Elite: Dangerous looks better already!

[SteveMill]

Don't give up Paul. Not come across this or heard of it. You are right though - this game is being released way too early. However this is nothing like XR. It's got problems but is close to the basic features working and they will get built upon.

[matthewfarmery]

it does sound that the game is coming out too early, is the game been rushed? (which sounds probable) as the game sounds like it needs at least another year or two before it's ready. rushing the game out this early isn't going to help matters, me thinks ED isn't going to live up to the great expectations of most players, and on top of that, if there are server issues. I think unless the devs justify this early release, its going to put some major egg on them all, including DB himself.

maybe they have run out of money and needed to replace it this early? but it does seem to be a bad oman to release it too soon.

[Sparky Sparkycorp]

and they will get built upon.

I hope so but that sounds rather optimistic after Frontier 2.

[kurush]

maybe they have run out of money and needed to replace it this early? but it does seem to be a bad oman to release it too soon.

At this point the game really holds only the nostalgic value as it has basically the same gameplay as oolite had and even lacks some features we had in FFE (i.e. a proper auto-pilot). I'm pretty sure DB already milked most of the people who care about that nostalgic value by doing his bait and switch and I'm really curious who would jump into it after the release...

[Grim Lock]

Thats funny since i went into this game blind, it holds no nostalgic value for me, i do agree that it could have done with more development time to implement more features, but im enjoying whats currently there enough to justify buying it, i do think that once it gets released will be stable and playable enough, that is if they maintain their current momentum updating and patching the game.

[muppetts]

maybe they have run out of money and needed to replace it this early? but it does seem to be a bad oman to release it too soon.

At this point the game really holds only the nostalgic value as it has basically the same gameplay as oolite had and even lacks some features we had in FFE (i.e. a proper auto-pilot). I'm pretty sure DB already milked most of the people who care about that nostalgic value by doing his bait and switch and I'm really curious who would jump into it after the release...

Proper auto-pilot would be great, select a destination and off you go, which you can break into, freelancer did it well.

Elite D is mostly based on investor money, the kickstarter funds being more of a proof that a viable audience is there, so they have to push the the game out in 'early release' if you will to start a revenue stream. If they had the money Star C has maybe they would spend more time in dev.

[SteveMill]

Thats funny since i went into this game blind, it holds no nostalgic value for me, i do agree that it could have done with more development time to implement more features, but im enjoying whats currently there enough to justify buying it, i do think that once it gets released will be stable and playable enough, that is if they maintain their current momentum updating and patching the game.

That's good to hear. I have real fears how it will be received and reviewed in its current condition. It will need a steady stream of new customers to deliver the extra content.

I'll probably wait a few days after launch before getting back into it.

[Steel]

Thanks for the info (and Hi everyone )

I'll keep my eye on this thread and take another look post release. I haven't got the time to Beta test atm but I can certainly see me in the online game once its stable.

[SteveMill]

it does sound that the game is coming out too early, is the game been rushed? (which sounds probable) as the game sounds like it needs at least another year or two before it's ready. rushing the game out this early isn't going to help matters, me thinks ED isn't going to live up to the great expectations of most players, and on top of that, if there are server issues. I think unless the devs justify this early release, its going to put some major egg on them all, including DB himself.

maybe they have run out of money and needed to replace it this early? but it does seem to be a bad oman to release it too soon.

It is being release too early. Maybe 3-6 months. But it's 'early' in terms of features not 'early' in terms of working like XR.

Feature-lite not feature-broken.

[Ketraar]

But that works both ways too btw. You cant have broken features if there are no features.

But as of now, no one should get "surprised" on what to expect. If people buy into it not knowing what they will get, its their own damn fault.

MFG

Ketraar

[pjknibbs]

It does have to be admitted that Frontier, a game 20 years old, arguably had more content than ED does right now--a much wider variety of missions to take, for a start, and a much more satisfying sense of exploration IMHO. ED is a good framework, but they need to add some real substance to that in the months post-release.

One other thing: who at Frontier Developments decided that the common or garden starter ship should have only 4 units of cargo capacity, thus making trading almost impossible in the early game?

[SteveMill]

But that works both ways too btw. You cant have broken features if there are no features.

But as of now, no one should get "surprised" on what to expect. If people buy into it not knowing what they will get, its their own damn fault.

MFG

Ketraar

As you probably actually know already, Feature-lite and feature-free are not the same thing.

If they were, your point would be awesome.

[SteveMill]

It does have to be admitted that Frontier, a game 20 years old, arguably had more content than ED does right now--a much wider variety of missions to take, for a start, and a much more satisfying sense of exploration IMHO. ED is a good framework, but they need to add some real substance to that in the months post-release.

One other thing: who at Frontier Developments decided that the common or garden starter ship should have only 4 units of cargo capacity, thus making trading almost impossible in the early game?

Yea - that's why I place it so far as 1988-89 gameplay but with better graphics.

Didn't the Frontier starts have small cargo bays?

Courier missions and cargo delivery missions are reasonably profitable for the starter ship (or were previously) but with only 100 credits its a real start at the bottom situation.

[Nyax]

One other thing: who at Frontier Developments decided that the common or garden starter ship should have only 4 units of cargo capacity, thus making trading almost impossible in the early game?

Couple of things about that-

1) All the ships cargo bays are a lot smaller this time around, HOWEVER that's probably related to the fact that most weapons/ upgrades etc. add to the weight of your ship, but no longer take up cargo space.

2) it is possible to upgrade your ships cargo hold. You can by cargo racks that are pretty cheap and can double (or more?) the capacity of your hold (just did it for my Hauler.) The trouble here is game information is still sorely lacking and for reasons best be known to themselves Frontier chose to make the vast majority of upgrades very difficult to find.

If you're anywhere near the core systems TZ Arietis 7 light years from Tau Ceti has a very good selection (Frame shift drives, expanded cargo racks, upgraded power plants.... Almost everything)

[Avis]

..Jumped to the system, came out of hyperspace--and suddenly none of the menus work anymore....

I had this happen to me once, I couldn't select anything in any menu, I filed a ticket at the time but have never been able to recreate the problem.

How it happened for me was I was in SC and went to activate the system map, at that exact moment I was interdicted and all my menu navigation was killed.

[pjknibbs]

2) it is possible to upgrade your ships cargo hold. You can by cargo racks that are pretty cheap and can double (or more?) the capacity of your hold (just did it for my Hauler.) The trouble here is game information is still sorely lacking and for reasons best be known to themselves Frontier chose to make the vast majority of upgrades very difficult to find.

If you're anywhere near the core systems TZ Arietis 7 light years from Tau Ceti has a very good selection (Frame shift drives, expanded cargo racks, upgraded power plants.... Almost everything)

I know you can upgrade your cargo, but it (a) takes money and (b) requires you to replace stuff you might actually want to keep, like your discovery scanner or your shields. (Why they didn't make the scanner a utility slot mount rather than the useless garbage they *do* have there is another puzzle). By the way, guns and shields never *did* take up cargo space in any Elite game--fuel did in Frontier/FFE, but generally you only needed to carry a couple of tons of it, and even the wimpiest ships usually had at least 10 cargo capacity.

As for being near the core systems, I'm currently out around Eravate and I'm trying to figure out a route that will take me back Sol way--I seem to be having real trouble with jump range and keep running into dead ends. I have just about enough money to buy a Hauler, which doubles my cargo capacity and increases the jump range to nearly 10 LY at the expense of losing a laser mount and some speed, so I might well go for that and see how I go.

Overall, I think the start in the game as it stands is far too slow and sticky--I'm around 5 hours in and I reckon I've only earned about 50k credits through various means.

[Sparky Sparkycorp]

By the way, guns and shields never *did* take up cargo space in any Elite game--fuel did in Frontier/FFE, but generally you only needed to carry a couple of tons of it, and even the wimpiest ships usually had at least 10 cargo capacity.

I don't think this is correct for F:E2 or F:FE. In those games, I am sure that cargo capacity was the primary means of ship balance preventing the biggest ships being put on the smallest hulls.

The Scanner was 1 tonne, shields were 4 tonnes each and the 20 MW Beam Laser was 75 tonnes, for example.


(unless I have miss-understood your wording and you "*did*" applied to the older, old games?)



Edit: typos in abbreviations for earlier games.

[Grim Lock]

Overall, I think the start in the game as it stands is far too slow and sticky--I'm around 5 hours in and I reckon I've only earned about 50k credits through various means.

My first steps in the game we're kindof slow like that, but by the time the last wipe came around i took me a about two hours to get into a hauler and after spending an evening peddling gold and superconductors im already up to a cobra.

But i do find this a curious comment in todays insta-gratification world on which older gamers like us generally frown upon.

But hey if you don't want to like thats your prerogative.

[Nyax]

I know you can upgrade your cargo, but it (a) takes money and (b) requires you to replace stuff you might actually want to keep, like your discovery scanner or your shields.

No what I'm saying is you can replace the cargo rack you have in that slot with another cargo rack which has double the capacity. I upgraded my hauler to have a capacity of 16 without having to loose any other equipment by selling my existing cargo racks and replacing them with new ones with double the capacity. Unfortunately in the current absence of a manual, there's no way of anyone knowing that upgrade exists, and for some reason they seem to be stupidly rare (TZ Arietis is to date the only system I've found that offers this, presumably there must be others but I've yet to find them)

(Why they didn't make the scanner a utility slot mount rather than the useless garbage they *do* have there is another puzzle). By the way, guns and shields never *did* take up cargo space in any Elite game--fuel did in Frontier/FFE, but generally you only needed to carry a couple of tons of it, and even the wimpiest ships usually had at least 10 cargo capacity.

Actually in both frontier and FFE guns DID take up cargo space as did virtually all upgrades. A LOT of it. The 1MW pulse laser took only 1 tonne of cargo space up whereas the 1 MW Beam laser took up 4 or 5. the 4 MW beam laser took up 20 and the mighty large plasma accelerator took up a massive 900 tonnes of cargo. Shield generators took up 4 tonnes each, energy bombs and escape pods about the same. Missiles 1 tonne each for some reason even though they were mounted outside the ship...

I seem to be having real trouble with jump range and keep running into dead ends. I have just about enough money to buy a Hauler, which doubles my cargo capacity and increases the jump range to nearly 10 LY at the expense of losing a laser mount and some speed, so I might well go for that and see how I go.

yes I had much the same problem. I ended up selling the guns to lighten my ship and give me that little bit more jump range to allow me to get out of the starting 'cluster'. As for finding a route- top-undocumented-tip: Find the system the want to go to in the galaxy map and select it as your destination. The game will plot out a route for you in yellow (assuming it's possible and within a certain number of jumps.) Unfortunately as soon as you target the first system on the route the game will forget the route, but still it's a very handy tool when you have a limited jump range. The game map also has some very handy trade route functionality that is helpful when trying to figure out where to buy/ sell certain goods.

Overall, I think the start in the game as it stands is far too slow and sticky--I'm around 5 hours in and I reckon I've only earned about 50k credits through various means.

Yeah there are currently 3 main stumbling blocks in the game at the start-
1) the jump range of your starting ship is horribly limiting
2) The Ludicrous rareness of upgrades like frame shift drives means there's not much you can do about this
3) No manual yet to let people know that in many cases there are in game solutions to the problems you might be having.

[pjknibbs]

But i do find this a curious comment in todays insta-gratification world on which older gamers like us generally frown upon.

There is an absolute ocean between wanting "instant gratification" and wanting progress to not be frustratingly slow. They slow things down plenty enough in other ways--e.g. by forcing you to sit through the bloody "let's turn your ship round now" animation every sodding time you take off.

In any case, I've managed to work my way down to Sol region now (although I notice you need a permit to actually visit it...no idea how to get one of those!) after spending about 6 hours so far today. Total assets: about 150k with 10k cash in hand. Tempted to replace my discovery scanner with a refinery and try some mining, and if that doesn't work, I think I may be done with the game.