[MOD] [TC/AP] X3 Rebalance Mod (XRM) - Total conversion - v1.30d (02.12.13)

[paulwheeler]

heee me and what do we do about my problem?? http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/25 ... 00001.png/

I'm only on my phone so can't really see what's going on in that picture. Can you describe it?

[killerog]

I am on my desktop and cant really see what's going on either :/ Picture is to small really.

Paul got a quick question. Would I be able to make a version of your mod downloadable by my tool along with some of the more popular addon packs(can host on my site as well) ? Want to give my new fake patch install method a go and your mod seems like a good enough place as any to start testing it with.

Also I hope to make a compatible version of my new mining script to replace my KOG mod once I see what needs changing.

[mulahey]

Playing AP. Is XRM compatible with TCM Tubeless Complex Mod? If so, does it go to the Addon dir under the next free highest number? Thanks!

[Strike-Météor]

this is a good new picture I hope so that can help me because I mess with.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/44 ... 0001n.png/

[x3fan5322]

Edit: nvm found the problem.

[Undesirable]

Is the Aquilo supposed to have 2GJ shields as opposed to the other M7M ships' 1GJ? If so, what does it trade off to balance the extra tank?

[Chaos Master]

this is a good new picture I hope so that can help me because I mess with.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/44 ... 0001n.png/

What exactly is the problem in this image?
Is it that your ship is launching fighter drones automatically?
That would be part of MARS if I'm correct.

C-est quois exactement le probleme dans cette image?
Est que c-est que ton vesseau lance des drones de combat tout seul?
Si je me trompe pas, c-est le script MARS qui fait ca, et c-est parfaitment normale.
Si c-est pas ca le probleme, explique nous ton probleme en detail s.v.p

excuse mon francais, j'essai simplement de t'aider



/Edit:
totally forgot why I came here in the first place ...
I read here, and realized myself, that subsequent ship upgrades (at least cargo-bay extensions) get cheaper as you go, instead of more expensive.
But I was playing around with the (improved) MK3 script (for example MK3s that have ware class L will constantly try buying jumpdrives which don't fit in XRM, and waste a lot of time flying to Terracorp HQ or where ever the nearest jumpdrive seller is located, once they reach level 12, so I added a condition to make it compatible with xrm)
Today I noticed, that one of my MK3s is using up all the money he earned, and it turns out he was buying cargo-bay extensions.
It's a mercury super freighter and during the run I observed, he spent 320112 credits to upgrade from 7842 to 7899, so each upgrade cost 5616 credits.

so long story short, manually upgrading cargo-bay extensions is ridiculously cheap, but when an MK3 does it automatically it costs a fortune.

Also upgrading cargo bay one unit at a time by hand is cheaper than all in one shot, apparently
really confusing ....

[MacrameGod]

lmao Dude, we're idiots =D You posting this picture made me realize why mine wasn't loading either.

Take all the scripts out of your scripts_AP folder and put them in the scripts folder. Then go start a new game. It'll load this time =D

Derp. The second I saw it I was like "no there is no way this is the cause...", moved the scripts and felt completely stupid haha

Holy smokes you're right! Good catch. The mod is working now and it looks fantastic. Thanks for all your help everybody.

[paulwheeler]

this is a good new picture I hope so that can help me because I mess with.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/44 ... 0001n.png/

I'm still not sure what the problem is. I can't see anything wrong with that screen shot. Please describe what the problem is.

[paulwheeler]

so long story short, manually upgrading cargo-bay extensions is ridiculously cheap, but when an MK3 does it automatically it costs a fortune.

Also upgrading cargo bay one unit at a time by hand is cheaper than all in one shot, apparently
really confusing ....

Its a darn sight more expensive for cargo bay extension when manually upgrading than it is in vanilla.

The mechanic of how the game works out the price encrease/decrease depending on relval is hard coded. The only options are leave it as it is, or reduce the price of extensions back down to near vanilla levels.

[paulwheeler]

Is the Aquilo supposed to have 2GJ shields as opposed to the other M7M ships' 1GJ? If so, what does it trade off to balance the extra tank?

It has the same shielding as the Gannet, but I agree could probably use a bit of tweaking to make it a little tamer. It is Otas though which means it will have a slight advantage over other race ships, in the same mannar as the ATF. I'll look at it for 1.29.

[paulwheeler]

Playing AP. Is XRM compatible with TCM Tubeless Complex Mod? If so, does it go to the Addon dir under the next free highest number? Thanks!

Yes it is. It can go at any number above vanilla in the addon folder.

[paulwheeler]

I am on my desktop and cant really see what's going on either :/ Picture is to small really.

Paul got a quick question. Would I be able to make a version of your mod downloadable by my tool along with some of the more popular addon packs(can host on my site as well) ? Want to give my new fake patch install method a go and your mod seems like a good enough place as any to start testing it with.

Also I hope to make a compatible version of my new mining script to replace my KOG mod once I see what needs changing.

Hi Killerog,

Yes, sure you can, as long as you are able to keep it up-to-date when I release updates.

[Strike-Météor]

you see in the picture not full of missile missile launch that are continuous while I use missile firelancec'est to normal right?

[paulwheeler]

you see in the picture not full of missile missile launch that are continuous while I use missile firelancec'est to normal right?

I've had one or two reports before of continuous missile launches. I'm not certain if this is exactly what you are experiencing as its difficult to see in the screen shot.

I have no idea what causes it. Its not the XRM as not many people experience this. If there was a problem with the XRM everyone would be gettings it. I certainly don't get it. I can only assume it is a script that you have installed which is causing it.

Please note - the AI in AP fires missiles much, much more frequently than TC. This is a vanilla design and nothing to do with the XRM. All the XRM does is increase refire rates and numbers of missiles ships are spawned with.

[Strike-Météor]

that's exactly what is difficult RNs can do it too and it gets worse with cyclone missile and it affects alliance building.

[killerog]

I am on my desktop and cant really see what's going on either :/ Picture is to small really.

Paul got a quick question. Would I be able to make a version of your mod downloadable by my tool along with some of the more popular addon packs(can host on my site as well) ? Want to give my new fake patch install method a go and your mod seems like a good enough place as any to start testing it with.

Also I hope to make a compatible version of my new mining script to replace my KOG mod once I see what needs changing.

Hi Killerog,

Yes, sure you can, as long as you are able to keep it up-to-date when I release updates.

That shouldn't be a problem Ill get around to sorting it out in the next few days.

[Chaos Master]

so long story short, manually upgrading cargo-bay extensions is ridiculously cheap, but when an MK3 does it automatically it costs a fortune.

Also upgrading cargo bay one unit at a time by hand is cheaper than all in one shot, apparently
really confusing ....

Its a darn sight more expensive for cargo bay extension when manually upgrading than it is in vanilla.

The mechanic of how the game works out the price encrease/decrease depending on relval is hard coded. The only options are leave it as it is, or reduce the price of extensions back down to near vanilla levels.

I wasn't referring at all to the price difference to vanilla upgrades (I haven't played either vanilla TC or AP and Reunion is too long ago to remember

what I was trying to point out is that when manually installing cargo-bay extensions the prices seem to decrease for subsequent extensions (in case of a mercury superfreighter from 1404 to 1000 credits (and curiously if you install them one by one it is cheaper than installing them all at once). But when an MK3 trader installs them automatically over time as he earns money and can afford them, they seem to become more expensive.
As I pointed out above, this one trader payed 5616 per upgrade for the 57 upgrades from 7842 to 7899 cargo bay units, which is much more than you would ever pay if you did it manually.

I just now realized that 5616 is exactly 4 times 1404, so maybe there is a bug in the MK3 software that charges 4 times the actual price, and not a problem with xrm, I will have to check out the MK3 code again...



/Edit:

I think I get it now

5616 is the default price of upgrades, so 'get price of ware' will return 5616.
But when actually buying the upgrades the price is lower, depending on your ship and how many upgrades you have already bought.


/Edit2:

So the formula seem so be (for XRM)
1404+(1000-1404) / max_upgrades * current_upgrades, to get the price of the next upgrade.

1404 being one fourth of the price 'get price of ware' returns.

so there seem to be two values, one is the base price (1404 or 5616, confused about the duality here) and the max price which is currently 1000.

So the problem with MK3 is that it doesn't take the changing price into consideration and works with the price 'get price of ware' returns, which oddly is 4 times the price used for the formula (at least in XRM), basically keeping any MK3 from leveling up after it reached a certain level (at least the improved MK3) until it fully upgraded it's cargo-bay, which will basically take forever.
So anyone using the improved MK3 on XRM will have to make adjustments to the code to make it compatible with XRM.

[paulwheeler]

The price getting lower the more you upgrade is hard coded unfortunately. There is a cross over - below a certain relval, the prices increase, above that level they decrease. The cross-over relval is not much higher than vanilla which is a bit annoying really. I like having super-expensive tunings. It makes you think more about what to spend your money on.

[Chaos Master]

yeah, especially with TLs
is the convenience of being able to carry an extra station around worth 15million?

those threshold values seem to be the max_price things, which is 1000 for cargobay extensions, 2000 for rudder optimisations and 3000 for engine tunings.

you have the formula I provided above:

average_price/4+(max_price-average_price/4) / max_tunings * current_amount_of_tunings.

If average_price/4 becomes greater than max_price, the expression in parenthesis becomes negative and thus subsequent tunings become cheaper instead of more expensive.