[AL PLUGIN] Pirate Guild v1.20 [28/09/2005]

[Carl Sumner]

Wow this script looks really cool. I think I need to secure my holdings before I implement it. This is just the added excitement I've been looking for!!

To any of you using the race/fleet response script with the Pirate Guild script; when a pirate fleet attacks and a response fleet jumps in to counter attack is it an even battle? The reason for my question is that I am trying to deside if it's a good idea to use the Race/Fleet Response script with the Pirate Guild script. Any feed back is greatly appreciated.

It seems to be a little in favor of the jumpfleets. but I need to check if I have the new version of the pirate guild script. ... I still have the old one, the new gun loadout might change things.

I hope it has a lower limit on the number of pirates spawned, than the old version. My game has them all over the place, about 15-25 in several sectors. It's hitting my fps even OOS.

Will the pirates spawn more ships if the jumpfleets show up? But not all of those systems have jumpfleets there.

I used the conflict report program to check these, but it did not show any conflicts.

[Valen68]

In favor of the jump fleets sounds realistic and that is good there are not jump fleets in every system (meaning most militaries don't have the resources to respond to every threat). I think once I secure a few things tonight I will install both scripts. What are the specs on your PC Carl? Is there any other scripts you recommend running with these two scripts?

Thanks for the feedback,
V

[Carl Sumner]

In favor of the jump fleets sounds realistic and that is good there are not jump fleets in every system (meaning most militaries don't have the resources to respond to every threat). I think once I secure a few things tonight I will install both scripts. What are the specs on your PC Carl? Is there any other scripts you recommend running with these two scripts?

Besides the Bonus scripts, I use the "Xai Advanced AI project V3.12m" and the "Mark's Fight MkIII Patrol", "Mark's Fight MkIII Wing", "Mark's Resupply".
I also use my posted scripts "CWS Defensive Turrets" and "CWS Get Ware and Continue".

Win98Sec, Asus mobo P4 2.4Ghz, 512M ram 533 fsb, Geforce FX 5600XT 1024X768X32.

[Valen68]

Sounds good; have you installed the latest bonus scripts (the one with the Telcat) and how is it working out with the rest of the scripts you run?

I am using most Xai and Marks scripts. I will have to check out your CWS scripts, definitely could help me out.

I am running XP, Giga MB AMD 3200 2.2ghz, 1gig 3200 ram, Geforce FX5700VE 256mb, 1280x768 or 1024x32 I use to get slow frame rate until I turned off shadows. Now everything runs smooth. I am saving up for a Geforce 6800 w/256mb

[AdmiralTigerclaw]

I suggest pumping the processor up to a three gig as well.

And when you upgrade, double check your power supply and ensure it can handle the greater power parts.

And I suggest an Asus motherboard when you decide to upgrade processors.

Mine supports up to thirty percent overclocking in the bios alone(I only overclock at ten percent, as any higher and the CPU surface temp goes above 64 degrees C which is the maximum suggested safe operating temp...), and has an automatic idle thottle back. (When the computer isn't doing much, the CPU cuts back to as little as 12.5% of top rated speed. Saves power, and keeps the room cool at night!)

[Serial Kicked]

A quick answer here

The jumpfleet is *much* stronger than pirates. In fact, and it's not really related to my plugin, OOS a lone M2 can destroy more than 100 fully loaded M3. So imagine with the jumpfleet

It's a good idead to use both scripts. "Standard" AI sector patrols aren't strong enough to stop the most massive raids. But don't forget, with my plugin activated, you'll have to kill pirates. You can't just ignore them or they will become more than a simple threat.

By the way, pirate guild don't "spawn" M3. Pirates have to buy them. Then they give a mission to these ships. The number of ship sent for (let's say) a raid is hardcoded, and not dependant of the sector defenses.

In my main game i'm using those 3 scripts
- XaiCorp Advanced Combat
- RRS
- Pirate Guild

It's a quite interesting combo, but i've to admit that sometimes, and IN sector, performance drop can be more than heavy.

I'm a bit surprised about the OOS performance drop of carl summer. When i wrote the plugin i had an AthlonXP 1600 with 256mb RAM and it was not so processor intensive OOS. But if you don't destroy any pirate base and use SETA during a few weeks the pirates can become an issue for "old" computers, that's true. I'll try to find a way to limit this.

[DrunkenPirate]

Haven't had any issues so far and am enjoying it, I dispense with the occasional Pirate base now and again.

[Stonerkrieg]

I'm using Pirate Guild 1.1 Advanced AI and Race response fleets.Ore belt has become a three way slaughter house,what with the Khaak incursions there.Losses so far;PiratesM6,Argon 2M6's,and the Collosus has taken damage.

[Carl Sumner]

Sounds good; have you installed the latest bonus scripts (the one with the Telcat) and how is it working out with the rest of the scripts you run?

Yes, I have all of the Bonus scripts in except Basic Patrol, I'm using Mark's Patrol and Wing scripts instead. All of that seems ok.

By the way, pirate guild don't "spawn" M3. Pirates have to buy them. Then they give a mission to these ships. The number of ship sent for (let's say) a raid is hardcoded, and not dependant of the sector defenses.

Where is this hardcoded? I would like to change mine to reduce the number of ships spawned.

I'm a bit surprised about the OOS performance drop of carl summer. When i wrote the plugin i had an AthlonXP 1600 with 256mb RAM and it was not so processor intensive OOS. But if you don't destroy any pirate base and use SETA during a few weeks the pirates can become an issue for "old" computers, that's true. I'll try to find a way to limit this.

The drop in fps OOS is not nearly so noticable as the effect in sector. I am getting about 5 to 8 fps in sector with the pirate fleets. The effect OOS is more intermittant, sort of like watching someone walk with a broken ankle.
I suspect it is due to a loop that has no wait statements. When it runs, the other tasks in the game lock for a moment. Even if it is not run very often in the script, if a lot of ships are using this script it could end up running the loop a Lot.

I am also seeing an occasional complete lockup of the game when I am in-sector with a pirate fleet. If I turn off the AL switch for the pirate script and wait until the pirates are cleaned out it, does not seem to happen. Of course, it is hard to tell with intermittant phenomena.

It sounds like the pirate bases should work for a while before sending out big attack fleets. In my game they seem to load up and send out big fleets withing a few minutes, not more than a couple of hours. Maybe something is wrong with my scripts.

I have not opened the whole map this time, yet. Maybe all of the pirate fleets for the whole map are being squeezed into the Argon and surrounding sectors? Just a quess...

[Serial Kicked]

Where is this hardcoded? I would like to change mine to reduce the number of ships spawned.

Changing the number of ship bought by the Guild can't be done easily. The number of ships sent in a massive raid can be changed in the line 11 of file aaa.pirate.hq.ai.xml

You can also give them less money, go to aaa.pirate.ai.xml and change the value in line 4 to something smaller (let's say 10000). You will have to go to AL Plugin , set the plugin to OFF, wait about 20 minutes and set it back to TRUE to validate the change.

The drop in fps OOS is not nearly so noticable as the effect in sector. I am getting about 5 to 8 fps in sector with the pirate fleets. The effect OOS is more intermittant, sort of like watching someone walk with a broken ankle.

omg, For your system it's LOW. Did you set AntiAliasing and shadows off ?

I suspect it is due to a loop that has no wait statements. When it runs, the other tasks in the game lock for a moment. Even if it is not run very often in the script, if a lot of ships are using this script it could end up running the loop a Lot.

I've checked all my loops, and they are correctly written. All my ships are running standard "egosoft" commands. Anyway the main script is only called every 10 or 20 minutes, this script simply run a sub script for each pirate base base telling it what to do. So, in fact, my script is idle 90% of the time.

I am also seeing an occasional complete lockup of the game when I am in-sector with a pirate fleet. If I turn off the AL switch for the pirate script and wait until the pirates are cleaned out it, does not seem to happen. Of course, it is hard to tell with intermittant phenomena.

Still look like a performance issue. Except the bonus & mark's scripts do you use other scripts ? (even trivial ones). I've never noticed such a hang with my script.

Setting ON/OFF the AL switch too often isn't good (for you). Each time you do this, the amount of money the pirates own is restored, so more ships are added. And if you do not wait a while beetwen 2 activations you can have weird results.

It sounds like the pirate bases should work for a while before sending out big attack fleets. In my game they seem to load up and send out big fleets withing a few minutes, not more than a couple of hours. Maybe something is wrong with my scripts.

This is exactly what they are supposed to do. What do you call a "big attack fleet" ? The biggest fleet you should see in the first few minutes is about 10 ships, and you should not see a lot of these fleets until a while.

Are you in a custom galaxy ?

I have not opened the whole map this time, yet. Maybe all of the pirate fleets for the whole map are being squeezed into the Argon and surrounding sectors? Just a quess...

In the standard map, there's a lot of PB near Argon sectors that's right, but it's still weird.

I'll try tonight to let the game run at SETAx10 during some hours to see what happen with the v1.1 of my script. Maybe you could do the same on a fresh install in another directory without any 3rd-party script except the bonuspack.

You could also set the global variable "pirate.verbose" to TRUE (see readme) to see what happens.

@Valen68 : It should work fine. Except for the gfx card, my system is a bit lower.

[Carl Sumner]

The number of ships sent in a massive raid can be changed in the line 11 of file aaa.pirate.hq.ai.xml

You can also give them less money, go to aaa.pirate.ai.xml and change the value in line 4 to something smaller (let's say 10000). You will have to go to AL Plugin , set the plugin to OFF, wait about 20 minutes and set it back to TRUE to validate the change.

Thanks, I will study those areas first.
Do you mean aaa.lib.pirate.hq.ai.xml? I assume so.
I see a log statement there when a fleet is sent, that is not switched by the flag. Should I be seeing these in the log? I have not seen any. I had V1.0 in before, have I messed up the install of V1.1?

I am getting about 5 to 8 fps in sector with the pirate fleets. The effect OOS is more intermittant, sort of like watching someone walk with a broken ankle.

omg, For your system it's LOW. Did you set AntiAliasing and shadows off ?

Yes, they are off. When I turn off the AL switch and wait for the pirates to "go away" the fps comes back to around 25-40.

I've checked all my loops, and they are correctly written. All my ships are running standard "egosoft" commands. Anyway the main script is only called every 10 or 20 minutes, this script simply run a sub script for each pirate base base telling it what to do. So, in fact, my script is idle 90% of the time.:

Beware of the standard scripts. If they return without calling wait states, for any reason, then your loop can run open. A small wait in the loop is a good idea, unless by examining the Egosoft script you can see that this can never happen.

I am also seeing an occasional complete lockup of the game when I am in-sector with a pirate fleet.

Still look like a performance issue. Except the bonus & mark's scripts do you use other scripts ? (even trivial ones). I've never noticed such a hang with my script.

It is hard to track down, since it locks the whole game. When I have seen this before, it was a run-away loop in a script. The task switching in X2 is "Cooperative" instead of "Preemptive" so a script that winds up a loop, that never calls anything that does a task switch (such as a wait), can lock up the entire game.
I only turned the AL switch on twice, and waited an hour or two each time before changing anything.

I have the Bonus scriupts V1.04.01, except Basic patrol, and:
Mark's Patrol and Wing scripts (Fight MkIII) V2.0c.
Mark's Resupply script V2.0c. (Not used)
Xai Advanced AI (Fight MkIII) script V3.12m.
CWS Buy Ware and Continue V1.0 (Not used)
CWS Defensive Turrets V1.0
Xai FindFactoryOrders V1.0 (Not used)
JumpFleets (Race response) V1.5
PirateGuild V1.1

As noted, I have been careful not to use some of these at this time, to simplify testing.
I have run the X2 Conflict Report utility on these and it does not find any conflicts in the "t" files.

What do you call a "big attack fleet" ? The biggest fleet you should see in the first few minutes is about 10 ships, and you should not see a lot of these fleets until a while.
Are you in a custom galaxy ?

Looks like 15-20 pirates in a sector that is attacked, scattered over the stations and freighters there.
The script limit I see is 50, seems like that is way too many for my system.

You could also set the global variable "pirate.verbose" to TRUE (see readme) to see what happens.

Ok.

[Carl Sumner]

I am running XP, Giga MB AMD 3200 2.2ghz, 1gig 3200 ram, Geforce FX5700VE 256mb, 1280x768

I suggest pumping the processor up to a three gig as well.

Don't forget to check the speed of the Mother Board's "Front Side Buss" (fsb) that feeds the RAM, AGP connector and PCI connectors. This can effect throughput more than the CPU speed. The ratings can be misleading since most specs multiply the actual speed by the byte width of the buss. 400 is medium these days, 533 used to be fast, 800 is faster but more expensive.

[aka1nas]

I am running XP, Giga MB AMD 3200 2.2ghz, 1gig 3200 ram, Geforce FX5700VE 256mb, 1280x768

I suggest pumping the processor up to a three gig as well.

Don't forget to check the speed of the Mother Board's "Front Side Buss" (fsb) that feeds the RAM, AGP connector and PCI connectors. This can effect throughput more than the CPU speed. The ratings can be misleading since most specs multiply the actual speed by the byte width of the buss. 400 is medium these days, 533 used to be fast, 800 is faster but more expensive.

Yeah, if you are going to stick with Intel, than definately go up to a 800Mhz FSB setup as I imagine the memory bandwith can only help this game on a P4 setup. I am running a Athlon64 OCed to 2.5Ghz with 2GB of RAM and a Geforce 6800 and I get about 45fps unless it is a very busy sector(I have 100+ factories in Akeelas beacon so it drops to about 16fps there).

[D_Zorro]

Really ?? I have 533 Mhz at the moment will have to update too 800 Mhz too then.


DZorro,

[Serial Kicked]

Hum, off topic board please guys

Anyway,

@Carl Summer :

Do you mean aaa.lib.pirate.hq.ai.xml? I assume so. I see a log statement there when a fleet is sent, that is not switched by the flag. Should I be seeing these in the log? I have not seen any. I had V1.0 in before, have I messed up the install of V1.1?

Nope, i meant aaa.pirate.ai.xml . It's where all default settings are set. Verbose, starting money, etc. It's the main script called by the AL engine. You should see logs in your 'player log' if you set pirate.verbose to TRUE

Beware of the standard scripts. If they return without calling wait states, for any reason, then your loop can run open. A small wait in the loop is a good idea, unless by examining the Egosoft script you can see that this can never happen.

Nope. A "start" statement is used to call ship commands, so they are run in a different process. I'm not waiting for any result from these commands. By the way, the only loops i'm using are for fleet, sector and target selection.

Looks like 15-20 pirates in a sector that is attacked, scattered over the stations and freighters there.The script limit I see is 50, seems like that is way too many for my system.

The limite for the massive raid is 50, there's plenty of smaller kinds of attacks (TS raid = 3 ships ; M6/TL kill'n'destroy = 15 ; etc...). I've explained in the first pages of the topic how it works.

Anyway, handling 50, 100 or even 1000 more ships OOS should not be an issue at all for your system. X² is already running more complex commands on thousands of ships.

I've tried to run my script (1.1) at SETAx10 during about 10 (real) hours. I had no slowdown and no hang. The game is still running at 80fps. So here's the only explanations i have :

- I tried to updgrade my script from 1.0 to 1.1 several times, without desactivating correctly the AL plugin. and ONCE it seems i had the same problem as you. The game completetly froze without any reason. However i had no slowdown, only the random hang.
The only solution I see is to :
- set the AL switch to False.
- Wait until there's none of my scripts running (check the script debugger).
- Save in new slot.
- Quit the game.
- Go to your script folder.
- Delete all my files (aaa.*, al.pirate.*, al.plugin.pirate.*).
- Lauch X².
- Load your savegame
- Save again
- Quit
- Install version 1.1
- Load and play
It should solve the "hanging" issue.

- The only plugin you have i've never tried is the Defensive Turret. I don't know how it works, but if this script install itself on all ships and try to work OOS (even if it's useless for a turret related script), the slowdown is caused by this one.

- With or without my plugin, your game is damn slow. Maybe it's related to Win98 or to a virus.

I hope it can help you.

[Carl Sumner]

The only solution I see is to...

I think that when I did this before, I must not have cleared out all of the pirate ships. I am trying again, but since I had started a new game and only have one M6 so far, it is taking some time to clear them.

The only plugin you have i've never tried is the Defensive Turret. I don't know how it works, but if this script install itself on all ships and try to work OOS (even if it's useless for a turret related script), the slowdown is caused by this one.

I am the author of the "CWS Defensive Turrets". It only enables the defensive turret commands for ships with Trade software, as well as the ships with Fight software. It has no loops at all, only a "Setup" script.
I think the condition described above is probably the problem. It seems to be correlated with me going in-sector where there is a pirate attack.

With or without my plugin, your game is damn slow. Maybe it's related to Win98 or to a virus.

I ran the X2 Benchmark and got an average of 36 fps. Some of speed is due to the Video board, a GeForce FX 5600XT. This is a down-clocked board with an advanced video chip that does not quite run at the advanced clock speed. For X2, it is better than an older chip at a higher clock because of the DX8+ functions used. But for some things it is still slow. Also My front side buss is only 533Mhz, not 400Mhz.
Win98SE is usually faster than XP or 2000 because of the lower overhead. Also, this effect would be a constant during this test, I have not changed it. I scanned with Norton antivirus and it shows Ok.

I am in the process of clearing out all of the pirates to get a clean script install. More soon.

[Serial Kicked]

I'm really sorry but i can't help you more. Lot of people in both french and english boards had no problem with my script. All i can say is that i'm really sorry about the issues you had. If you can figure where the problem is coming from i'll be very happy to know more about it.

The only thing i'm totally sure, 36fps with your system isn't logical at all. My perfs on a poor Athlon1600 with 256mb RAM and a GF4-Ti 4200 were better.

PS and off-topic : even if NAV is "famous", it's one of the worst AV i know. It can be very processor intensive and can cause slowdowns with a lot of other softwares. (i'm quite sure of this, i've been a moderator on some major french hardware and p2p related boards).

[MageKingS70]

The only thing i'm totally sure, 36fps with your system isn't logical at all. My perfs on a poor Athlon1600 with 256mb RAM and a GF4-Ti 4200 were better.

I'm running a similar system and I still get around 30-40 fps in X2 - The Threat. And no, I don't have a virus or spyware and no, I'm not using something as stupid as Norton. But then again, I generally have a lot of stuff running in the background. It's amazing the performance boost some computers get when you disable most background stuff. Like I once had a s**t laptop that would get s**t FPS in zSNES, but I disabled all unneccessary background processes (including networking) and my framerate shot up to what I get on my Athalon 2600+. So try disabling background processes and see how much your performance jumps.

[AdmiralTigerclaw]

30 to 40 frames in the benchmark??? Sheesh.

The human eye sees roughly in the range of 60 frames a second... So if anything is to appear smooth they have to run at seventy or better... Any lower and you lose the smooth feel to animation... At 20 FPS or lower, you can easily tell that things are starting to slideshow. by 15 FPS, combat becomes unplayable.

If you're in the thirties in the game BENCHMARK, which is just the graphics and sound running, you'll get HAMMERED when the game has to run 3000 + AI scripts simultaniously for a full game. And the game will be totally unplayable by the time you reach a heavy dogfight.

Don't forget a mandatory spyware search. Those suckers devour resources in a heartbeat.

I suggest optimizing your computer so that you can go from general overall good performance, to a localized one program PC dedication for certain things such as X2. Also, I suggest a board with automatic throttleback... it'll save you the sweat and power bills when the CPU cuts back to twelve percent speed and cools down.

[MageKingS70]

Actually, that 30 to 40 fps is for in-game. And it stays constant no matter what I do, no matter what scripts I'm running. I've been in massive capship battles with no slowdown, and ditto for huge fighter engagements. It's kinda been freakin' me out. I get the 70 fps on my other comp, but I don't use that one much.