[PROGRAM] X Plugin Manager : V1.87 : 2024-01-06

[Cycrow]

have u made sure u have enabled the stats exporter ?

its in AL Plugin settings, make sure its turned on

I'm sorry if I'm sounding too obtuse, but there's a lot of... incomplete... information out there.

Does this mean that, in order to use the G15 display with X3:TC, you'll have to have a **MODIFIED** game? Or is there a way to turn on the stats exporter in the AL Plugin menu without getting **MODIFIED**?

Thanks!

no you need a modified game to export the stats as it needs the script running, which makes the game modified

[PRiME2007]

Thought I post this to show what you get when adding ANY ships with dummy points defined in PM. This is universal error just about, hope a solution can be found.

This isn't related to any one specific ship but how pluginmanager generates the dummies file (in corrupt manner). From what I can tell the other PCK files are unaffected. So I guess onces dummies.pck is fixed and also the generation of CAT/DAT files for AP is fixed then it should be mostly fine.


http://dl.dropbox.com/u/41627694/x3apdummyerror.jpg


Edit: removed img-tags. Please note forum rules: Images posted should not exceed 640 x 480 and 100kb in size. X2-Illuminatus

[joelR]

Cycrow (or anyone else)

When editing values in twaret.pck (in a mod I am using) using the X3 editor I am able to change things without issue. The problem is that when I load up the PM, the twaret file it creates shows the old values of the mod in question. I am playing an AP game and the PM is set to AP. So is the editor.

Is this an issue with the PM or with the Editor?

[Cycrow]

what file are you editing ?
is this in a fake patch or somewhere else?

[joelR]

what file are you editing ?
is this in a fake patch or somewhere else?

Its in a fake patch in the AP addon folder (XRM mod). Im changing the twaret.pck. The editor is showing the changes I made but the PM generated twaret is showing the original values used in the XRM mod I am editing. Deleting the PM twaret and restarting the PM doesnt change anything.

[PRiME2007]

Run XRM as xsp/plugin format (fake patch but within PM), I had the same issue.

Essentially PM cannot detect mods inside AP unless there added through the PM itself, otherwise it assumes default AP and will generate/edit the type files accordingly, once you have XRM installed through PM it typically uses XRM types files as base instead of default AP.

[joelR]

Run XRM as xsp/plugin format (fake patch but within PM), I had the same issue.

Essentially PM cannot detect mods inside AP unless there added through the PM itself, otherwise it assumes default AP and will generate/edit the type files accordingly, once you have XRM installed through PM it typically uses XRM types files as base instead of default AP.

Ok thanks for the solution.

Cycrow is this something you think should be fixed?

[joelR]

Run XRM as xsp/plugin format (fake patch but within PM), I had the same issue.

Essentially PM cannot detect mods inside AP unless there added through the PM itself, otherwise it assumes default AP and will generate/edit the type files accordingly, once you have XRM installed through PM it typically uses XRM types files as base instead of default AP.

Just tried this with no luck. I edited the actual mod. How is it that the PM created twaret file has the XRM values even after deleting it and letting it refresh?

[Cycrow]

The plugin manager will find the latest file to use in the fake patches.
so it should find XRM's files if thats a fake patch.

but if its finding an old version then its possible that windows has create a virtual store where the old XRM and PM are directed

this usually happens when installing things into program files

u could try running in admin mode and see if that fixes it

[eldyranx3]

Potential and Reproducible Bug in Package Creator 1.10.

Adding more than one map file at a time to a Package causes the Package Creator to lock up.

Having issues with PM 'seeing' Fake Patch files as well, but I'm not sure if I'm packing my CATs correctly for AP to begin with. My face imprint looks great on the wall though

[PRiME2007]

It won't work unless you have it as XSP. PERIOD, trying to run XRM as a manual fake patch or editing its tships files or whatever won't change anything.

[DrBullwinkle]

Long-term Test Report:

I have noticed that the PM looks at a .cat/.dat pair and makes a decision whether it is a fake patch or a mod. Mods are hidden from the main interface. They appear only in the Mod Selector which is on the "Packages" menu.

I then must take a further step to enable the mod in the Mod Selector. Since the Mod Selector only allows one mod at a time, this is a problem for packages that are really fake patches which are intended to be installed along with other packages.

This process is probably obvious to you, Cycrow, but it was far from intuitive for me. It took me a thousand hours to figure it out. (Not 1,000 hours of time studying the PM, but 1,000 hours nevertheless.)

It is unclear to me how the PM decides whether the package is a mod or a fake patch. I have some mods that the PM thinks are fake patches, and some things that I *want* to install as fake patches which the PM insists on treating as mods. I see no way to instruct the PM about the proper handling of the files.

Even more puzzling, when installing an archive that contains a .cat mod combined with scripts and t files, the PM chose to handle the .cat as a mod and the scripts as a normal package!!! (SSDN v5) While the PM showed the package as being properly installed, the result obviously could never work. (Not without some clever intervention, anyway. And, even with the proper intervention, the combination does not work correctly -- meaning that it cannot be combined with other similar packages.)

Furthermore, the ability to adjust the order of fake patches appears on the Advanced menu, which is disabled by default. To add insult to injury, the way to unlock the Advanced menu appears to be undocumented. At least, I could not find it on the Help menu or in the original post of this thread.

I only discovered the "--advanced" command line switch by stumbling upon it while reading far too many messages in this and the beta threads.

This was a huge stumbling block in my learning curve. As a newbie, I can say that it was confusing to have the vitally-important Advanced menu hidden. It should be enabled by default, IMHO.

The net result is that the PM is unpredictable for installing fake patches. I wound up removing a quarter of my plugins from the PM's control and installed them manually as fake patches. They work correctly now.

But that is not all: Several of Lucike's packages (ESP, Prospector) do not work when installed via PM, but they are simple to install manually -- just copy the scripts and t files. Somehow, the PM cannot do that correctly, which baffles me.

Perhaps a clue is something that you said, which suggested that the PM makes decisions about some files based on their date? If that is the case, then it is not a reliable way to decide! Clearly, the user should be allowed to override the behavior.

I don't know if any of this will help the guys who are trying to wrestle the PM into installing XRM on AP, but I hope that it will help you when you make another update to the PM.

In summary, I would find it more helpful if the PM would install all .cats as fake patches, and enable the Advanced menu by default. And, if the PM makes other decisions for me, then please tell me about them! (And give me a way to change them.) (And pack .pck's unencrypted.) (And use my Globals.txt file, which should take precedence over a .cat file, shouldn't it?)

I love the PM. It is solidly built and does a wonderful job. It does some very complex tasks, and tries to make it simple for the user. Perhaps it tries too hard sometimes?

[megapowa]

I need a step by step guide to solve this problem:
http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/63186 ... A75E06D75/

X3-reunion 2.5 Steam + Bonus pack
Plugin manager 1.41 with admin rights
[SCRIPT] Advanced Jumpdrive V1.50 : Updated 11/03/2007
http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php? ... sc&start=0

Plugin manager log file:
Plugin Manager Library Scripts X3 :: PluginManager :: 1.21 :: 20/01/2010 :: Library :: Yes :: No
Advanced Jumpdrive :: Cycrow :: 1.50 :: 11/03/2007 :: Ship Upgrade :: Yes :: No

The plugin manager was closed while i made the picture.


What i tried:
- Reinit Script cache.
- Uninstall plugin manager, bonus pack. Delete the script and t folder and repair via steam. I also checked the .dat and .cat files. There is no extra only the vanilla files.

What is wrong?

Edit*
The problem is there any plugin which uses the emp.

[Cycrow]

DrBullwinkle,

the PM decided on what is a fake patch by the file names of the mod files.

if the filename is a 2 digit number, then it is classed as a fake patch, otherwise it is classed as a normal mod.

as the game can only handle 1 mod being loaded at a time, the PM limits this in the mod selector.

if you want to turn it into a fake patch, you can open the package in the Creator right click on the mod file in the file list and select Fake Patch


as for the advanced mode, if you have the startmenu items or desktop shortcuts installed, then they will give you 2 shortcuts, one for the lite one for the advanced.

ill have a look at the archive support, as it doesn't know exactly what file types they are, it has to try and guess.


the problem with making it install everything as fake patches, is that it doesn't always work and can mess up the game. So if the PM did it by default, alot of people might not understand whats happening and why thier game is broken

[DrBullwinkle]

the PM decided on what is a fake patch by the file names of the mod files... a 2 digit number ... [is] a fake patch, otherwise it is ... a normal mod.

OK, that is not so bad. It is just unexpected and the PM does not tell the user that their fake patch is not installed.

Adding the naming convention and the command line switch(es) to the docs in your OP might save a lot of head-scratching for your users.

as the game can only handle 1 mod being loaded at a time

The game uses the highest-precedent modded file... that is how patches work, right? That's different than "can only handle one". Modders are (sometimes) careful to point this out, and (sometimes) explain how to deal with it. The EgoSoft FAQ also explains it.

It is common to load multiple mods. Lucike's library, for example, mods a couple of standard scripts. So most/all of his scripts are, technically, mods, even though they are among the most stable and well-supported scripts. Also, some mods are entirely compatible with each other.

In any case, the PM should not change the well-documented rules, especially without telling the user (and/or additional documentation).

the problem with making it install everything as fake patches, is that it doesn't always work and can mess up the game. So if the PM did it by default, alot of people might not understand whats happening and why thier game is broken

Right, I understand. On the other hand, how many games are broken and users not understanding what is going on by the way the PM works now? I am pretty sure I am not the only one.

The worst case is archives with mixed .cats and scripts. The PM displays them as properly installed when, in fact, they may not be. There is no hint on the main page of anything amiss.

OK, so some of this is just documentation-related -- that's easy to fix. There is also some room for fine-tuning the PM's behavior regarding .cats. In addition to the archive format, I hope that you will consider the rest of my list for a future update (not installing some files (date decision? or some other reason?) and respecting files that should take precedence (Globals.txt, for example).

I *like* the way that the PM controls fake patches, especially the ability to change their order. Now that I know how to control it (rather than just relying on luck), I will try it again.

[Cycrow]

i think you have a mis understanding when people talk about mod files.

it is refering specifically to the .cat/.dat files

the standard way to mod the game using these is to install it to the mods directory in the game

you then select which of these mods you wish to load in the startup dialog.
you can only select 1 mod at a time so the game will only ever allow 1 of these to load up.

the fake patch method is basically a hack to force the game to load multiple mods at a time. This works by loading all patches, then loading up the selected mod.

the problem with this, is that it'll only ever load 1 of each file type. So if you have 3 fake patches with the same files in, ie, they all made changes to ships and have the TShips file. Only 1 of these actually loads into the game, the rest are ignored

so if you try to load say XRM and Xtended as fake patches, the game is just going to end up totally broken

fake patches should really only be used for mods that change small things and less commonly changed files

[megapowa]

Is there any solution for my problem? :/

[Cycrow]

Is there any solution for my problem? :/

this could be several problems.

first thing to try, is to reinstall the advacned jumpdrive, then goto help > about in the plugin manager
and select the file log, and see if the text file installed correctly

then, check in the game directory to see if the file is physically there

finally, try to manually load the setup script, open the script editor find the setup script for the advanced jumpdrive, and manually run it

[DrBullwinkle]

i think you have a mis understanding when people talk about mod files.

it is refering specifically to the .cat/.dat files

Yikes! I don't want to debate fundamentals with one of the gods of the X universe, and I am here to learn from you, but... that's not the majority usage of the term. Most discussions about mods (including EgoSoft moderators) mean something that modifies one of the EgoSoft game files. The container does not matter.

But, no matter. We can use your definition.

fake patches should really only be used for mods that change small things and less commonly changed files

While I don't disagree with your philosophy, the reality is that fake patches are used for many things. They are a legitimate, documented and supported, way to install files; whether they modify game files or add to them.

Some of the game's most popular major mods (XRM, CMOD, for example) intentionally use multiple fake patches to achieve an overall effect. They depend on precedence to get the job done correctly. They cannot be installed in the mod folder, and *must* use fake patches. Fake patches are better than the alternative, which is to overwrite files.

But none of this really matters from the standpoint of my usage report. My suggestion is that the PM should obey the game's precedence rules, rather than trying to change the rules. Anything that does change the rules should:

A) Tell the user.
2) Have some indication in the main window of the PM.
C) Be documented.
4) Give the user a way to adjust what the PM does.

For myself, I can now use the PM correctly (and work around some -- not all -- of its eccentricities). I humbly offer my experiences in case you want to improve the PM's reliability and ease-of-use for other newbies in the future.

[megapowa]

I completely reinstalled the whole game and the plugin manager.
I deleted all files in the save game directory.

Installed the script via PM then checked the two directory.
In the T directory there was 4 new file. But with a new name. Not the same name as it in the package.
The scripts are seem that are ok.
And i noticed there is an extra file that will disappear when I open the pm. After i close it reappear.

Still not working.