Did Egosoft miss what the fans wanted?

[Marco Nero]

In short...wth are we complaining about?

Because ...
- it really is just Rebirth 2.
- the Borons aren't coming back.
- you still cannot pilot Capital Ships.
- I still haven't seen my preferred play-style come back.
- we still don't have those cockpit enhancements we asked for in X2.

- I was little bit unhappy like you when i've seen highways and NPC walking, but now i'm cautous optimistic after readed a lot and watching a lot theyr video.
It's not a Rebirth 2 for very reasons
-They will, they will... you will see
-You can pilot Capital Ships.
-Maybe it's too eraly to say this
-Mod

[fireanddream]

With the last years disappointing releases of games from various developers,
i've learned to not have any expectations, no hopes, just wait for reviews and never pre-order.

I still pray that CP2077 won't destory CDPR.

For the past few years the trend of "casualization" seemed completely unstoppable. Imagine my sense of defeat when generic 10 hour hack n' slash triple As, the new dragon age, for example, are crowned RPG of the year.

But in 2015 and 2016 two companies turned back time.

CDPR released the Witcher 3, which I preordered 8 months prior to its release after finishing the Witcher 2.

And there's Larian Soft with Divinity: Original Sin, my all-time favorite RPG. A few months ago it released D:OS2 and it stayed in the steam top seller every week since then.

Of course there's Bethesda completely butchering the Fallout series. But after the Witcher 3 and D:OS 1 and 2 I'm no longer worried like I did from 2010 to 14, that games will get more and more casual. Real games made with love and passion will always be there.

A bit off topic here. Apologies for bashing XR wrong, hope X4 will be a good game.

[Slashman]

In short...wth are we complaining about?

Because ...
- it really is just Rebirth 2.
- the Borons aren't coming back.
- you still cannot pilot Capital Ships.
- I still haven't seen my preferred play-style come back.
- we still don't have those cockpit enhancements we asked for in X2.

Have you been paying attention?

It is NOT Rebirth 2.

The Borons are not coming back at release. We have no idea what order they will re-add new races. This isn't some horrific tragedy.

You absolutely can pilot cap ships. Were you checking out the dev streams at all?

If you can pilot all ships, you can pilot trading ships. How is your playstyle not coming back?

I have no idea what you asked for in X2 and I'm really not sure who promised you that it would be made reality.

[Torch76]

Yes, it's definitely NOT Rebirth 2... Although Rebirth was a decent game. Some good additions. I'd like to see a blend of Rebirth upgrades, with the X3 feel.

I really don't know why some people don't like Rebirth. I've had a lot of fun with it!

Really looking forward to X4. I love building stuff. Can't wait to build my own stations and start my empire!!

[Cabrelbeuk]

Bruh the only things that is not corresponding to fans most wanted features is Borons. And that's not a core feature.

Fly every ship INCLUDING CAPITAL SHIPS coming with actual bridges.
Automated trades coming back.
Most of unwanted-features-if-badly-done from Rebirth out (most of inside-station-NPC-interactions etc)
No more overusing of Highways.
Etc etc etc.

Without Rebirth lesson, I would be over-hyped right now.

@Torch76 :

2 years of alpha/beta for whoever played Rebirth POST RELEASE.
Loss of management with loss of delegation-tasks.
One Ship flyable, not really customizable, over broken (can basically capture a ship launcher with your tiny thingy).
For a very long time, stations were buildable only on zone, max 6 stations per zone, and Stations can not be killed. So basically it screw a lot of things (factions expensions, your own expensions, pirate useless, war useless and infinite, etc etc etc).
And a lot more.

[Slashman]

Yes, it's definitely NOT Rebirth 2... Although Rebirth was a decent game. Some good additions. I'd like to see a blend of Rebirth upgrades, with the X3 feel.

I really don't know why some people don't like Rebirth. I've had a lot of fun with it!

Really looking forward to X4. I love building stuff. Can't wait to build my own stations and start my empire!!

I think its very obvious why people didn't like Rebirth. If it had been liked, we would be looking at a sequel instead of X4. We don't need to go over the reasons as they are fairly plain to see.

[curtcooll]

No highways, I love the jump drive.

If the menus are same as rebirth meh i loved how easy it was in X3 to access storage etc in rebirth it just seem to be everywhere and impossible to get through the menus and even access my storage.

[Honved]

The main points that impact me and what I want from the game are:

Dynamic economy. Your actions finally matter, and the enemy fleet that you eradicated won't just automatically be replaced for free. It will at least cost them something they could have built instead. That means, ultimately, that you can weaken a faction to help a friendly one expand, or possibly even destroy it by weakening it enough over time.

You're not confined to flying a single ship that you hate with a passion. THANK YOU.

The @#$% highways aren't the ONLY reasonably way to get around the strategic map. I love options, and forcing the use of "highways" to get anywhere in under a week really puts a damper on the game, in my opinion. I can understand that the previous system was a bit too easy to blatantly abuse, but there has to be some middle ground. Hopefully, X4 gives you a couple of alternatives, even if they aren't as convenient as jump gates and teleporters.

On the other hand, the menus and controls are still a big question mark. The contents in X3 weren't the problem, it was the odd kludged arrangement that put some of the most frequently used commands, and some of the most time-sensitive ones that you needed to activate in combat, deep into the 3rd or 4th sub-menu levels. It needed drastic reorganization, not so much a new interface. Going with a big font and simplistic console interface is fine on those systems where it makes passably effective use of the limited hardware available, but PLEASE don't force PC users to suffer with it.

I REALLY dont' want to see the return of the "click and wait" increasing or decreasing money amounts from X3, where it takes 2 minutes of bored frustration just to transfer 5M credits, when typing in 5000000 would take about 2 seconds.

The ability to step out of the ship briefly is probably a positive feature, but shouldn't be the focus of a lot of development time. Given the choice between having it or not, I'd take it, but given the choice between that and more development time spent on the economy and AI, I'd gladly skip the animations and put the effort into more important things. Players don't buy this game for the graphics, and trying to sell it primarily on that basis would be a huge mistake. It only has to look "shiny" enough not to scare off would-be buyers who have already heard good things about the game.

Overall, I'm liking most of what I read, but not 100% sold on some of it.

[lyonhaert]

I REALLY dont' want to see the return of the "click and wait" increasing or decreasing money amounts from X3, where it takes 2 minutes of bored frustration just to transfer 5M credits, when typing in 5000000 would take about 2 seconds.

You can type in amounts to transfer in X3, though.

[Killjaeden]

I REALLY dont' want to see the return of the "click and wait" increasing or decreasing money amounts from X3, where it takes 2 minutes of bored frustration just to transfer 5M credits, when typing in 5000000 would take about 2 seconds.

You can type in amounts to transfer in X3, though.

And more precisely, you can also type in number and increase/decrease in multiples of that number. Plus you can navigate the menus very quickly with keyboard, which is the only reason the menu system was bearable - once you memorized where stuff is you could do it super quickly.

[Mick Maidens]

I am worried about no jumpdrive. The AI was rubbish without a jumpdrive. It was required for any TS to survive. I hate the whole concept of Highways, gates were so much more elegant. Just give the jumpdrive a limit and only able to appear at gates or a friendly satellite.
Please do not simplify the game to make it easier, I like complicated. Lots of choice. Things I like about X3 (I own XR but haven't played it much, I restarted X3 TC instead).

Love Flying any ship, marines, dog fights, Economy, SETA
but hate highways and OTT missiles.
Using missiles is just lazy and if I could turn their use off I would.
I think the whole Jumpdrive / SETA system was a very neat workaround to the real limits of any AI based space game. The SETA made space big. The bottom line is that this is a game and needs to be fun as well as frustrating

[Skeeter]

Yeah i dont get it either, fans clearly told egosoft how they felt about highways or at least the way they did them as tubes all over. Jump or warp drives are in many games and many tv/movies and no one complained about them in the past. If they know we didnt like them why continue with them is what id like to know. If they cant or wont go back to old gate network (i really liked that about x games) and want to keep the big but empty maps, why not just size them downwhich removes the need for highways? not like you need such big systems when there mostly empty anyhow.

[[FFCW]Urizen]

Gates are still in folks. No need to worry.

[thesus1]

I am worried about no jump-drive.

I want a real fleet management and a strategic layer in X4. The only viable strategic with jump-drive is the "guerrilla" technique (fast attack and disappear).
Without-it you need to make/fight against outpost, you need to think about replenishment, safe path for your ships, front battle ...

[Greenhorn]

Hi all, im quite surprised people voted answered mostly ,too soon to tell,seeing the 3rd twitter video,.Hmm, egosoft needs another ,4th twitter video in the future here.,i was wondering, since the boron wont be in the release ,Question (1) :Will the split race, be in there?. q(2) How does workforce, how does that work on stations.?,(3) Will pirates have an economy?.Q (4) I hope plots will be simple.(5) NPC abilitys operations multiple things or just one job they can do maybe?.,Was wondering,(6) what if you teleport to station,and all your ships are destroyed in the whole entire game,which means theres no rescue, and you are all alone?,how do you escape station ,to make money, with no ship,cargo, being stranded in a space factory?.how do you get credits?,. Can you teleport from station to station to shipyard,to acquire a ship. maybe?:o ..well that's all I can say for now ,take care all,bye.

[Nanook]

I am worried about no jump-drive.

I want a real fleet management and a strategic layer in X4. The only viable strategic with jump-drive is the "guerrilla" technique (fast attack and disappear).
Without-it you need to make/fight against outpost, you need to think about replenishment, safe path for your ships, front battle ...

There's an easy solution to that. Simply make the gates behave the same as the jump beacons in AP. If you're hostile to a race, you can't jump to a gate in a sector that they control.

[thesus1]

There's an easy solution to that. Simply make the gates behave the same as the jump beacons in AP. If you're hostile to a race, you can't jump to a gate in a sector that they control.

It's a solution in the only case your attacking in a sector you already at "war".
Take a station you build for example, with the jump-drive you don't need to protect-it because you can teleport instantly your "carrier-fleet-of-death"
For me it's not strategic at-all.

You can also take the economic effect of "time travel" instead of "buy and sell in a second". Adding time to your orders made your decisions more valuable (because your play time is limited).

It's purely subjective, and I also understand why people like the jump-drive. But removing the jump-drive is not just "a feature missing from X3", it's a game design modification who impact a lots of aspect in the game.

[Nanook]

There's an easy solution to that. Simply make the gates behave the same as the jump beacons in AP. If you're hostile to a race, you can't jump to a gate in a sector that they control.

It's a solution in the only case your attacking in a sector you already at "war".
Take a station you build for example, with the jump-drive you don't need to protect-it because you can teleport instantly your "carrier-fleet-of-death"
For me it's not strategic at-all....

Protect against what? The NPC's would have the same rules as you, so they'd first have to breach your gate defenses to get in to attack something. I see no problem with defensive use of jump drives. It's the offensive use that's a game changer, IMO.

...
It's purely subjective, and I also understand why people like the jump-drive. But removing the jump-drive is not just "a feature missing from X3", it's a game design modification who impact a lots of aspect in the game.

The original theme of the game universe was a jump drive failure that lead Kyle Brennan to discover the X universe. Making them disappear in the game denies the original lore of the game. The X universe without jumpdrives just isn't the X universe.

[Malakie]

Figured I would throw my 3 cents in..

I too am not a fan of 'highways'. Just do not get that concept or why there would be such a thing. I definitely prefer the previous X3 games that uses gates and jump drives. The highways always took away from the feeling of actually being in space for me.. It made it feel like I was in a sandbox with borders.

I DO like being able to walk around stations, inside ships etc.. I may now be spoiled though in that regard being I am also a Star Citizen backer.

One of the things I hope they did, was find someone that can draw the female face and body.. There is one thing Egosoft is well known for.. the most butt ugly women in a game. We need some eye candy for those long lonely space voyages.

The other thing I miss is the built in programming and scripting engine and editor. That offered so much power and potential to the game for modding.. whether you just wanted to add another ship model to the game or write a small script to make you rich, it allowed everyone to do things no other game offered.

My current long running universe in X3 Terran Conflict uses probably a few hundred mod/scripts and over 400+ new ships.. everything from SG-1 to Star Trek, Star Wars and problem numerous other games many have never heard of.. I want that kind of ability again in X4.

Other than those things, I will reserve any other opinions until we see it..

[nithilak]

highways are really useful for getting around, really liked how XR offers multiple ways of traveling that werent available before. plus once you acquire the jump drive, you dont need highways quite as much. highways are great for tactical use in plutarch sectors and others as well.
Im very excited about all the enhancements! the fact that it looks alot like x2 is exciting. im excited to see the classic ships back, i hope we get them all!!! the transporter is back, wether any one likes it or not, the game is going to be reminescent to x2 in some ways. not sure why thats a problem for anyone.
cant imagine why anyone has a problem with the stations, walking around in stations is very rarely required, basically you only absolutley need to walk into a station to repair yuour ship or change your cockpit, aside from the few scripted times in the story that its required. i actually ALWAYS wished they would make planet side cities you can land and explore as well as FULLY exploreable stations, and add a more rpg element to your player character, hopefully Egosoft will get over the silly idea that less people will play it if they do that........ AHEM... add rpg element to player character, what everyone really wants is something like if x4 and fallout 4 had a baby. and this baby were multiplayer. Not mmo multiplyaer, just multiplayer option. X has always been a game that just teases with unlimited possibilities, but someone convinced Egosoft devs back in the early 2000's that realisitic space shooter shoulndt have any planet side activities or a customizable player character because thats not one of the most popular elements of an rpg, and lets face it, x is basically only that short of an rpg. ,, you know, even when your on a planet, your still in space
in a nutshell, Egosoft has always released a better game than before, my only complaint ever was the capitolizaion on x3 trilogy, story shmory,,, whatever.. terren conflict, and albion prelude should have just been expansions, letting you keep your original empire you started in x3 reunion.
needless to say, ore perhaps its needed? ive personally been excited about every x game, they all have been great enhancements to their predecessors and i dont expect any different with this one,, Egosoft always delivers, for the most part!