Just how much of a mess is Greece in, and what will happen?

[Aye Capn]

More direct elections for public officials doesn't sound like a bad idea.

Here in the United States I think maybe we go a little overboard.

The result is high-stakes political games over low-stakes offices like this one.

It might well be the most hilarious political ad ever conceived, but it's for an elected coroner's job. Do we really need elections for coroner? The dude picks apart dead bodies for a living. I'm as into democracy as the next guy, but coroners?

Still, any bureaucrat with real government power should have to face the music every so often and run for office. Can't disagree with you there.

[Dragoongfa]

....so has Greece collapsed into anarchy yet?

We are getting there, elections are in the 17th and by the looks of it no one will have a parliamentary majority AGAIN.

[Usenko]

This is yet another example of PR elections being borked. I was just reading about the Greek electoral system, and it strikes me that they're putting a lot of effort into an attempt to repair a system that just won't work; you need a divisional system. It's not aesthetically pleasing, necessarily, but it IS the best way to get a workable parliament.

[Tsar_of_Cows]

More direct elections for public officials doesn't sound like a bad idea.

Here in the United States I think maybe we go a little overboard.

The result is high-stakes political games over low-stakes offices like this one.

It also fosters corruption. I remember when I was living in Louisiana, a local judge spent $20 million on getting himself elected for I think it was a 5 year stint on a $500,000 salary.

Now, I can beleive that he really wanted to be a judge, but what was he getting out of it if he had already spent almost 10 times the salary to get the job? Kickbacks perhaps?

Obviously I have no proof that the guy was corrupt, but I can't see any better explaination.

[RegisterMe]

Aye Capn is probably better placed to comment, but I think your judge example is more likely about using it as a platform to launch a political career.

[RegisterMe]

Worth a read.

[Gavrushka]

Excellent read!

I always tried to explain it with a domestic mortgage...

Dad pays mortgage, but things are tight... Family is less than happy... SO he remortgages... and they feel great... They have cars and holidays and eat well... Then the remortgage money is spent... Things go beyond tight... Pocket money is cut, the car is sold, holidays cancelled...

...The family never complained until they hit the tight spot again - So what do they do? Badger Dad to remortgage AGAIN.

Please Dad, I beg you; don't do it.

[amtct]

Worth a read.

According to the International Monetary Fund, the gross government debt of Greece this year will reach 153% of GDP. For Italy the figure is 123%, for Ireland 113%, for Portugal 112% and for the United States 107%.

Britain's debt is approaching 88%. Japan is the world leader, with a mountain of government debt approaching 236% of GDP - more than triple what it was 20 years ago.

Whoever wrote that is just stupid and too well paid.My crap tribe called country has a debt of @30% of GDP and the average wage here is @300 euros for prices bigger than average on Europe (plus 24% VAT on food ) ,so that "omg capitalism and debts are bad is just for brainless idiots".
What will cause "omg I can't pay my debts" is when I have to pay every month 20% from my wage/GDP if you are talking about countries but an asshole ...let's call it government starts changing the rules of the game while playing and my monthly 20% turns into 25% or more.

BUt then again I'm a nobody .The idiot who wrote that works for BBC and gets more money than me...but hey I live in a rich country ....remember 30% debts from a GDP of @120 billions euros.The cool thing is that his wage here would be 200€ plus 40buss tickets

[RegisterMe]

That "idiot" is a professor of economic history at Harvard .

[amtct]

The daughter of the president has two diplomas at harvard and she can't speak her native language or any other language (yes I have link on youtube because she is in EU parliament) .For me a diploma is toilet paper if you BS like that idiot.If you have a diploma support it.Don't be a scientist and come to tell me that Earth is 6000 years old because I'm going to wipe my ass with your Harvard diploma.

Btw Im pretty sure every person can get a diploma at Harvard.I can name at least 200 daddy's boys here which are drug dealers in fancy clubs and all have studied at Harvard

P.S.if he has a diploma the state will force the employer to give him a minimum wage of 180€ per month plus buss tickets ...gotta luv my way too rich country ,especially when a harvard dude tells you so

[Gavrushka]

AdrianM, Romania's economy is about the size of a slug's left leg and I think it has a long way to go before it can be described as progressive and modern...

...Libya had no debt as I understand it...

[amtct]

...Libya had no debt as I understand it...

And yet that dude tells me or I should understand that is better to live in Libya than UK or Germany.The UK economy size is different from the germany's economy....so romania;s economy ,I don't see your point.
When someone tells me a white wall is black I take it as an insult .That jerk just did that .I want to see his Harvard ass living with 180 euros per month then we I want to ask him about debts and how bad is capitalism.

Don't forget "capitalism is bad ,debts are bad ...let's all be billionaires and we will never need to borrow money"

[Gavrushka]

My point is that you need to understand the nuances of Economics before you can fully engage in a meaningful debate on it. (and I don't either before you think that is what I meant! )

It, for me, is essential to rein in spending and restructure the economy to a sustainable model elimating the structural deficit as soon as possible. - Politically, I also feel that an overall reduction of the size of central government and in a devolution of powers to local level along with a shift in emphasis from direct to indirect taxation, all of which I see happening...

If you are an advocate of expanding government control and influence, along with attempting to stimulate an economy by spending more, then I accept that - We just differ in opinion that's all.

[amtct]

If you are an advocate of expanding government control and influence, along with attempting to stimulate an economy by spending more, then I accept that - We just differ in opinion that's all.

No I just mean "never tell me that UK or Germany are poor and shit because their debt is high .If you do that I'm going to call you a jerk and put your Harvard diploma next to the toilet paper .

Also that guy is almost saying "people in Europe live way too well and I find that annoying ...let's change that" .Well helloooo mr HItler dude at Harvard ...I think the goal is to make people have a better life not cut their wages ,put them work more and kill the jews.I (thouh I don't live in UK) don't want english people(or any other human on this planet) to live with 200 euros /pounds per month just because someone said x% from GDP is too much.

[Gavrushka]

LOL! Rich or poor, it pays to spend money wisely.

And due to globalisation, no national economy is really isolated from the rest of the world.

I do wish it was as easy as 'increase everyones wages' and all is well... I just don't think you believe that either.

[amtct]

I do wish it was as easy as 'increase everyones wages' and all is well... I just don't think you believe that either.

Agree but you see ,I'm not trying to change the world by saying "if you lower your debt % from GDB you will live better".That is not the equation becuase you will always find a North Korean who will say "hi my country has no debts FU"

Now with so many diploma owners in US you would think US has 1% or zero debts ...right ...something must be wrong there if there is more than 1%

[Gavrushka]

I think my mind doesn't quite fire the same way as yours does... Your deductive reasoning is beyond my meager comprehensive powers.

[amtct]

I used a quote with what he said and you say "deductive reasoning".Yes if reading is called "deduction " now then you can call it that.

[Gavrushka]

I used a quote with what he said and you say "deductive reasoning".Yes if reading is called "deduction " now then you can call it that.

Were you dipped in a bath of obtuse as a child?

[bubba_000]

Gavrushka, I think what AdrianM basically meant to say is that a lower debt doesn't always bring an improvement in living standards. Virtually all developed countries have high debts. Banana republics like romania (with a lower case R) have low debts, but are still hell for those unfortunate enough to be born in them (sorry bastards like me and Adrian).

I don't know anything about economics, so I won't comment the article linked by RegisterMe(I probably wouldn't understand much of it anyway). Just wanted to clarify


PS: could someone with nukes please wipe this sorry garbage dump of a country off the map and put us out of our misery? We would be eternally grateful