Really hate to post this...BUT... this looks too awesome not to.

General_Failure · Post by **General_Failure** » Fri, 4. May 12, 02:19

Eve online tessilation demo

Seriously, the game has a bunch of rocks in space, THIS IS EPIC, and I hope there is something this cool in store for us, because unlike EveZzzzzz where you don't even stay zoomed in that close to begin with and lose all that magnificent detail, X games have always been right there, face to face with those big rocks and ships, for the love of god someone please tell me you guys are working on something that epic, rocks breaking fluidly, shields going off and showing -where- they hit, 500,000,000 poly counts with amazing detail just from a flick of an option.

Sorry, jizzed myself at the thought alone...

Huillam · Post by **Huillam** » Fri, 4. May 12, 03:54

This movies shows what devs could do using dx11 not something already in game.
Sadly it will takes months (or even years) to get to that point.

s9ilent · Post by **s9ilent** » Fri, 4. May 12, 04:01

Rebirth is also built on DX9 technology (which AFAIK does not expose any sort of tessellation).

What engine and API do we use?

X Rebirth will run on DX9 API as long as all the features that we need from the API are possible with it. That does not mean we may not at some point also support DX11, but for now we do not see a need. Our engine is quite different from all the big established names, because it is designed specifically for a space game. We had a look at engines like Unreal or the CryEngine, but because we wanted to have cutting edge space graphics, an area very different from what these engines are specialized in, we had to develop our own engine.

General_Failure · Post by **General_Failure** » Fri, 4. May 12, 04:09

s9ilent wrote:Rebirth is also built on DX9 technology (which AFAIK does not expose any sort of tessellation).

What engine and API do we use?

X Rebirth will run on DX9 API as long as all the features that we need from the API are possible with it. That does not mean we may not at some point also support DX11, but for now we do not see a need. Our engine is quite different from all the big established names, because it is designed specifically for a space game. We had a look at engines like Unreal or the CryEngine, but because we wanted to have cutting edge space graphics, an area very different from what these engines are specialized in, we had to develop our own engine.

As a customer, features like those in the tech demo look like a NEEDED aspect for a SPACE game... Anyone else agree with me there? I mean that's exactly the sort of thing me personally has been waiting for in the X games. Well crap...

bluenog143 · Post by **bluenog143** » Fri, 4. May 12, 04:44

Yeah, if it's a tech demo then it's just showcasing the potential. Probably in a few years or so that tech will be available to games. 2-3 maybe?

General_Failure · Post by **General_Failure** » Fri, 4. May 12, 05:05

bluenog143 wrote:Yeah, if it's a tech demo then it's just showcasing the potential. Probably in a few years or so that tech will be available to games. 2-3 maybe?

They already updated the game from DX9 to 11, they are just adding this in now, should be sometime this year is what I would think. Either way. It's epic, and would look even more epic in X games.

Shame really.

edit: I think, I have no idea really on if they are or not, just know a friend plays it and has me drooling, stupid point and click spacer though.

bluenog143 · Post by **bluenog143** » Fri, 4. May 12, 05:54

Hopefully the new engine is DX11 compatible anyway, so that they could incorporate it later.

I really don't know why they aren't using DX11. I think Bernd said because they didn't see a need for it at the moment.

If your saying that X:R would look great in DX11 then I agree with you; I mean if the new engine will be able to make use of multiple cores then now is the best time ever to use DX11.

EDIT: With the gameplay features of X and stuff, it would be really nice.
I'm not sure but I think Bernd said that if they saw a good application for it somewhere along the line they would make use of it.

freemangl · Post by **freemangl** » Fri, 4. May 12, 07:34

I love new technology, I love good looking graphic, and DX11. XD

General_Failure wrote: They already updated the game from DX9 to 11, they are just adding this in now, should be sometime this year is what I would think. Either way. It's epic, and would look even more epic in X games.

where did you hear/see this, did you mean X: Rebirth?

nap_rz · Post by **nap_rz** » Fri, 4. May 12, 08:32

DX versions differences since DX9.0c mean relatively little to the visual quality so I don't really care for it... they better concentrate on producing the right looks.

dougeye · Post by **dougeye** » Fri, 4. May 12, 08:40

I think its a case of resources and understanding that not all Ego's customers have a rig like mine for example (see tag). Its better to focus on producing a nice looking dx9 game for everyone rather than creating a flashy dx11 game only a minority can fully enjoy. Dx11 can be added later. Dx11's features also dont justify upgrading to a +£1000 rig. Elder scrolls Skyrim is dx9 and that game hasnt done too badly has it

yes its not the best graphics out there but just about everyone these days can enjoy it, this is the route i think Ego are taking and is a sensible one, being a PC only game Rebirth will not have the luxury of having a few elite PC gamers on dx11 and the bulk of there audience on identical consoles. they need to produce a product that most PC gamers could play fully. not to mention the extra costs involved having two different graphics generations encorporated.

ThommoHawk · Post by **ThommoHawk** » Fri, 4. May 12, 08:43

Bernd himself has already stated the game is in DX9 because it delivers everything that is required of the game. So forget any Tesselation effects for now. He also stated that in the futrure it could be upgraded to DX11 but don't hold your breath is my advice.
edit: whoops, just noted s9ilents post above, beat me to by way much ago - my fault for skipping over too quick

Adding: @ dougeye, DX11 is now the 'standard' not the 'elite', as all new graphic cards employ it, even the cheapest ones on the market. So I must disagree whith some of your points... I would also like to mention that a game can have compatibility with DX9 and DX11. I do not see any point that people with DX11 capable systems should miss out on eye candy becuase others have older systems - a well designed game can cope with both. My other point would be that nicer eye candy can get better game reviews too.

Edit: @ general_failure, I agree it would be great to have a very high quality rendering standard for REBIRTH .... Many more recent players on the scene (and some of the older ones...) might have forgotten that when the X-series first hit the market, the recommended graphic spec was quite high for the time:

X3 Reunion v1.4 (Australian Edition) was Graphics: 256MB DX9 and Pixel Shader 2.0!

X2 The Threat was Graphics: 128MB, DX9 (optimum - this game had 3 levels of hadware requirements: minimum, recommended, and optimum). I remember thinking Wow, I just got a game that is gonna kill my computer for sure but have to try it...

nap_rz · Post by **nap_rz** » Fri, 4. May 12, 08:58

ThommoHawk wrote:Bernd himself has already stated the game is in DX9 because it delivers everything that is required of the game. So forget any Tesselation effects for now. He also stated that in the futrure it could be upgraded to DX11 but don't hold your breath is my advice.

Adding: @ dougeye, DX11 is now the 'standard' not the 'elite', as all new graphic cards employ it, even the cheapest ones on the market. So I must disagree whith some of your points... I would also like to mention that a game can have compatibility with DX9 and DX11. I do not see any point that people with DX11 capable systems should miss out on eye candy becuase others have older systems - a well designed game can cope with both. My other point would be that nicer eye candy can get better game reviews too.

eye candy does not equal with the version of DX... most of things that can be done with DX11 can also be done with DX9

shadowrunner85 · Post by **shadowrunner85** » Fri, 4. May 12, 09:00

description to video:

This video demonstrates DirectX 11 Tessellation and PhysX fragmentation technologies from Nvidia using art assets from EVE Online. The technology preview was produced as a collaboration between CCP Games and Nvidia and was premiered during the EVE Online Fanfest 2012.

well, yeah, there are 1001 things to be implemented into eve before this, sry. just a tech demo by Nvidia, using eve's art

ThommoHawk · Post by **ThommoHawk** » Fri, 4. May 12, 09:35

nap_rz wrote: eye candy does not equal with the version of DX... most of things that can be done with DX11 can also be done with DX9

well all i need to do is run unigene Heaven benchmark in DX11 and then in DX9 to know that there is a very noticible difference with games that employ DX11, though I accept your point that it is not necessary, but imo is still desirable if available....

Please also note that I have edited my previous post above to remind folks that when The Threat and Reunion first came out, Egosoft was indeed using cutting edge development for its games, which also reqired a very high level of graphics cards at the time to run the games at recommended/optimal levels, as per spec on the boxes I have in front of me now. To me that seems like an Egosoft tradition, to make the games satisfying to play on very high end machines too...

dougeye · Post by **dougeye** » Fri, 4. May 12, 11:14

what im saying is not that cheaper cards dont have a facility of dx11, im saying alot of X games have old systems pre dx11 cards and dont have the funds to go off and buy even the cheapest dx11 comptable card just for the sake of playing Rebirth. Its all about calculated risk.

General_Failure · Post by **General_Failure** » Fri, 4. May 12, 12:28

Plain and simple, shadows look like shite in almost all DX9 games(skyrim for instance! HOLY GOD, whiterun home for example), they can't even compare to that of tessilated models, and in space, there are shadows -everywhere- in fact, any time you look to one side of a structure that isn't being blasted by a star. But being able to accurately pinpoint -where- something is hitting a ship(and actually seeing shields?) and cause a specific effect for that area without using the typical "hit box" is a huge feature OF having so much of a boost and using technology that is and has been available for a while now(after all, DX11 has been around for a while now!) and that said, we don't want a good game, we want a great game, because as customers/gamers we are sick and tired of being lied to by companies about them just being lazy and not learning how to use the latest technologies and doing nothing but horribly ports that use jack/crap of hardware that was available years ago, let alone hardware that is available today. Sitting on an i7 and a pair of 560's and 3 monitors, I can count the games that use it on 1 hand. Actually off the top of my head, I can't count any good games that use it besides a few benchmarks.

If you're a PC only company, why would you not give your customers the choice? Look to CD Projekt and how they do business for a great example of good, look to EA for the bad. IMHO ego is sitting somewhere above neutral which is why I'm ok with what they do, I just feel they could do better, and at the end of the day(they are just butt hugging DX9 like it's the best thing since sliced bread, hell openGL passed DX9 looong ago!), isn't that your goal? Well unless you're EA, haha.

dougeye · Post by **dougeye** » Fri, 4. May 12, 12:34

The witcher and witcher 2 shift a hell of alot more units that x games, hence the extra resources to give the fans everything they want. its all about economics. if egosoft had a load of spare staff just sitting around waiting to make a dx11 complatible version im sure they would be using them.

Drewgamer · Post by **Drewgamer** » Fri, 4. May 12, 16:35

I'd be all for DX11 eye candy (not that I can even use it...go go '08 tech!) but I would rather Ego focus all their time into making the best gameplay they can than to take away some development time for a few oogles.

That said, once the game is finished and out, if they want to go back and overhaul for DX11, I'd say go for it. Heck, I'd even shell out some more $$ for a "DX11 DLC".

Egosoft is one of those rare devs that I would be happy to support with my hard earned cash.

Virtualaughing · Post by **Virtualaughing** » Sat, 12. May 12, 14:32

Sooner or later we will come to an age where all the eye candy will make any difference from the "real world". If i wanna go to the bottom of this then the gameplay is the one and only thing that matters. EVE still seems a bit overcomlicated but arcade game.
I like the ES way of introducing you to the enviroment as person and not as an all seeing god from "above".
Many of the new games have excellent cinematic intros and boom and wow and on and on but with ES all you can see is that you WILL get in the game

except few cutscenes in reunion

Axeface · Post by **Axeface** » Sat, 12. May 12, 16:55

Dont quite understand the point of this tessellation tech (bad naming). By the time games can handle that number of polygons (Please remember thats a single ship and a few roids) artists will be modelling at that res (And already are for baking and maps). Point of the shell tech?

EDIT: I kind of see why, it allows for the scalability (so people on shittier card can get better performance).

I'm not interested in anything like that for rebirth, we can get very nice visuals using current tech. What I AM VERY interested in is the physics. I said it on another thread here, but flying slowly through an asteroid field, gently pushing roids to the side with my ship, with minute stones brushing past my canopy like rain... would be the most atmospheric thing ever, I would probably cry.
Another use of this is when ships get destroyed, a capital ship breaking up in front of you would turn from a nice explosion (and nothing more) to some seriously intense gameplay...

Using EVE for that video is a very strange choice. Things like this just make people want to fly themselves, something you cant do in *shudder* Eve.

PS. X doesnt use hitboxes, already. You can see this by jumping out of your ship and shooting it with your repair laser, the hit effects follow the geometry of ships perfectly.

egosoft.com

egosoft.com

Really hate to post this...BUT... this looks too awesome not to.

Really hate to post this...BUT... this looks too awesome not to.