some limited multiplayer support next... please please?

[CBJ]

You are kidding aren't you?

Nanook is a moderator. Best heed his words.

Barely three months after its release, X3:TC isn't on any shelves in America...

Er, that would be because it hasn't been published on DVD in the US. Any copies you see are because retailers have gone to the effort of importing it.

...and is already unavailable just about everywhere else.

Simply not true. In the UK Amazon, Game and PC World all have it in stock, for example.

[Wraithcat]

That is totally different from a game like X3:TC, which isn't even on the shelves 3 months after its release. Just look at all the "where is it" threads on here.

Most of the 'where is it' posts I've seen are from people in places it was not actually published. FWIW it is still on three out of four games shops I have been into in the last month or two.

Yes, these threads have invoved people from places like America, Canada and Australia. Seriously, who would want to distribute a game to backwaters like those?

[CBJ]

Seems you didn't get the memo. The game has, to date at least, only been released in download form (through Steam) in the US. There is an Australian version which, as far as I'm aware, is still available, as are the various European versions.

[Scarecrow]

Thank God for the backwaters.

....but we too have our ways. I'm expecting my copy from Gogamer in the next couple of days.

[Wraithcat]

You are kidding aren't you?

Nanook is a moderator. Best heed his words.

Yes, he is a moderator. So what? Is he also a bully, or the sort of person to ban me for poetic licence?

I made a deliberately over the top remark in relation to earlier comments posted on this thread and he misinterpreted them and seems to have taken them personally. Even he noted that the comments were made "obliquely".

Being a moderator, does not always equal being right.

Barely three months after its release, X3:TC isn't on any shelves in America...

Er, that would be because it hasn't been published on DVD in the US. Any copies you see are because retailers have gone to the effort of importing it..

And this doesn't worry you? The only reason they woudn't be able to get an American publisher is if all of them were convinced that they were going to loose substantial money on it, even with a pre-Christmas release.

Hardly the sign of a healthy game.

...and is already unavailable just about everywhere else.

Simply not true. In the UK Amazon, Game and PC World all have it in stock, for example.

Yes, its available in the UK. Everywhere.

Unfortunately, availability in the UK and Western Europe do not consitute the world. And while you might be swiming in them over there, there are huge markets that have not been adequately tapped, and subsequently profitss that have not been made.

[Wraithcat]

Seems you didn't get the memo. The game has, to date at least, only been released in download form (through Steam) in the US. There is an Australian version which, as far as I'm aware, is still available, as are the various European versions.

The Australian version is available(ish). I had to make a 300km round trip to get my copy from ebgames, which turns out to have been their last copy in the state of Victoria.

Other places most likely still have copies, but none that I contacted within a considerable radius did.

Edit: Oh, and I tried to download from Steam, but despite numerous attempts, it wouldn't let me register and their "Customer Support" still hasn't gotten back to me nearly a week later.

[CBJ]

The forum rules clearly state that any disagreement regarding a moderator's actions should be taken up in private. My previous suggestion to heed his words was a friendly reminder. This is now a formal one.

US players have the choice of getting the game through Steam, buying from one of a number of largish retailers who have decided to import, or waiting to see if a US-specific DVD version is published. Judging by the number of US players on here who have decided to do one of the first two, I'd say things were pretty healthy. So no, I'm not worried about it.

There's a certain irony in your highlighting the rather obvious fact that the UK and Western Europe do not constitute the world. I clearly stated that the UK was simply an example, used to demonstrate that your claim that the game is "already unavailable just about everywhere else" is factually incorrect. Once again, since you seem to have missed it before, the game has been released on DVD in Europe (not just western Europe), Russia and Australia, and is also available through Steam in the US and Canada. As far as I'm aware it is not "already unavailable" in any of these markets.

Finally, any plans regarding a US publisher on DVD have not been made public, so your assumptions about the reasons are just that: your assumptions.

[nielsw]

Oddly enough just about the only poll that could possibly be of any consequence on this subject would be one that didn't include members of this forum. If someone managed to dig up a few hundred thousand people who didn't currently buy Egosoft games but would suddenly rush out and do so if there were a multi-player element then I'm sure the bean-counters would sit up and take notice.

Good point, this would likely be the only poll worth anything to Egosoft.

So, has anybody taken this idea further? Maybe abuse some google feature or service to get that done? Do a collection to pay some outfit to do it?

We should really find a way to do that

[nielsw]

One other poll might also be interesting: How many players who have previously played Xtension and the X versions since, are still going to the trouble of doing a full economy play in TC ?

I know I've spent more time in Xtension than in all other X versions combined.

[Thelic]

Oddly enough just about the only poll that could possibly be of any consequence on this subject would be one that didn't include members of this forum. If someone managed to dig up a few hundred thousand people who didn't currently buy Egosoft games but would suddenly rush out and do so if there were a multi-player element then I'm sure the bean-counters would sit up and take notice.

Good point, this would likely be the only poll worth anything to Egosoft.

So, has anybody taken this idea further? Maybe abuse some google feature or service to get that done? Do a collection to pay some outfit to do it?

We should really find a way to do that

Seeing as though Terran Conflict didn't even have a publisher in North America, I don't think that focus groups or JAD sessions are a huge priority for the next Egosoft production.

[Mustikos]

There have been some very long and informitive answers in this thread. Some technical, some just passionate. But it really all comes down to one very simple point why the X series won't ever appear on-line.
SETA.
It can't work without it.
End of story.

I didn't get to the end of the thread and if I had I probably would have forgotten this by now, but... screw SETA. the only thing I use it for is to move fast from place to place, as most do, but I recall in X3:R I bought an afterburner or something and it boosted faster for a bit... which could suffice if it were modified, otherwise, what do you need SETA for ? don't get me wrong i use it all the time, but well, maybe it could be modified.. ah anyway, I could deal without it if I were playing with a friend MP. What about having a server, I dunno.. I used to play this tank game, years ago, was paying $10 / mo ten years ago or so. Really, I don't want subscriptions to pay every month, though I guess it would depend on the level of fun. Thing is though when you start paying money regularly, it throws a lot off. Some people are rich and can pay for 2 or 20 accounts. I don't want to play with those type of people if they can use their money for influence. It would be nice to have a few people to play MP with. Seriously, though just even 1 other person.

I'm not saying create the most amazing, state of the art, hottest game to sell and make someone RICH... I'm not seeing how it is so complicated.. my machine is doing the math on the game now, why can't i share that info with another machine? What about a dedicated machine for the server?

I am not sure why I'm spending my time going over this (again) lol ... sure am getting a lot of work done today..

Multiplayer would be great.. two player even... someone like myself, would play 2 player with a close friend that I've known for many, many years, we talk often, we're good friends, he lives hundreds of miles away, he's married, I'm boring.. I can just see us playing together and liking it for what it is, not cheating, no b.s. , just enjoying the game.

Of course it would be that much more if it were more than 2 people, but I'm saying, just a couple of people would bring it to a new level.

"worms... I got'm"

[MarkB]

i.e. Polls are the best way to make decisions unless they contradict what you believe. 'The people' are only right when they agree with you.

Just give it up dudes!!

M

Your point?

Is it because the poll supports YOUR outlook so it MUST be the right outcome?

Any poll done on any forum is only going to consider the views of the members who participate in that forum, and unless you bung it on the front page and make every forum user enter a vote before proceeding to the threads, your not even going to get every forum member to participate either (not that I am suggesting that).

That's not to say Polls are useless, just that they are limited in scope to;
(a) those that see them
and then;
(b) those that bother to vote in them.

We are already into a subset of a subset here (as has been noted previously)

As for your closing remark Maphys, I have already given up.

No TC bought, and it would have to be massively reduced before I bought it from a bargain bin in the future.

I like the stuff ES have done in the past. I have had a great time from BTF through to X3, I'm just too lonely when playing their games now.

[maphys]

Your point?

My point is that someone (can't be bothered to look back and see who) said "We should do a poll." Then when it was pointed out that polls had been done and the outcome was not what they said it would be they claimed that these polls were biased and invalid and then made a suggestion that they conduct a different sort of poll to get the answer they wanted. The i.e. was a summary of the preceding fictional dialogue that, I think, summarised their argument in a non-flattering but accurate way.

I'm not saying create the most amazing, state of the art, hottest game to sell and make someone RICH... I'm not seeing how it is so complicated.. my machine is doing the math on the game now, why can't i share that info with another machine? What about a dedicated machine for the server?

I suspect that you don't see how it is so complicated because you have not got any experience in programming this sort of thing (sorry if I am wrong and distributed routines are bread and butter to you). I have very, very little (no, really very very very little) but I know just enough to know that synchorising states between machines (or even two points of view) is not trivial and requires a lot of power. TC hammers one machine now so you'd want to share to load between both players. But then you have two instances trying to communicate. Which is so not trivial it is not funny. And the opening thing? The point of Egosoft as a company is to make money. To make their shareholders rich. That is what companies do. If they did take up your suggestion and release a loss leader just to keep a few fans happy (beacuse new players would NOT buy a non-state of the art non-hot game) they'd be a) out of business and b) probably sued into a smouldering hole in the ground by their shareholders.

M

[DeadlyDarkness]

They could do it quite easily, if they think outside the box.

Namely, use the open source FS2 engine and have a single system deathmatch mode!

The games are extremely similar. I've played FS2 mods with newtonian physics and shaders incoporated. With a bit of programming expertise I could probably even do it myself. I'd volunteer to help if anyone would be willing to try such a thing, although to avoid licensing issues we would probably have to remake all the ships ourselves.

[space pirate]

There have been some very long and informitive answers in this thread. Some technical, some just passionate. But it really all comes down to one very simple point why the X series won't ever appear on-line.
SETA.
It can't work without it.
End of story.

I didn't get to the end of the thread and if I had I probably would have forgotten this by now, but... screw SETA. the only thing I use it for is to move fast from place to place, as most do, but I recall in X3:R I bought an afterburner or something and it boosted faster for a bit... which could suffice if it were modified, otherwise, what do you need SETA for ? don't get me wrong i use it all the time, but well, maybe it could be modified.. ah anyway, I could deal without it if I were playing with a friend MP. What about having a server, I dunno.. I used to play this tank game, years ago, was paying $10 / mo ten years ago or so. Really, I don't want subscriptions to pay every month, though I guess it would depend on the level of fun. Thing is though when you start paying money regularly, it throws a lot off. Some people are rich and can pay for 2 or 20 accounts. I don't want to play with those type of people if they can use their money for influence. It would be nice to have a few people to play MP with. Seriously, though just even 1 other person.

I'm not saying create the most amazing, state of the art, hottest game to sell and make someone RICH... I'm not seeing how it is so complicated.. my machine is doing the math on the game now, why can't i share that info with another machine? What about a dedicated machine for the server?

I am not sure why I'm spending my time going over this (again) lol ... sure am getting a lot of work done today..

Multiplayer would be great.. two player even... someone like myself, would play 2 player with a close friend that I've known for many, many years, we talk often, we're good friends, he lives hundreds of miles away, he's married, I'm boring.. I can just see us playing together and liking it for what it is, not cheating, no b.s. , just enjoying the game.

Of course it would be that much more if it were more than 2 people, but I'm saying, just a couple of people would bring it to a new level.

"worms... I got'm"

why do you spontaneously start rants? by the end of the first paragraph you were completelly off the subject of the message you were replying to.

[Nanook]

space pirate, it's not up to you to moderate this forum. Your post was less than useful to anyone in the thread. As a matter of fact, his post was entirely on topic, since this thread is about MP. If you don't have something useful to say, please don't bother.

[space pirate]

space pirate, it's not up to you to moderate this forum. Your post was less than useful to anyone in the thread. As a matter of fact, his post was entirely on topic, since this thread is about MP. If you don't have something useful to say, please don't bother.

i'm not trying to moderate your forum, just satisfying my curiosity. there must be a reason why a person would write (or, rather, rewrite, as i've read it at least twice before) a 300-word essay that is hardly even related to the discussion (i have the impression that the thread is about technical limitations and financial merits of multiplayer, not your choice of opponents). the only relevant bit was about the afterburned and is roughly 1/4 of the entire post.

[Nanook]

Again, what's relevant is not up to you to decide. Enough. If you wish to discuss this further, take it to PM's.

[pelador]

There have been some very long and informitive answers in this thread. Some technical, some just passionate. But it really all comes down to one very simple point why the X series won't ever appear on-line.
SETA.
It can't work without it.
End of story.

I wouldnt miss SETA in Multiplayer, be too busy chatting on the comms if there was a long haul.

If ever thay did introduce multiplayer, I would hope there might be a viable solution to keeping the rich possibilities the X-Games already has for playability even if it was in a more limited form (i.e. volume maximums), which seems to be the governing factor. It would be a pity to loose any gameplay possibilities just to make it work as I feel it would dilute the existing X-Verse experience.

If so I would hope they add to the experience with the ability to have an Avatar of your pilot and being able to walk around stations (maybe even ships) to do your buisness as an optional choice, especially for batering, and more lucrative/shady missions and of course interact with other players/NPCs that way.

That being said I certainly don't consider myself qualified or sufficiently informed to say if it makes sense but am more than confident that if and when Egosoft consider it technically/commercially viable to introduce Multiplayer in whatever form they would do. And it would be a pre-order for me.

[Mustikos]

Rather then full on multiplayer, how about a reverse of the current ranking/stat system. At a point, you can hit an option, "Synchronize" maybe, that accesses the online stat database, and it takes a % of the listed from other players and places their corporations in my game, their stations and complexes in the proper places and at their set prices. It wouldn't have to always be synchronized. Maybe once a day/week to get the new update.

It would create a new economy like the AI can't, and the players can respond to other player corporations with ones to take advantage of voids in supply or demand.

I think this is a great idea, esp. because it would get players competeting with each other online, to a certain degree. Sure it wouldn't be live versus multiplayer, but it would be interesting to try and compete in economic stats against someone else in this way.

In the end, I vote Egosoft goes broke, if they must, making multiplayer. Hell, if it doesn't work and you guys do go broke, then you'll be in the same boat as some of us players..

In all honesty, playing a simple few person version would be teh greatest!