x3-LAN-Multiplayer (Egosoft, READ!!!)

[Tiedyeguy]

AIUI the magic letters EGOSOFT by their name does not mean they are making official company responses to your queries. They are here as fans who happen to work for the company, not official company spokespeople. Mods/Egosoftees please correct me if I am wrong.

True for the moderators. People with Egosoft badges under their names are Egosoft employees, and can be taken to speak truly on Egosoft matters. I don't know that I would call them "official spokespeople" though.

There are a few exceptions here. Off the top of my head, I believe Pjknibbs has the "Magic Letters" but does not work for EGOSOFT. IIRC, he got them because he got "promoted" to "Site Admin" which has a fringe benefit of "Arcane Scriptures".

[eladan]

There are a few exceptions here. Off the top of my head, I believe Pjknibbs has the "Magic Letters" but does not work for EGOSOFT. IIRC, he got them because he got "promoted" to "Site Admin" which has a fringe benefit of "Arcane Scriptures".

I was hoping no one would mention him.

Truth be told, I don't know if he collects an Egosoft wage for what he does or not. In general, my statement holds though.

[Nova Scotia]

I never played before x reunion so are you saying that the earlier x games were not playable withought seta ???

Think what is being said is that it would take a very, very long time to get anywhere. It would make the larger ships almost unusable. Or you'd have to rejig the speeds of everything in the game just so you didn't have to spend an hour crossing Maelstrom to find the gate!

FWIW I use SETA a lot but never to make money. Just to get from A to B in less than a day.


M

Oh I see your point , I have had my hull so paper thin that doing more than 30 clicks was pushing it,jumping from gate to gate ,running out of ecell ,sneaking around pirates to aquire more,when I finally made it to repair I felt like a champ not sure if speeding up time would have been the same sence of emersion.Now my personal ships all have after burners
.Unlikely I would find any one with my play style to hang with even if the X world became multi player

[Rapier]

Many times a member including myself post something, and the first word
that comes out is "Its can't be done, we have no funds"
or "it will never happen, not enough money to pay staff"

Care to show where else this has happened except in response to requests for LAN/multiplayer/MMO? The response is the same for each of those, as the requirements are the same.

The frequency of that as a response is probably because threads on LAN/multiplayer/MMO are also frequent.

Er, you did, kind of, here:

but im also wondering about the creativity levels of egosoft,
see as they used the same Solar Power Plant for every race.

You have to keep in mind that ES have limited development time/money (For the purposes of this discussion, essentially time=money, so I'll leave off the money part for the rest of this reply.) Of necessity, they have to make choices about what to include and what not to. A really good example of this is cockpits - ES have stated that they themselves would like to have cockpits in the game, but they can't justify the relatively large amount of time required to create them - the rest of the game would suffer as a result. So, it's the same thing (admittedly on a smaller scale) with shipyards - if a new shipyard model was created, then there would be something else missing due to the loss of development time.

What you say there is spot on though, it's not about what Egosoft absolutely should or shouldn't do, it's about prioritising the use of the resources they do have.

AIUI the magic letters EGOSOFT by their name does not mean they are making official company responses to your queries. They are here as fans who happen to work for the company, not official company spokespeople. Mods/Egosoftees please correct me if I am wrong.

True for the moderators. People with Egosoft badges under their names are Egosoft employees, and can be taken to speak truly on Egosoft matters. I don't know that I would call them "official spokespeople" though.

Even where those employed by Egosoft post on these forums, it's not generally an 'official statement' (except in the obvious cases of announcements etc.). I treat it rather like talking to the staff in a shop; you'll get an honest response to the best of their knowledge and ability, but you shouldn't treat it as any kind of promise or contract.

[eladan]

Er, you did, kind of, here:

Why, so I did!

Although what I was saying was less 'can't be done' than, as you say, about prioritisation. It would be lovely, I'm sure, to have an X game with LAN/multiplayer (or as an MMO) with cockpits, different models for each object in the game, planet landings, and ability to walk around in stations (have I missed any?) and I'm sure if the funds ever came through to allow something like that, we might get to see it. As it stands, some features get the chop, even when the devs would like to see them in there.

[pjknibbs]

Truth be told, I don't know if he collects an Egosoft wage for what he does or not.

Boy, I *wish* I collected an Egosoft wage for this, but I don't! I'm as much a volunteer as the rest of you...I just volunteered to do a bit more, is all.

[TSM]

Truth be told, I don't know if he collects an Egosoft wage for what he does or not.

Boy, I *wish* I collected an Egosoft wage for this, but I don't! I'm as much a volunteer as the rest of you...I just volunteered to do a bit more, is all.

Be careful what you wish for ,part of how good this forum is so good is the Volunteer's.

As for X-MP, yes it would be nice, but some much of the basic gameplay of X would be lost due to the lack of SETA ect, I also like many like to Mod my game and having playing lots of other games modded in MP enviroment all having to have exact same versions = nightmare.

[Rednoahl]

I think Egosoft are going to have a hard time deciding what to do next. If they decide to design a new engine from the ground up in the current economic climate, and (looks quickly at game shelves) at a time when the vast majority of other games devs are using third party engines like havoc, unreal and renderware to create their games, I will have nothing but admiration for them since the engine stage is supposed to be the riskiest part of development. With PC's becoming more complicated to program for, whist also the range of PC's becoming more varied and while sales are going down on PC games, I personally think that it's much more likely that Egosoft will look towards a console port of X3 whilst looking at ways to streamline the interface rather than even considering MMO gaming; no matter how much I'd like to play XMMO.

As for the amount of people that would want to play an XMMO, stumping up a fee for doing so; I can't see it as being viable. I'd bet only 50% of this forums users would accept paying for the Aldrin missions, and of that 50% a good proportion would winge like mad about it. For the last few years I've been playing on a 360 having to pay for upgrades, and since I've been playing X3TC I never realised I had it so good.

[perkint]

If you check the announcement at the top of the stickies, there is a comment from Bernd that may be interpretted as meaning they are developing for PC and console.

I repeat - may be!

Tim

[Gazz]

It would be lovely, I'm sure, to have an X game with LAN/multiplayer (or as an MMO) with cockpits, different models for each object in the game, planet landings, and ability to walk around in stations (have I missed any?)

Probably missed hiring/educating crew, customisable ships (Darkstar One), the "energy triangle" from X-Wing, visible bubble shields, Total Annihilation RTS style controls for easily placed chains of orders/waypoints, gouvernors/advisors to do the menial chores like trading/building for you, and an autopilot that doesn't fly through asteroids.
And cookies in every game box.

[Carlo the Curious]

And cookies in every game box.

Can't cookies be optional? I think many players would prefer bite-size pizza pieces.

[perkint]

Can't cookies be optional? I think many players would prefer bite-size pizza pieces.

Do you really think anyone in Ego will give away pizza?

Has any piece of pizza, in the whole history of time, managed to leave Egosoft uneaten?



Tim

[andymac]

Are you suggesting that uneaten pizza is as rare as, say, an eEMPC or a tractor beam? [/not bitter]

[Rednoahl]

If you check the announcement at the top of the stickies, there is a comment from Bernd that may be interpretted as meaning they are developing for PC and console.

I repeat - may be!

Tim

I my memory serves me correctly, it was announced that X3 was going to come out on the old Xbox (and it was said to be an MMO.) That was obviously shelved, but it was that announcement that introduced me to the X series due to a rolling demo for it being so brilliant....it's only taken me three years to get a PC so I could play it

What little I know now makes me guess that the X engine, being programmed to use a single core has been the main thing that's stopped Egosoft porting their games now.....or maybe dev kit costs? In any case I rarely trust the word of devs these days after all the crap Peter Molyniux has come out with over the years, but yes you could interpret what Bernd says as that.

I didn't think Egosoft would let any pizza out of Germany, yet every pizza In my fridge freezer is made there!

[CBJ]

lots of stuff

You seem to have misinterpreted or misunderstood quite a lot of things. Rather than another quote-a-thon I'll just address a few points in general tems.

In the gaming industry it's the publishers not the developers who do most of the funding. Development studios that are not owned by publishers but still have sufficient funds to finance major projects on their own are few and far between.

Please show me where it was said that there was no publisher and/or no money to pay staff. I think you'll find that what was actually said was that in order for development of a given project to take place, there has to be money, which in turn means a publisher. The major point you've missed there is that a publisher may well be willing to fund something else but not the specific thing we were talking about, namely a LAN-based game, because there would be little or no additional income to be had from doing so.

Of course there are some things that will, in all likelihood, never happen but multi-player, which was the topic of this thread, isn't on that list. The circumstances in which it would be most likely to get developed were even explained.

You mentioned EVE. I don't know where you've got your figures from, but let's assume they are true. First, that's an MMO, which as already mentioned is pretty much the only way that multi-player is likely to find funding. And second, nobody ever suggested that MMOs can't be profitable, but they are risky. I can't remember the exact figure but I seem to remember reading that something like about 1 in 10 that gets developed actually ends up turning a profit. Those aren't great odds when you're trying to persuade someone to put up millions to fund a development project, even one that could potentially be very profitable if it were to be a success.

Egosoft has been to any number of games conventions (in Europe at least) usually as a guest of its publishers. As for advertising, that's something that publishers do. They only tend to TV advertising for the really "mass-market" products such as FPS games, but there have been numerous magazine adverts for X-series games (again, in Europe). One German games magazine I saw carried an advert for one of the X games that ran to 9-page starting from an inverted back cover; you don't get much more prominent than that! If US publishers aren't doing these things then that's up to them, though it has to be said that the US market is much more conservative, so US publishers tend to be very cautious about spending marketing money on anything "niche".

None of the above are negative statements in the sense you seem to be implying. They are just an attempt at explaining how the industry works, for the benefit of those who would like to understand why certain things aren't likely to happen. It may be a bit of a reality-check for the wide-eyed optimists out there who think absolutely anything's possible if you put your mind to it, but then a company that can hold on to the long-term dream of developing X-Online for over 10 years can hardly be called pessimistic either!

I don't know where you get the idea that Egosoft are about to vanish, nor what gives you the impression that "many" members share your view.

Egosoft was around in some form or other well before 1993. Your collection is not complete.

Finally, as someone already indicated was likely to be the case, I'm posting in this thread in my own time and in a personal capacity despite the tag under my name.

[CaptObvious]

What I'd like to see is like a mini-MMO, a dedicated server + clients setup. One person runs a dedicated server on quite a powerful machine and then 4 or 5 clients can connect to that PERSISTANT universe. The universe runs 24/7 whether the clients are connected or not. You get home from work/school - "Oh I wonder how my weed farms are doing?" - you log in, Bob's online and you decide to do some Xenon bashing together or maybe build a massive closed-loop complex together. That would be awesome.

[BigVern]

Maybe I'm missing something but can't say I've ever played a MMO or any sort of co-operative LAN mode either. Closest I've probably got is joining a Virtual Airline for FS2004, but even that got tedious after a bit.

While respecting the views of those who are suggesting an X MMO, personally I'm a confirmed "single player" gamer. The prospect of going on line just to do a mission only to have some spotty irk who's got round the Punkbuster protection spam me with 50 M6's holds no appeal whatsoever. If I want "co-operatve mode" I'll buy my own wing of M3's, thank you. If I'm going into combat, I want it to be to advance the story or my empire not just for the personal appendage comparison that seems to be Windows Live Gamerpoints (for example).

The X games are very much a personal voyage of discovery and achievement, played at the user's own pace. I want the universe and world I create to be persistent not come back to a server where everything is different each time I play.

[Tiedyeguy]

If I'm going into combat, I want it to be to advance the story or my empire not just for the personal appendage comparison that seems to be Windows Live Gamerpoints (for example).

Sounds like the Xbox joke HERE

[maphys]

The universe runs 24/7 whether the clients are connected or not

They'd have to make getting money even easier just to make up for the overnight losses. Or tone down the bad guys. Either way make the game more boring and less challenging just to allow people to leave it running for long periods unattended. Why would you want do that?

M

[s_mak]

Maybe perhaps of telling people that due to lack of funding, etc, etc, that an MMO/multiplayer can not be implemented, the devs should make a decision and an announcement what they plan to do next, as in their upcoming future projects. The original poster is right that the same answer to a persistent question is getting to be tiresome and also can potentially sent the wrong impression.

i think the devs are aware that everyone on this forum and anyone in the gaming community knows that space combat flight sims are still on the endanger species lists.

If the devs follow the development and post release of Galatic Civilizations 2 from Stardock, Stardock consistently asks its community whether they wish to see multi-player implemented, it tells them that it will only be done if enough wants it, otherwise, it will sacrifice the quality of single player experience. their response to the multi-player question is very different from how Egosoft is handling the same question. Stardock inspire faith and confidence from its community of players, while the answer that Egosoft gives does not.