Boarding!

[heratik]

I did a quick forum search and didn't find anything on this subject.

Once I discovered boarding in X3TC it quickly became my favourite past-time, and i was constantly pushing my limits with complex dual simultaneous boardings and Xenon boardings etc.

I am really hoping that boarding is going to be a fully supported gameplay mechanic in X4 and was wondering if the topic had been addressed by Egosoft yet?!

Cheers

heratik

[birdtable]

As you put it so perfectly heratik ... "complex dual simultaneous boardings" .. I enjoyed it in X3 and even more so in Rebirth... I do hope this activity is continued and even expanded in X4.

[Ezarkal]

From the question thread stickied to this forum:

How will boarding work now that the player isn't limited to a single ship?

Boarding is still under development, but yes there are more ways for us to approach this now.

I doubt there is more information out at this point.

[heratik]

Ah, a fellow pirate

I never played rebirth, had a few years hiatus from the X series but X4 looks like it's going to drag me back in.

Wad boarding still a mod for rebirth? or was it scripted in from the beginning?

[heratik]

Thanks, Ezarkal!

[JoeVN09]

Boarding was a late addition to X3, but it enabled so many additional styles of play. I hope Egosoft integrates it early on.

[Wanted Bob]

Ah, a fellow pirate

I never played rebirth, had a few years hiatus from the X series but X4 looks like it's going to drag me back in.

Wad boarding still a mod for rebirth? or was it scripted in from the beginning?

Boarding was in Rebirth as well. I didn't dive into it too much so I might not be the best source for an opinion, but it seemed to be a more fleshed out process (you had to target specific subsystems on the capital ship in order for the marines to board properly).

[sd_jasper]

Boarding was in Rebirth as well. I didn't dive into it too much so I might not be the best source for an opinion, but it seemed to be a more fleshed out process (you had to target specific subsystems on the capital ship in order for the marines to board properly).

I never got into boarding until Rebirth. My attempts in X3:AP didn't go well.

In XR, you have to disable the engine and jumpdrive, then you SHOULD disable the turrets (or they will shoot down your marine drop pods before they begin the assault).

You could also hack the ship to disable it for a time, and then during the assault you would be asked to destroy a surface element or hack something to aid your marines, which sped things up and decreased the chance that marines would be killed.

Overall it was pretty fun, but some aspects felt they could be refined. The hacking over and over got old, and it was always a pain to be asked to destroy the capital shield generator(s), since you knew you would have to get them fixed once the ship was yours.... but them's the breaks.

[A5PECT]

Overall it was pretty fun, but some aspects felt they could be refined. The hacking over and over got old, and it was always a pain to be asked to destroy the capital shield generator(s), since you knew you would have to get them fixed once the ship was yours.... but them's the breaks.

Requiring surface element destruction to ensure you don't lose any marines did get very tedious.

I definitely see the value in it as a game mechanic, but I'd really like it if with strong enough boarding forces, you can simply skip those little distractions. After all, a big part of leveling up marines in X3 was to reduce the collateral damage dealt to the boarding target during an operation. Plus it would create a nice sense of progression starting with a batch of recruits that need every bit of help they can get to capture a ship, then training them up into an elite marine squad that can take an entire ship on their own.

[sd_jasper]

Requiring surface element destruction to ensure you don't lose any marines did get very tedious.

Yeah, one trick I often used was to find the "blind spot" and see if I could hack the ship. IMO I would love to see "stealth" drones, or the like so I can hack more and get those ships w/o destroying everything first!

[heratik]

I definitely see the value in it as a game mechanic, but I'd really like it if with strong enough boarding forces, you can simply skip those little distractions. After all, a big part of leveling up marines in X3 was to reduce the collateral damage dealt to the boarding target during an operation. Plus it would create a nice sense of progression starting with a batch of recruits that need every bit of help they can get to capture a ship, then training them up into an elite marine squad that can take an entire ship on their own.

I can't speak for the Rebirth system, but, i agree, this is what I liked about the X3TC system, you overloaded yourself with green marines and by boarding weaker targets and working your way through harder ones, taking some losses on the way, you earned yourself 20+ solid marines capable of taking Xenon, and the feeling of achievement was immense (as was the time invested in marine training!)

[Ezarkal]

What i didn't like about boarding in XR was the "support minigame".
Quick explanation for those that didn't play:
Through the boarding operation, your co-pilot would generate a list of side-objectives that would allow you to help the boarding progress.
They came in two types: Hacking and subsystem destruction. Succeed 5 of them and the target is yours, and your squad is intact (unless you're hitting a target much stronger than you)
1- Hacking was fine, except that it left you as a sitting duck while you were piloting your hacker drone to "mess up" with the ship's defense. Not advisable unless the whole area is deserted.
2-Destroying subsystems was ok, too, but it too often made you destroy the precious drone launch pad and all it's drones, or other systems that could be interesting to keep functional (capital shields and so on).

The idea in itself is interesting, as it allow you to contribute to boarding and minimize your losses. Plus, if you are good, you can actually board targets with sensibly higher boarding resistance than your boarding strength.

The issue is they are impossible to ignore. Even with an overwhelming force (80+ boarding strength higher than the target's resistance, we're talking about massive difference here), those mission objectives would be emitted from time to time and ignoring them would result in substantial losses to your boarding squad. I remember I tested boarding while ignoring thr minigame: I lost most of an experience marine squad while boarding a rahanas tradeship (boarding strength around 100 vs 15 resistance). I lost the majority of my squad and barely managed to succeed in boarding the easiest target of the game because of my co-pilot's say-so.

So the general idea is good, but it becomes quickly problematic when you have to constantly keep pampering your carefully trained boarding squad on every single boarding, even when it should be able to completely overpower the target.

Thankfully, there were a few mods that were made to address this issue. But it's still a major flaw in my opinion.

To the devs: Should you chose to keep boarding in X4 similar to what it is in XR, then please, please make it so we can ignore these secondary objectives when our boarding squad is consequent enough to overpower the target.

[Sparky Sparkycorp]

but some aspects felt they could be refined. The hacking over and over got old

I enjoyed boarding in XR so this was the reason I never carried a hacking drone in the Skunk. Having no drone means no hacking mission is offered while boarding.

I am not sure what a successful hack mid-boarding achieves. Hopefully it offers a temporary bonus to marine attack strength, and thus supports taking on tougher targets with a weaker force. But having no drone isn't a problem if we have 10+ more Attack Strength than the target's Boarding Resistance.

[Nanook]

...
I am not sure what a successful hack mid-boarding achieves. Hopefully it offers a temporary bonus to marine attack strength, and thus supports taking on tougher targets with a weaker force....

I think all it did was prevent the game from penalizing you for ignoring it. As Ezarkal pointed out, you could have an overwhelming boarding force and still suffer catastrophic losses if you didn't follow the orders of your copilot (which is a silly way to do things, IMO).

i found boarding to be rather tedious and yet way too easy after I got a powerful boarding crew. The boarding op has very little room for player imagination or options. You do it Yisha's way or fail. Despite their flaws, I enjoyed the X3 versions of boarding a lot more.

[Sparky Sparkycorp]

...
I am not sure what a successful hack mid-boarding achieves. Hopefully it offers a temporary bonus to marine attack strength, and thus supports taking on tougher targets with a weaker force....

I think all it did was prevent the game from penalizing you for ignoring it. As Ezarkal pointed out, you could have an overwhelming boarding force and still suffer catastrophic losses if you didn't follow the orders of your copilot (which is a silly way to do things, IMO).

i found boarding to be rather tedious and yet way too easy after I got a powerful boarding crew. The boarding op has very little room for player imagination or options. You do it Yisha's way or fail. Despite their flaws, I enjoyed the X3 versions of boarding a lot more.

Thanks for the info.

It seems like not carrying a hacking drone is a game hack of itself!

[sd_jasper]

I enjoyed boarding in XR so this was the reason I never carried a hacking drone in the Skunk. Having no drone means no hacking mission is offered while boarding.

Don't get me wrong, while I thought that the way the hacking was done was repetitive, I actually REALLY like it for boarding. It gives the option to take a ship that isn't completely busted up. It speeds up the process (hacking a single node takes a lot less time than destroying a surface element if that element still has shields. Plus, it's pretty simple.

And NOTHING is better than hacking a ship BEFORE starting boarding. Guns, engines, shields all disabled, and ripe for the picking!

[Sparky Sparkycorp]

I enjoyed boarding in XR so this was the reason I never carried a hacking drone in the Skunk. Having no drone means no hacking mission is offered while boarding.

Don't get me wrong, while I thought that the way the hacking was done was repetitive, I actually REALLY like it for boarding. It gives the option to take a ship that isn't completely busted up. It speeds up the process (hacking a single node takes a lot less time than destroying a surface element if that element still has shields. Plus, it's pretty simple.

And NOTHING is better than hacking a ship BEFORE starting boarding. Guns, engines, shields all disabled, and ripe for the picking!

When you put it that way

With hacking during boarding, does it reduce the number Yisha missions to destroy surface elements?

With hacking before boarding, how long does it disable those modules for roughly? Long enough for the entire boarding Op? Does doing this reduce the targets Boarding Resistance like if we'd destroyed the element?

Sorry for question overload!

[sd_jasper]

When you put it that way

With hacking during boarding, does it reduce the number Yisha missions to destroy surface elements?

I'm not sure. I thought that it was the same amount, but each time you may be told to destroy something or hack. But I just took a Light Sul by hacking first, and IIRC I just had to destroy 3 things before the ship was mine.

With hacking before boarding, how long does it disable those modules for roughly? Long enough for the entire boarding Op? Does doing this reduce the targets Boarding Resistance like if we'd destroyed the element?

I don't know the exact time, but it is a good amount. I think it might treat them like "destroyed" and when they come back is based on repair time (maybe?). Because I thought I recall some element recovering faster than others.

I know that for the most part it usually does last for the whole time (at least most of the elements.

Not sure about boarding resist. Because I tend to only check after I've got the ship ready. I'll try to check next time.

Note that you still have to destroy the Jump Drive and Engines before boarding (even if they are disabled b/c of hack). This is something that I would like to see improved on.[/code]

[gbjbaanb]

To the devs: Should you chose to keep boarding in X4 similar to what it is in XR, then please, please make it so we can ignore these secondary objectives when our boarding squad is consequent enough to overpower the target.

Oh god no, if they make boarding anything like what it is in X:R then they need to start again. Boarding in X3 was exciting, using wasp missiles to keep the defences occupied while keeping the shields down and letting the marines do their thing was good.

X:R is more like their silly minigames. Less of a simulation and more of a timewasting clicker game you get on the phones.

[Sparky Sparkycorp]

Oh god no, if they make boarding anything like what it is in X:R then they need to start again. Boarding in X3 was exciting, using wasp missiles to keep the defences occupied while keeping the shields down and letting the marines do their thing was good.

X:R is more like their silly minigames. Less of a simulation and more of a timewasting clicker game you get on the phones.

It's different kinds of excitement. X3 allows the player to trick dumb turrets into shooting missiles in a scenario they've already proved they have no intention of killing the ship because marines are in-flight.

XR circumvents that by forcing the player to do something practical to neutralise the turrets. For which there are many options*. Whilst having many more turrets with independent targeting, making tricking them more complex.

*Player attacking surface elements, attacks by other player ships (which prioritise surface element's by default), hacking before or after initiating the boarding mission, deployment of limpet mines before or after initiating boarding, overloading the targeting computers with many non-pod targets.