Question about the ship designs.

[mamastoast]

I agree that x3's ship designs were generally a lot better. THere is a real issue in 4x with large ships looking like small models scaled up because they lack the kind of detail you expect to see on a large vessel.

THAT said, I find the Aran extremely ugly...

[Riccardoman]

The presence of a visible docking platform limits the design..... A lot

A good compromise would be making also ships with internal docking

Because let's face it, in some ships going out on the dock isn't even aesthetically pleasable

[mamastoast]

The presence of a visible docking platform limits the design..... A lot

A good compromise would be making also ships with internal docking

Because let's face it, in some ships going out on the dock isn't even aesthetically pleasable

I actually find it very disapointing that no ships have internal hangars. It feels weird that docked ships simply cling to the sides instead of being protected by the main hull. Secondly, it'd give a sense of scale to the large ships. Right now we see only a bridge, however if capital ships had large hangars it'd feel so much more fleshed out. I'm thinking star destroyer hangars here.

And of course as you mentioned youself, it'd open up more exterior design options.

[lordmuck]

The presence of a visible docking platform limits the design..... A lot

A good compromise would be making also ships with internal docking

Because let's face it, in some ships going out on the dock isn't even aesthetically pleasable

I actually find it very disapointing that no ships have internal hangars. It feels weird that docked ships simply cling to the sides instead of being protected by the main hull. Secondly, it'd give a sense of scale to the large ships. Right now we see only a bridge, however if capital ships had large hangars it'd feel so much more fleshed out. I'm thinking star destroyer hangars here.

And of course as you mentioned youself, it'd open up more exterior design options.

I think its quite dumb and a design flaw if this was really thought about. The docked ships would be blown to hell once a battle takes place and that would leave a crater in the ship its docked with. Yes it should be in a hanger. Lets not mention that turrets can hit your own docked ship..

[Riccardoman]

I think its quite dumb and a design flaw if this was really thought about. The docked ships would be blown to hell once a battle takes place and that would leave a crater in the ship its docked with. Yes it should be in a hanger. Lets not mention that turrets can hit your own docked ship..

Some design decisions were extremely strange, like also the aesthetics of the docking platforms or the interiors of the stations
There is little to none racial differencies

[Kadatherion]

The reason for exterior docking ports also comes from the fact they wanted that "seamless" experience: you dock your ship onto a bigger ship, get down and walk into the bridge of the bigger one. Fact is, if you made ships with interior hangars, you'd have to model ALL those interiors as well if you wanted to keep that seamless experience, not just a couple of copypasted docking modules. And, of course, each ship would have a pretty much different looking hangar, as it would have to comply to the geometry of the ship itself. This would have further increased the developing time for each ship model by at least 2x, and we'd now have an even smaller ship roster. And let's not even talk about how AI autopilots would struggle (they already do) at managing to dock at various potentially wildly different hangar entrances, we all remember way too well how they derped in the past.

Again, Egosoft had a neat idea on paper, but didn't think it through. And when they realized the issues that came with it, they found out they pushed themselves into a corner there was no escape from anymore.

[Gideon_Prime]

When compared to previous games -- especially XR, but even X3 (a 10 year old game) -- the ships in X4 are incredibly lacking with regards to design. Smaller ships such as fighters are *okay* as their size limits how much design can be achieved, however, the larger ships are atrocious. Medium sized ships, aside from the nemesis, all look fairly identical: floating boxes with either a docking bay or a floating turret platform. Larger and XL ships ... Serious let downs. The only destroyer who's weapon looks unique and appropriate is the Argon; the others look tacked on. Don't even get me started on the Paranid/Teladi L/XL ship designs, because those things are true abominations. In previous games, the Paranid had some of the most amazing L/XL ship designs; however, in X4, they look like inflated children's toys. At least the Argon L/XL ships have some real design elements to them, but the Paranid and Teladi really do look like children's toys floating around space.

Seeing these images really just makes me want to go back to XR/X3. X4 feels like one step forward two steps back and doesn't land in a proper space between either game. It just feels lazy and grossly incomplete.

[Warnoise]

I agree that x3's ship designs were generally a lot better. THere is a real issue in 4x with large ships looking like small models scaled up because they lack the kind of detail you expect to see on a large vessel.

THAT said, I find the Aran extremely ugly...

Regardless of whether one would find the aran design ugly or not, you undeniably say that a lot of work went into it. You can see the designer worked to make a unique design worthy of a unique ship. X4 ship designs are not only ugly, but I don't feel a lot of work went into them.

[dholmstr]

I do think the fighters are well enough modelled, so much that I think they just did them fast and tought of doing big ships later (patching/DLC wich is abit wrong but thats another thread). But I'm more interested in the mindset by Egosoft why the shipdesign went complety 180 from X:R.
Fighters are better than X:R fighters, luckily. Those were just cannon fodder without any meaningfull use. But still they manage to make several designs more than they have now in X4. And all useless . X4 fighters are fun and have uses, had some nice dogfights. Hull is just crapload to shoot at. But a capital cannot do much to them, is this by design? I mean do Egosoft want us to build fleets with supporting vessel and so on? Then all those turrets are pointless pointdefence and only the big guns are with value when shooting big. I sat infront an K's turret at pointblank range and it did hit my Eclipse, but nothing happend. It was so bad that I could with a peashooter take it out WHILE "full" fire from it. Really???
I still want to see X:R style capital ships and mechanics from that, it is tested and worked. Not perfect but way more than right now in X4. Again is this a Vulcan issue? I don't mind it I just want to hear a good explanation from Egosoft why they took this road.
Also maybe some more fighter size difference, the old energypool worked well. Right now I get same size guns on a Disco as the so called heavy fighter Eclipse

[battou]

I do think the fighters are well enough modelled, so much that I think they just did them fast and tought of doing big ships later (patching/DLC wich is abit wrong but thats another thread). But I'm more interested in the mindset by Egosoft why the shipdesign went complety 180 from X:R.
Fighters are better than X:R fighters, luckily. Those were just cannon fodder without any meaningfull use. But still they manage to make several designs more than they have now in X4. And all useless . X4 fighters are fun and have uses, had some nice dogfights. Hull is just crapload to shoot at. But a capital cannot do much to them, is this by design? I mean do Egosoft want us to build fleets with supporting vessel and so on? Then all those turrets are pointless pointdefence and only the big guns are with value when shooting big. I sat infront an K's turret at pointblank range and it did hit my Eclipse, but nothing happend. It was so bad that I could with a peashooter take it out WHILE "full" fire from it. Really???
I still want to see X:R style capital ships and mechanics from that, it is tested and worked. Not perfect but way more than right now in X4. Again is this a Vulcan issue? I don't mind it I just want to hear a good explanation from Egosoft why they took this road.
Also maybe some more fighter size difference, the old energypool worked well. Right now I get same size guns on a Disco as the so called heavy fighter Eclipse

Yeah, I also vould want to hear something from Egosoft about design decisions. Made a thread about it. But I dont think it'll gona happen.
viewtopic.php?f=146&t=406186

[Riccardoman]

Make an hangar model for S and M ships as standardized as the docks
And each time a ship comes in, the other ship goes into the cargo with the same animation as the docking bays
The only things that would be to model differently for each ship are the hangar entrances, but even with that they could simply "cut" the hull and put a holo barrier

[Dreez]

I think it's quiet clear that the majority of players (veterans mostly) are greatly disappointed in the shipdesigns and the
2 step back they have taken. Like someone said in a previous post, the Arawn has 70 Turrets and the Taranis had 50,
and now we get to fly "corvette sized" destroyers with 10 guns, ships that pale in comparrison to any capitalship from X3 or X:R.

I don't like beating a dead horse, but i just can't let this be, because it's wrong when design goes backwards..

Imagine what would happen if CDPR released CP2077 and it looked like the first Witcher !?.
I'm not saying the game is ugly, it's gorgeous. But the ships.... how did they pass QA ?.

I really hope there is a plan in motion to correct these abominations floating around in the beautiful space you've created.

[thanos]

I think it was mentioned in the thread but it bears repeating:

- Why does the Nemesis look so good compared to the rest of the M class combat ships?
- Because it doesn't have a docking bay.

The inclusion of docking bays turns ships into square-ish, box-ish shapes. I was looking at Argon L-class freighters. They don't have docking bays and they look pretty decent (they bear a resemblence to X:R's Lyramekron). Meanwhile, all the M/L/XL combat ships have those docking bays that make them look bad; not to mention that they take up too much space that could be used by turrets.

Docking bays on ships are a gimmick; they don't provide any (noticeable) gameplay benefits, they constrain the ship designs too much and they just look bad.

So, +1 for internal docking bays. Let's reclaim that external bay space for something more useful.

[CaptainX4]

I think it was mentioned in the thread but it bears repeating:

- Why does the Nemesis look so good compared to the rest of the M class combat ships?
- Because it doesn't have a docking bay.

The inclusion of docking bays turns ships into square-ish, box-ish shapes. I was looking at Argon L-class freighters. They don't have docking bays and they look pretty decent (they bear a resemblence to X:R's Lyramekron). Meanwhile, all the M/L/XL combat ships have those docking bays that make them look bad; not to mention that they take up too much space that could be used by turrets.

Docking bays on ships are a gimmick; they don't provide any (noticeable) gameplay benefits, they constrain the ship designs too much and they just look bad.

So, +1 for internal docking bays. Let's reclaim that external bay space for something more useful.

for me actually osprey looks far better than nemesis an the worse bits in this game are the argon and teladi capitals that were copied from XR. they are horrible and absolutely not X ships...

[lordmuck]

I think it was mentioned in the thread but it bears repeating:

- Why does the Nemesis look so good compared to the rest of the M class combat ships?
- Because it doesn't have a docking bay.

The inclusion of docking bays turns ships into square-ish, box-ish shapes. I was looking at Argon L-class freighters. They don't have docking bays and they look pretty decent (they bear a resemblence to X:R's Lyramekron). Meanwhile, all the M/L/XL combat ships have those docking bays that make them look bad; not to mention that they take up too much space that could be used by turrets.

Docking bays on ships are a gimmick; they don't provide any (noticeable) gameplay benefits, they constrain the ship designs too much and they just look bad.

So, +1 for internal docking bays. Let's reclaim that external bay space for something more useful.

for me actually osprey looks far better than nemesis an the worse bits in this game are the argon and teladi capitals that were copied from XR. they are horrible and absolutely not X ships...

The osprey that looks like a brick and a tail stuck to it ? :/

What I cannot get my head around is how they are currently in the future and the ships they have would get 1 shot with their old models. They have not advanced they went back to stone age.

I would love to hear what egosoft are going to say at these cheap/quickly made/poor/lack of thought/did not follow the "lore" and style of the factions / models that look like a students assignment.

They said somewhere in their latest video that they listened to some stuff people were saying and added something.. cant remember exactly.. So why the F are they not listening to 90% of the people that bought the game now ? and redo these horrid models. Just 1 per moth redo a model and stuff

[CaptainX4]

The osprey that looks like a brick and a tail stuck to it ? :/

What I cannot get my head around is how they are currently in the future and the ships they have would get 1 shot with their old models. They have not advanced they went back to stone age.

I would love to hear what egosoft are going to say at these cheap/quickly made/poor/lack of thought/did not follow the "lore" and style of the factions / models that look like a students assignment.

They said somewhere in their latest video that they listened to some stuff people were saying and added something.. cant remember exactly.. So why the F are they not listening to 90% of the people that bought the game now ? and redo these horrid models. Just 1 per moth redo a model and stuff

do you remember this by any chance? or this? yes, i prefer a brick with wings over fancy overcomplicated XR ships at any time. they actually look like a viable spacecraft....

[Kadatherion]

The Osprey looks fine because, coincidentally, those blocky, derpy designs caused by the constraints due to the dock modules happen to be... how Teladi are supposed to build ships. It's (was) their style. So the design itself might be ugly as sin, depending on tastes, but it happens to fit them perfectly well.

[marksnake]

Yeah, first thing I notoced when took a look at the shipyard and warf is that designwise ships look just ugly. Postet about it on day one. Second maaaassive downgrade is music. Thankfully music if fixable with mods. For ships I can say the same.

It looks like Egosoft lost entierty of their design and creative staff.

1+

And don`t forget the ugly weapon and explosion effects. Something went wrong here...

[lordmuck]

The osprey that looks like a brick and a tail stuck to it ? :/

What I cannot get my head around is how they are currently in the future and the ships they have would get 1 shot with their old models. They have not advanced they went back to stone age.

I would love to hear what egosoft are going to say at these cheap/quickly made/poor/lack of thought/did not follow the "lore" and style of the factions / models that look like a students assignment.

They said somewhere in their latest video that they listened to some stuff people were saying and added something.. cant remember exactly.. So why the F are they not listening to 90% of the people that bought the game now ? and redo these horrid models. Just 1 per moth redo a model and stuff

do you remember this by any chance? or this? yes, i prefer a brick with wings over fancy overcomplicated XR ships at any time. they actually look like a viable spacecraft....

While they are still questionable... lol . .Yeah I like X3 more. :/ sorry

[plynak]

The osprey that looks like a brick and a tail stuck to it ? :/

What I cannot get my head around is how they are currently in the future and the ships they have would get 1 shot with their old models. They have not advanced they went back to stone age.

I would love to hear what egosoft are going to say at these cheap/quickly made/poor/lack of thought/did not follow the "lore" and style of the factions / models that look like a students assignment.

They said somewhere in their latest video that they listened to some stuff people were saying and added something.. cant remember exactly.. So why the F are they not listening to 90% of the people that bought the game now ? and redo these horrid models. Just 1 per moth redo a model and stuff

do you remember this by any chance? or this? yes, i prefer a brick with wings over fancy overcomplicated XR ships at any time. they actually look like a viable spacecraft....

While they are still questionable... lol . .Yeah I like X3 more. :/ sorry

You are not alone. Those X3 designs are a masterpiece. Yes, Teladi ships looks strange, but as mentioned, it was their style. It was unique and fit the lore perfecty. I really hate these new designs, especialy Teladi. They were terrible in Rebirth and they are terrible now. I mean flying mushrooms? Really?