger make Xenon x2 or x4,x6,x8 powerful. I want to have to SAVE the galaxy

Story mission: boso ta tells you to destroy these Xenon generators, opps! They are actually Xenon inhibitors, xenon is now up to x10 as powerful based on how many you destroy

There already exists 1 plot that can directly strengthen the Xenon's position if you don't waste it.

Spoiler

Show

The Yaki plot, Mutually Assured Destruction path

There are several other plots that can indirectly help the Xenon, since they can thrive in saves where conflict is rife.

The only real problem the Xenon have is cases where clusters can die out on their own due to running out of resources as their miners get themselves killed in silly ways. From what I've observed, the Matrix #9 cluster is not one of them (Emperor's Pride, Scale Plate Green and Matrix #598 clusters are the main ones that the issue can affect).

Also if they happen to lose a cluster, it'll strengthen the remaining ones. So if your Xenon is struggling in the early game, there's easily potential for them to rebound later in the game, revive disabled clusters and start snowballing.
Example(7 in-game days into a 7.10 AI only save):
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ ... rbox=false

Another strategy to help your Xenon grow is to simply help them out where they are getting bottlenecked. If a defence station is consistently stopping large Xenon attacks, then hack the station's turrets to coincide with a Xenon attack. Or even just destroy the defence stations yourself. With such barriers out of the way, you'll be surprised how quickly your Xenon will start causing havoc.

Final option is to install a mod that'll do what you want and buff the Xenon. Only do this if you're willing to accept that your save will almost certainly not be accepted by the devs when it comes to bug reporting.

[LameFox]

I’d say it might be due to updates in capital ship AI, particularly for low-attention combat. NPC factions’ destroyers can now reliably take down Xenon fleets and stations with minimal losses.
Since Xenon hasn’t received stronger fleets to counter this change, their extinction becomes inevitable.

This may exacerbate it but I didn't see that in (admittedly, earlier) 7.5 tests. To me it seems like since 7.10 (since 7.0 was bugged I won't count it) the commonwealth economy has strengthened, and over time they are worn down. Although, sometimes it even looks like they have resources to build more, but just haven't done it.

A few areas (notably the south-west systems between ANT/BOR and HOP) also have extremely vulnerable wharves and shipyards, such that one lone destroyer or Asgard getting in can massacre the SEs that are trying to supply it (or being built at it). It doesn't even have to succeed at killing the station in this case to totally cripple the entire region.

[jlehtone]

We want stronger Xenon, but we don't want more dangerous Xenon.
Some players are steamrolled by Xenon and we don't want that to get any worse.

Therefore, we want Xenon "homeland security" to get buffs so that neither NPC nor player can walz in and raze everything.
Granted, if Xenon manage to gain a sector and fortify it, then taking it back will be more difficult.
Hence, getting steamrolled would get worse indirectly.

What buffs would affect only defense? Amount of jobs that do not raid. Range of Xenon station (SPP, Wharf, Shipyard) turrets.

[GCU Grey Area]

Might be interesting if Xenon increased in strength over the course of the game, perhaps by steadily increasing the number of ships & stations they are permitted to build and/or reducing the materials cost & time they take to build. Maybe this increased Xenon strength could be balanced against the player's net worth. As the player increases in strength so do the Xenon, potentially over-running NPC factions unless the player does sufficient trade with the factions to ensure they have an adequate ship production rate to counter the enhanced Xenon threat. Just a thought, no idea if practical or not.

[LameFox]

We want stronger Xenon, but we don't want more dangerous Xenon.
Some players are steamrolled by Xenon and we don't want that to get any worse.

Therefore, we want Xenon "homeland security" to get buffs so that neither NPC nor player can walz in and raze everything.
Granted, if Xenon manage to gain a sector and fortify it, then taking it back will be more difficult.
Hence, getting steamrolled would get worse indirectly.

What buffs would affect only defense? Amount of jobs that do not raid. Range of Xenon station (SPP, Wharf, Shipyard) turrets.

I have wondered sometimes if they might benefit from redistributing their SEs so that most have a strict home-territory role. Seems like a big drain on their economy in at least some cases is sending these out to die building defence platforms in enemy/neutral systems they don't patrol adequately—or at all. Maybe instead only a small specific group should be available for that task.

[jlehtone]

Maybe this increased Xenon strength could be balanced against the player's net worth.

with exponential ratio

Alas, that creates issue for players, who gather assets peacefully. Just "trade and build".
Their growth could allow Xenon eventually overpower NPC factions.

Besides, knowing that Xenon will get big with us, who would not do pre-emptive strikes before Xenon get big?
(Although, then one can blame self for slaying the milking cow.)

[GCU Grey Area]

Alas, that creates issue for players, who gather assets peacefully. Just "trade and build".
Their growth could allow Xenon eventually overpower NPC factions.

I'm one of those Trade & Build players, predominantly. First few weeks of a new game for me have a strong focus on building industrial capacity to help the factions I support fight more effectively against their enemies. Makes a considerable difference when factions aren't limited by shortages in their own supply chains, but instead have those shortages filled by a player who focuses on Trade & Build. End result is those factions can build their entire fleet quota & replace losses almost as soon as they occur. This is why I suggested net worth as variable to control Xenon strength - for a Fight player their net worth is a stonking big fleet to fight the Xenon directly, while for a Trader & Builder it's infrastructure to support friendly factions.

Besides, knowing that Xenon will get big with us, who would not do pre-emptive strikes before Xenon get big?
(Although, then one can blame self for slaying the milking cow.)

Might need quite a big fleet for that pre-emptive strike. Building such a fleet would however increase player's net worth. As a consequence Xenon would be able to construct more ships & stations, & do so more efficiently.

[Goatsnek]

I would like a ripcord style, there needs to be some way to assuredly stack the Xenon side when things are slow or the xenon are losing

To a new player it wouldn’t make a difference but when i know my galaxy is not threatened and starting to stagnate, the whole gameplay changes for me

[adeine]

I think this would work better as a 'trigger later in the game' option, something like what most people wanted the 7.0 crisis to be.

Essentially research an option or do a small plotline that allows you to open up the gates to new Xenon space with fortified installations and production capabilities, with the potential to do serious damage to the gate network without significant player intervention.