Kerbal Space Program (in-dev retail game)

Psychoclops · Post by **Psychoclops** » Sat, 28. Sep 13, 12:17

brucewarren wrote:Short lived you mean. At least they are when I'm in charge

Same here!

Oh and by the way, I hate you all! Downloaded the demo last night, went to bed at 3am

Dantrithor · Post by **Dantrithor** » Sat, 28. Sep 13, 16:34

I made my first successful landing on duna...

It's composed of a launching vehicle to achieve orbit, a second stage make of 4 "caged" nuclear engines, and a third final stage for landing and re-positioning.

This ship is not designed to return to Kerbin from such a distance... but I think I could make it from closer planets and moons.

Launching:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =181944994

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =181945066

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =181944966

Falling...

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =181957468

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =181957596

Landing!

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =181957831

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =181958275

I feel proud of myself. I should now design and launch there small flying drones for exploration.

Aragosnat · Post by **Aragosnat** » Sun, 29. Sep 13, 18:17

Bishop149: Have you tried using the drouge chutes with it. AS they do fully deploy sooner then the others which ussually make it slow down to safer speeds before the main ones deploy.

Have you tried the parachute calculator yet too? the one found here: http://ksp.freeiz.com/

Has certainly helped with my Duna drops.

Here you can see a night time picture of for Kerbal lander cans being dropped to Duna's surface: http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/110 ... B0ADBD4BA/

Neat thing was that all four of them landed under 1 km from my Kerbal Mass driver. Still had to run them over to it. They needed the excersise.

Here is one in daylight for my rover that will move the KMD: http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/110 ... 874851C8B/

I found out that on some of my designs that brake off when chutes deployed. That if I got them under 80 m/s or slower that they broke less often to not at all.

Diche Bach · Post by **Diche Bach** » Mon, 30. Sep 13, 02:20

I can only hope that the designers of games like X Universe have a whirl with KSP.

Imagine KSP and X-Universe get married and "have a baby." First of all, it would be multilingual (German, Spanish, English, etc.). But second of all: WHOA! Can you imagine such a game!

Even better, lets add a "Civilization-esque" pre-game to the space game (well, actually I guess that would be the "1st third?, and btw, I have a Ph.D. in anthropology, I can help with that Civilization style stuff

).

So you start as the leader (Matriarch or Patriarch as you wish) of a Paleolithic society. Game would involve both some static 2d decision screens where you do things like allocate group time and effort, regulate economy and "research," move operattional units on a map, interact with comunities, all ala Civ, as well as a Tactical interface similar to say Rome Total War. As you progress the scope of your control expands and the game becomes increasingly challenging. Eventually if you are persistent and ingenius you may achieve space flight and then eventually interstellar space flight . . . Maybe before I die, such a game will exist?

Chobittsu · Post by **Chobittsu** » Mon, 30. Sep 13, 03:41

Diche Bach wrote:Imagine KSP and X-Universe get married and "have a baby."

Wouldn't work. I've spent the last year in their community. The moment anyone suggests anything more in-depth and serious than what is already in KSP, the community flips out.

Then you consider how X-Universe and Kerbal are such incredibly different game styles. One a vast sandbox with combat and economy simulation, the other a custom rocket creator and planet exploration sim. Squad is very adamant about not adding any form of combat into their game, and the closest they want to get to a working economy is campaign mode.

So sorry, but from a development and community standing, it's a terrible horrible disgusting idea.

Diche Bach · Post by **Diche Bach** » Mon, 30. Sep 13, 05:26

Freya Nocturne wrote:
Diche Bach wrote:Imagine KSP and X-Universe get married and "have a baby."
Wouldn't work. I've spent the last year in their community. The moment anyone suggests anything more in-depth and serious than what is already in KSP, the community flips out.

Then you consider how X-Universe and Kerbal are such incredibly different game styles. One a vast sandbox with combat and economy simulation, the other a custom rocket creator and planet exploration sim. Squad is very adamant about not adding any form of combat into their game, and the closest they want to get to a working economy is campaign mode.

So sorry, but from a development and community standing, it's a terrible horrible disgusting idea.

Yeah, you are sadly, probably right.

Once again humans foil the greatest possible games which can be imagined and COULD develope if talent were properly synchronized.

pjknibbs · Post by **pjknibbs** » Mon, 30. Sep 13, 08:50

No offence, but I'm not sure it's such a great idea to start with--as anyone who's played Frontier: Elite 2 or its sequel knows, full Newtonian physics a la KSP and combat a la X really don't mix well!

Fallen-Angel · Post by **Fallen-Angel** » Mon, 30. Sep 13, 09:33

Anyone ever tried that Babylon 5 F2P Combat Sim? Fighting with accurate newtonian physics doesn't make that much fun.

@OnTopic
Challenge yourself, don't let a single Kerbal die! I'm doing that right now, having Jeb become the first Kerbal to set foot on every solid body in the Kerbal system. (including the use of Ion Cross Crew Support Plugin)

The time I spent designing a mission exceeds the time used to actually fly that mission ..

Bishop149 · Post by **Bishop149** » Mon, 30. Sep 13, 12:26

Aragosnat wrote:Bishop149: Have you tried using the drouge chutes with it. AS they do fully deploy sooner then the others which ussually make it slow down to safer speeds before the main ones deploy.

Yeah Drouges help. . . my redesigned version of the base has quite a few of them and for my current design I really wish Squad had included some laterally attaching ones. . . the only versions currently in game are HUGE and vertical attach only.

I did rescue the chap in the cupola with an orbital rendezvous, something I'm getting reasonable proficient at now and I actually did manage to get the other 2 down safely too although it took a fair few attempts.

Final method was

- Aerobrake in
- Deploy 2 of the chutes, the central one and one of the trilaterally symmetric ones.
- Burn the remaining fuel in the engines (pointing straight down) like hell.
- Between the 2 semi-deployed chutes and the burn rate of decent can be dropped below 90 m/s
- Just before chute deployment at 500m cut the trilateral chute, central chute deploys and manages to remain connected to the base.
- Ditch the lower stage and engines, open 2 remaining chutes.
- Lower landing legs . . . wrong angle for them to work but will at least hit the ground first and prehaps take the worst of the hit.
- Hope for the best, impact at a tilt at 7-8 m/s

I originally tried this a couple of times over water (thinking the edge might be taken off the impact) and it did not go at all well . . . . then did it over land an surprisingly land impacts actually seem to be softer than water ones.

Thus far I have never lost a Kerbal. . . but I make liberal use of the "revert to launch" and quicksave features!

Fallen-Angel · Post by **Fallen-Angel** » Tue, 1. Oct 13, 09:46

**** YEAH: KW Rocketry is back!

My favorite Rocket Part Pack .. <3

Bishop149 · Post by **Bishop149** » Tue, 1. Oct 13, 14:40

So last night I did my first successful SSTO in any format actually but this one was a spaceplane:

Near its jet thrust ceiling. . maxxed out for me at around 24-25km up at 1700m/s
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... 569C199C1/

Orbit! With a MIGHTY 10 units of oxidiser left!
http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... BD373C099/

Its actually a little more than my first SSTO, its designed to be an orbital delivery system for this insane little thing:
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... 5EC87FD66/

That is the smallest manned interplanetary craft I can make. Its designed as a return capsule to get Kerbals back from Laythe. I have tested it by leaving Kerbins sphere of influence in it and the returning to land. Its DeltaV should be enough to get it almost anywhere in the system and back again. . . . . REALLY quite slow though!

Pretty Picture:
http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... E7A4B4E25/

And the latest most refined design of the SSTO delivery spaceplane, it looks rather lovely:
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... A5B2CD6D7/

A more extensive account of my recent activity here:
http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/thr ... post669629

Aragosnat · Post by **Aragosnat** » Thu, 3. Oct 13, 23:08

Bishop149 wrote:So last night I did my first successful SSTO in any format actually but this one was a spaceplane:

Near its jet thrust ceiling. . maxxed out for me at around 24-25km up at 1700m/s
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... 569C199C1/

Orbit! With a MIGHTY 10 units of oxidiser left!
http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... BD373C099/

Its actually a little more than my first SSTO, its designed to be an orbital delivery system for this insane little thing:
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... 5EC87FD66/

That is the smallest manned interplanetary craft I can make. Its designed as a return capsule to get Kerbals back from Laythe. I have tested it by leaving Kerbins sphere of influence in it and the returning to land. Its DeltaV should be enough to get it almost anywhere in the system and back again. . . . . REALLY quite slow though!

Pretty Picture:
http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... E7A4B4E25/

And the latest most refined design of the SSTO delivery spaceplane, it looks rather lovely:
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... A5B2CD6D7/

A more extensive account of my recent activity here:
http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/thr ... post669629

I see a problems with your SSTO spaceplane. It has decuplors. Other then all those exsesive control surfaces adding needless mass. How does it handle in space? Any pitching in one direction from the lack of atmposhere?

Bishop149 · Post by **Bishop149** » Fri, 4. Oct 13, 12:49

Aragosnat wrote:I see a problems with your SSTO spaceplane. It has decuplors. Other then all those exsesive control surfaces adding needless mass. How does it handle in space? Any pitching in one direction from the lack of atmposhere?

It only has one decoupler. . . to separate the payload from the rest of the plane when in orbit. Its designed very much as a delivery to orbit system and very little else.

It has been redesigned a little, it has a split tailplane at an angle which the game doesn't like so that's gone replaced with a single one. Also more Air intakes, now has 8 RAM scoops instead of 6, no radials and less oxidizer carried . . . one of the issues here is that there isn't much variety in size and shape of liquid Fuel only tanks meaning your often stuck carrying a bunch of heavy oxidizer you don't need.

I was finding it quite hard to pitch effectively and the angle of attack to maintain climb seemed too high. Also upon adding enough chutes to drop it safely, it became too heavy to make orbit

Wasn't having much luck refining it myself so I asked on the forums who suggested 2 solutions, one I had thought off and one I hadn't.

1) Hadn't though of - Plane too short and shubby. . . control surfaces to pitch are more effective when further apart along the body of the craft. also allow for a greater separation between the center of mass and center of lift which can be useful.

2) Had though of - Not enough wings / control surfaces. . . . craft / payload is quite heavy = more lift required. Also control surface weigh next to nothing. . . . all the wings combined weigh less than a couple of parachutes which is a little odd.

I'm gonna try out both suggestions at some point. . . they do make sense.
Forum suggests the first is likely to be a bigger issue than the second

Fallen-Angel · Post by **Fallen-Angel** » Sat, 5. Oct 13, 19:20

For lots of liquid fuel only parts try B9's Aerospace Pack.

Aragosnat · Post by **Aragosnat** » Sun, 6. Oct 13, 19:34

@Bishop149: Ok. That makes sense now. Wonder if you could get away with using a docking port instead of a decoupler?

Dantrithor · Post by **Dantrithor** » Mon, 7. Oct 13, 23:21

I got bored.

So what if I made a ground attack fighter?

There it is. Missiles included. Everything's stock. Not very complicated, but it works. And you can actually hit stuff with the missiles sometimes!

http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/7656 ... reenshots/

EDIT: The missiles actually flight straight for a long while, but I get yaw induced by the difference in aerodynamic lift between the loaded/unloaded wings. (Which is why I put 4 ailerons)

Bishop149 · Post by **Bishop149** » Tue, 8. Oct 13, 12:51

I have given up on the SSTO's!

Refinements were going well but I got to the point in the design where I came to the conclusion "I need a 3rd Jet Engine".

Which made me start thinking of the thing I'd made originally. . . which I went back to, refined and you know what it works perfectly now and is no heavier than the 3 engine SSTO would have ended up.

The below is the early version of the final product, it a jet first stage rocket basically.
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/919 ... 98DFEBCD2/
The final version is slightly smaller and lighter, has a working parachute decent system and more staging.

So my conclusion is that SSTO's are an absolute pain to design and fly and actually no more weight efficient than a staged rocket using jets as the 1st stage.

In fact I am so enamored of jets as a 1st stage I am rebuilding my heavy lifter. . .

Picture is too dark but I hope you can grasp the sheer number of jets!
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/921 ... F036CEBE8/
It also seems to have a magic fuel tank whose engines are lit but are drawing no fuel!

pjknibbs · Post by **pjknibbs** » Tue, 8. Oct 13, 13:18

Well, simple physics indicates that the winged SSTO will be more fuel-efficient than the rocket with jet engines, because you're getting lift from the wings assisting your upward progression--doesn't make a difference right now, obviously, but may be significant when they implement career mode and you actually have to *pay* for all that fuel!

Bishop149 · Post by **Bishop149** » Tue, 8. Oct 13, 14:42

pjknibbs wrote:Well, simple physics indicates that the winged SSTO will be more fuel-efficient than the rocket with jet engines, because you're getting lift from the wings assisting your upward progression--doesn't make a difference right now, obviously, but may be significant when they implement career mode and you actually have to *pay* for all that fuel!

Makes sense.

But my jet assisted rocket carries almost exactly the same amount of fuel as the SSTO version (bit more oxidizer maybe, which is dumped with the jet stage). . . so the only advantage the wings seem to confer is the SS bit. . . i.e. you can get the whole thing to orbit without having to shed mass on the way up.

softweir · Post by **softweir** » Wed, 16. Oct 13, 04:18

Release 0.22.0 out some time today (2013-10-16).

Improved lander legs (shock-absorbing!)
Improved stability systems (SAS)
A new, improved Kerbal Space Centre with new buildings, lighting and runway lights
And the first two bricks in the edifice that will be a Career mode:
- Science!
- R&D.

egosoft.com

egosoft.com

Kerbal Space Program (in-dev retail game)