Is it worth getting X4?

[Crux_72]

So much negativity and comments about boredome that you wonder how people sink literally hundreds if not thousand of hours into this game.
It's also funny when someone on steam rates game as "not recommended" due to boredome after playing for 130 hours. This is normal to be bored of something after 130 hours.
I find this game to be a perfect sandbox, while it may still have some rough edges I get a lot of fun from it. I see how powerful new engine is and I'm amazed by what things ego and modders can do given enough time.
If you are not happy with some vanilla aspects just install a mod, there are already some big mods with big number of sectors, new ships, commands, balancing etc etc.
I just do not understand why people don't use mods if they want to spice up a game.

That's because after the 130 hours you mentioned they realize that there's actually nothing left to see or do for them - if you don't act too stupid or withhold certain game elements from yourself you'll have seen everything after about 10 - 20 hours - and this not because the actual size of the game would be small but because it's too easy and too fast to get anything. But that's just my opinion, I'm aware that others see it differently.

So for my part I advise against a purchase at the moment although I have sunk about 200 hours into X4 myself. I would wait until 3.0 appears and then take a close look on X4 again, because 3.0 should turn a few things upside down again and improve the game as a hole. Since the announcement of 3.0 and the DLC, I haven't touched X4 since, instead I play X2 again, in which I've already spent more hours than in X4 so far - and I'm curious whether 3.0 can change that for me.

PS: Somewhere someone has written X4 is a good mix between a Solar Empire and Freelancer... well, maybe that's my problem. X4 plays more like an RTS than an X relatively quickly, which I personally don't like.

[tomchk]

I also think many of the negative reviews after ~100 hours are because those people were so frustrated they had to spend that much time to deal with certain bugs, lack of documentation, sometimes confusing or inconvenient interface, and so on. I kind of get that perspective, although I do believe X4 deserves very positive reviews--more so after each big improvement.

[Angsaar]

I just do not understand why people don't use mods if they want to spice up a game.

I know a couple of people prejudiced towards modding, they still think that it's analogue to hacking game files. Or that it detracts from the developer's intent and vision for the game.

Some don't understand that nowadays most modding is done either with tools provided by the developer or on file types explicitly chosen to be accessible and not encrypted.
That even if not actively supported by the developer modding only really thrives when allowed. Most people don't want to waste their time and will mod what's easy, you know?

The fact that games probably never really fit the developer's intent and vision because of deadlines and budget doesn't cross their mind, like they only release a game when all they wanted is accomplished.
Maybe a modder will add something the developer wanted but didn't have time or resources, or something great that didn't cross their mind.

Admittedly most I know are console based so touching an editor it still a foreign concept for them, and only patches and expansions/DLCs can improve most games further.

[Crux_72]

I just do not understand why people don't use mods if they want to spice up a game.

I know a couple of people prejudiced towards modding, they still think that it's analogue to hacking game files. Or that it detracts from the developer's intent and vision for the game.

Some don't understand that nowadays most modding is done either with tools provided by the developer or on file types explicitly chosen to be accessible and not encrypted.
That even if not actively supported by the developer modding only really thrives when allowed. Most people don't want to waste their time and will mod what's easy, you know?

The fact that games probably never really fit the developer's intent and vision because of deadlines and budget doesn't cross their mind, like they only release a game when all they wanted is accomplished.
Maybe a modder will add something the developer wanted but didn't have time or resources, or something great that didn't cross their mind.

Admittedly most I know are console based so touching an editor it still a foreign concept for them, and only patches and expansions/DLCs can improve most games further.

But there are also other reasons for not using mods on X4, for example the fact that it is not foreseeable if a collection of mods will work with the next big update. For my part I have found the perfect mod collection for me and I hope to have a good gaming experience in 3.0 with them. One of these mods removes the local highways, another one the encounter mechanics, both things I don't like and both things will be touched with 3.0 and Vendetta.

This was one of the reasons why I put the game away for now, because without these two mods I don't like X4 and I'm afraid to spend time with X4 when I'm a few weeks away from the situation that I (again) don't like it. I think, when the big updates are through, it will stabilize, but at the moment it's a little too early for mods, in my opinion.

[Angsaar]

But there are also other reasons for not using mods on X4, for example the fact that it is not foreseeable if a collection of mods will work with the next big update. For my part I have found the perfect mod collection for me and I hope to have a good gaming experience in 3.0 with them. One of these mods removes the local highways, another one the encounter mechanics, both things I don't like and both things will be touched with 3.0 and Vendetta.

This was one of the reasons why I put the game away for now, because without these two mods I don't like X4 and I'm afraid to spend time with X4 when I'm a few weeks away from the situation that I (again) don't like it. I think, when the big updates are through, it will stabilize, but at the moment it's a little too early for mods, in my opinion.

A fair choice, but similar to Shuulo's it's my opinion - in no way invalidating your own, since I value democratic debate - that the game should not be un-recommended if it can be appreciated with mods since those are a feature, even including in-game activation and Steam integration. Especially if it can be appreciated for so many hours. Personally I'd just make clear in the recommendation that it is dependent on mods and those are prone to patching incompatibility - with patches being something you can opt not to download.

Edit: and as a mod tinkerer I agree it can be a little early for some specific types of mods more prone to patching issues, took me a few days to gather the courage to see what was the issue with mine.

[Crux_72]

But there are also other reasons for not using mods on X4, for example the fact that it is not foreseeable if a collection of mods will work with the next big update. For my part I have found the perfect mod collection for me and I hope to have a good gaming experience in 3.0 with them. One of these mods removes the local highways, another one the encounter mechanics, both things I don't like and both things will be touched with 3.0 and Vendetta.

This was one of the reasons why I put the game away for now, because without these two mods I don't like X4 and I'm afraid to spend time with X4 when I'm a few weeks away from the situation that I (again) don't like it. I think, when the big updates are through, it will stabilize, but at the moment it's a little too early for mods, in my opinion.

A fair choice, but similar to Shuulo's it's my opinion - in no way invalidating your own, since I value democratic debate - that the game should not be un-recommended if it can be appreciated with mods since those are a feature, even including in-game activation and Steam integration. Especially if it can be appreciated for so many hours. Personally I'd just make clear in the recommendation that it is dependent on mods and those are prone to patching incompatibility - with patches being something you can opt not to download.

Edit: and as a mod tinkerer I agree it can be a little early for some specific types of mods more prone to patching issues, took me a few days to gather the courage to see what was the issue with mine.

Basically, I agree with you, but keep in mind that using mods excludes a player from the online part, for example. For me this means that mods are not yet 100% legitimate, which is why I stick to the Vanilla version in all my comments (and also the question about the recommendation).

I could recommend X4 if the player takes the time to find the right mods for him and accepts to be excluded from certain areas of the game. At the same time I would like to point out that this undertaking is a delicate one due to the current state of development of X4. And then again I would have to go into why I'm talking about a tricky undertaking with version 2.6 or 3.0, something that can irritate new customers due to the high version number.

Personally I am interested in game reviews and recommendations more about how the game performs in its Vanilla version, because it is the only form of the game which is also 100% supported by the developers. Furthermore it is for me a difference whether a game is simply modifiable or whether mods are basically a prerequisite to have fun with the game at all. This is not always easy to achieve or to express in simple words, which is exactly why such discussions are important as I think. Therefore I also thank you for this democratic and open dialogue

[Graaf]

So much negativity and comments about boredome that you wonder how people sink literally hundreds if not thousand of hours into this game.
It's also funny when someone on steam rates game as "not recommended" due to boredome after playing for 130 hours. This is normal to be bored of something after 130 hours.

If you have to do things 2 or 3 times because things are bugged then time does start to add up. Also just having the game open on the main menu counts as playtime. Going through the menu's and controls also counts as playtime. Testing of undocumented features takes time.

If you are not happy with some vanilla aspects just install a mod, there are already some big mods with big number of sectors, new ships, commands, balancing etc etc.
I just do not understand why people don't use mods if they want to spice up a game.

Mods should be used to make a good game better, not to make a bad game somewhat acceptable. Unfortunately there is no mod that fixes the IMHO bad game design. It's easier to just play another game, like X3 or something entirely different.
And just FYI: I have 1 mod for X3:AP. A cockpit mod. That is all I need to make a good game better (more immersive).

I find this game to be a perfect sandbox, while it may still have some rough edges I get a lot of fun from it. I see how powerful new engine is and I'm amazed by what things ego and modders can do given enough time.

What Ego can do given enough time? Thus far we got a failed Rebirth and half a Foundation for only 12 years of development. That is the same time between release of X:BtF & A3:AP. How much time should we give them?

[tomchk]

I get calling XR failed at release, but did you play the whole campaign after 3.0 or now 4.3? At 4.3, I consider it one of my favorite games.

[Angsaar]

What Ego can do given enough time? Thus far we got a failed Rebirth and half a Foundation for only 12 years of development. That is the same time between release of X:BtF & A3:AP. How much time should we give them?

All the time they want, its their game not ours.

And XR sure isn't a failure, there's plenty of people who played it long enough to attest to it being a pretty damn good game today.

It's either not to your taste or you haven't actually played it recently, none of those cases makes it a failure.

Actually, I wish X4 was a lot more like XR, in sectors and combat especially, both absolutely stunning.

[Virtualaughing]

Read again, i am talking about hiding the cockpit, not the HUD.
You can toggle the hud via SHIFT+D by default.
You can toggle the cockpit by assigning a key mapping to it.

We added this feature for people which had built their own flight cockpits, where "duplicate" cockpit frames would be not of help.

Sorry. Found it.

[tomchk]

Actually, I wish X4 was a lot more like XR, in sectors and combat especially, both absolutely stunning.

Lino and company are definitely working on improving X4's effects--people like us bring it up a lot. I totally agree. Egosoft deserves *way* more credit for XR now that it is in a stable, polished, and tweaked form. I think the sector design may have been the best part. Can you imagine how much thought went into world building? And the attention to detail was so amazing. X4 has awesome attention to detail as well (in some areas more), just not as much in the fly-past-planets-and-suns sense--YET!

[Angsaar]

YET!

YET

Edit: Fun fact - So many naysayers like to use Steam ratings as their source, but if you filter pre-2015's with less then 15h of play out (anyone who looked past the one-ship-thing and put a little effort after 3.0) ratings go past 70%. Pretty good considering unsatisfied people are much more likely to rate as a means of venting frustration.

[tomchk]

Nice! That is good to see. I hope someday it gets higher. I have yet to find a game that matches its beauty and world design.

[Doomdog19]

I am about to reach 1000 hours in game. Sill rocking my save since the start. I also only play Vanilla. I will not add mods until the last patch of X4 is out.

It's 100% worth it, if you find these types of games fun.

[Warnoise]

The correlation between time spent playing and enjoyment factor has never existed so i wish people stop using that as an argument...

I have 100 hours but 75% of it is just me afking waiting for money to pour in. You literally finished the whole game once you get your destroyer and a station (something that brings money). So basically 20~hours is all you need to reach the "late game" since after then you start destroying anything that comes your path.

Some players enjoy making billions....but what for? I can solo a whole faction with my modded destroyer. So faction balance also is bad (each faction is limited to one carrier with....6 or 10 fighters as subordinates...)

The game is barren, too few content. 0 challenge. Some core functions are bugged, The AI is dumb, missions are placeholder, Ship balance is bad, Khaak are placeholder, Pirates are placeholder some weapons are placeholder.....I can continue on that.

So currently the game isn't worth it. Maybe after 3.0 it will be better.

[Doomdog19]

The correlation between time spent playing and enjoyment factor has never existed so i wish people stop using that as an argument...

I wouldn't have near 1000 hours in X4 if I wasn't having fun. I actually dropped playing day 1 due to bugs and waited for the game to get fixed. Since I started playing again, I've been racking up hours. Another example, I wouldn't have put 3500 hours in X3TC if I wasn't having fun either. Lastly, neither 600 hours in Payday 2 either if I wasn't having fun. Time and enjoyment factor does have a correlation.