Bernd what part of this speaks "success" to you?

[Tripp_UK]

You can only make a review on Steam if you played that game on Steam.

[CutterJohn1]

Well, the UI in X3 was a bit naff for newcomers - I think the rest of us who have played it for hundreds of hours have gotten used to it, but I went back to AP deliberately to have a look at the UI with as much objectiveness as I could get... it is pretty bad, not terrible by any means, but for a newbie.. its not good.

The answer is obviously to revamp the UI somewhat, the commands and options offered by those menus all need to be retained but presented differently. I'd say what was really needed was 2 things - a way to pop a context menu for each and every item (ship, npc merchant, station etc) and another way of getting to those items - a contacts manager of some sort.

What X:R has done has scrapped all those menu commands though and replaced them with something awful. It needs to go, it needs a way to locate all of your assets or things you want to interact with in a really easy way, and then pop menus for them that allow you to interact with them just like we did with X3.

I think sometimes you can just decide to "do something different" and deliberately get so far away from what you started with you throw out all the good bits you should have kept. Ego have obviously done this, its the old 'lets rewrite from scratch' mistake all over again.

The UI in x3 was fine, it just needed a "Warning you need to use your keyboard and prolonged use may induce carpel tunnel syndrome".

The UI was not fine. At best you could say it was serviceable. I would compare it to the command prompt. Useful for all sorts of things once you learn it, but never particularly fast or easy.

Now, as I said, the UI isn't bad. You can do most everything you need to do with it with little ambiguity. But it had serious workflow issues, with virtually every command or order requiring multiple button presses or mucking around with lists.

Very simple example. Making a wing. In any RTS you just select the ships you want in a group, and ctr + f-key. Bam, group created. In X3 its a very strange menu system.

Some stuff was oddly organized. Turret commands were in the command console, while weapons were in the weapon menu. So in the command console, I'l looking at 'Turret left', 'Turret up', etc. What weapons are in those? I have no idea. Likewise, in the weapons menu, no option to equip in all slots, so there is a ton of repetitive clicking.

The map recognizes left clicks, but they couldn't make it recognize a subsequent right click to issue a simple order to the selected unit?

Placing a factory should be a trivial task. Deploy factory. Be placed in a 3rd person mode. Have the standard 3d adjusting widget with the handles and circles. Maybe have a 'snap to grid' toggle for people who are neat freaks. Should take no more than 10 seconds to position and orient your station in the manner you wish. Instead its several completely worthless controls, and you can't even see it properly because you can't shift the viewpoint.

How about the absolutely craptacular idea that 'equipment' is a separate category from 'wares', and thus has the crazy restriction of not being able to carry multiple instances of, say, a jump drive, which introduced huge, unnecessary complications to the act of kitting out a ship. The same could be said of tunings. It would have been far easier to be made a product to be installed rather than a slider sold by a shipyard(or simply done away with entirely for purchased ships, since it was the very rare ship, generally only TSs, that weren't fully upgraded. The speed and turning tunings were so cheap it was pointless to even add the choice).


X3s UI works, yes, which is more than can be said for XR. But it has some serious, fundamental workflow issues and poor choices that would make it a stretch to even consider it 'adequate', especially when it comes to the setup and control of multiple ships.

[Psycho0124]

..some are even silly when you look at them. The ability to fly a capital ship from a cockpit view is always one of the examples.."

This actually hurt my feelings. In X3, i loved riding a carrier. Driving around in a colossus, one M3 docked as my fighting ship, a kestrel to fly around fast, and 2-3 wings of fighters. just watching them launch/dock from was spectacular.

This, exactly. I loved cruising around in my Split Raptor and unleashing a huge swarm of fighters on enemies. Setting up in an asteroid field with a Boron Orca, with its large cargo bay and plentiful docking slots, as a mobile mining base loaded with Teladi Falcons ("Collect Minerals in Sector" command) was also a lot of fun to sit back and watch. Maybe we're just more patient than the 'target audience'. I'm gonna miss those leisurely cruises/exhilarating stomp-fests in massive capitol ships.

[lancing99]

Think I'm going to start using "Bernd Success" to describe when someone completely screws up as part of my regular vocabulary.

[RoverTX]

I would compare it to the command prompt. Useful for all sorts of things once you learn it, but never particularly fast or easy.

And I think this highlights the difference in people who thought the X3 interface was easy, and people who wanted "an easier interface."

The reason you use the command line is for things that are a little more complex. On the other hand you use a finder for everyday browsing. A game like X3 should require you to be using the "command line". If it doesn't, then you end up with a dumb down game like XR.

[Mauzi!]

Ever heard of offline mode?

That surely is a first thought, but you cannot play XR in offline mode ? Or can you ? Can't try anymore right now, though I consider the current online statistics reasonably reflecting the game's status:

http://steamgraph.net/index.php?action= ... o=End+Time

[Zorvan]

Ever heard of offline mode?

That surely is a first thought, but you cannot play XR in offline mode ? Or can you ? Can't try anymore right now, though I consider the current online statistics reasonably reflecting the game's status:

http://steamgraph.net/index.php?action= ... o=End+Time

Of course you can play it in offline mode. It's not an online game and does not require a constant connection to a server.

[CutterJohn1]

And I think this highlights the difference in people who thought the X3 interface was easy, and people who wanted "an easier interface."

The reason you use the command line is for things that are a little more complex. On the other hand you use a finder for everyday browsing. A game like X3 should require you to be using the "command line". If it doesn't, then you end up with a dumb down game like XR.

The game should absolutely have the 'command line'. But it should not be the only control available.

The command console of X3 was great, and I never wanted to get rid of it. The problem is you had to use it for pretty much everything, even for simple or common commands.

Do not confuse wanting improved workflow with wanting the game dumbed down or options removed.

[Noimageavaiable]

And I think this highlights the difference in people who thought the X3 interface was easy, and people who wanted "an easier interface."

The reason you use the command line is for things that are a little more complex. On the other hand you use a finder for everyday browsing. A game like X3 should require you to be using the "command line". If it doesn't, then you end up with a dumb down game like XR.

The game should absolutely have the 'command line'. But it should not be the only control available.

The command console of X3 was great, and I never wanted to get rid of it. The problem is you had to use it for pretty much everything, even for simple or common commands.

Do not confuse wanting improved workflow with wanting the game dumbed down or options removed.

Thinking back its a real shame, all they really had to do was add multi-selection and context-sensitive right click commands to the UI and include a tutorial like in X2 and they would have solved the two biggest complaints with X3. But thats the problem with redoing everything from scratch, you're not just throwing out all the bad stuff but also all the good stuff and trade it in for something completely untested and unrefined.

[dzhedzho]

And I think this highlights the difference in people who thought the X3 interface was easy, and people who wanted "an easier interface."

The reason you use the command line is for things that are a little more complex. On the other hand you use a finder for everyday browsing. A game like X3 should require you to be using the "command line". If it doesn't, then you end up with a dumb down game like XR.

The game should absolutely have the 'command line'. But it should not be the only control available.

The command console of X3 was great, and I never wanted to get rid of it. The problem is you had to use it for pretty much everything, even for simple or common commands.

Do not confuse wanting improved workflow with wanting the game dumbed down or options removed.

Thinking back its a real shame, all they really had to do was add multi-selection and context-sensitive right click commands to the UI and include a tutorial like in X2 and they would have solved the two biggest complaints with X3. But thats the problem with redoing everything from scratch, you're not just throwing out all the bad stuff but also all the good stuff and trade it in for something completely untested and unrefined.

Yes there is such concept as favorite commands. I actually used a keyboard macro, (though i had to configure my ships with same software), and even mapped key combo's to a controller.

[Patholos]

The success lies in

- the intuitive UI which allows you to spend more time in menus than before. Because everybody loves menus.
- the missing joystick support. Who flies a ship with a stick in the future? No one that's who. They use xbox controllers.
- pretty ships you can see through your unobstructed front, but not able to fly since that's silly.
- they finally found out that trading is boring, it's much more fun running around in ducts stealing other peoples stuff.
- squatting grandmas in space. What's not to love about em?

[Mauzi!]

Think I'm going to start using "Bernd Success" to describe when someone completely screws up as part of my regular vocabulary.

I actually was thinking the same with "pulling off an XR" to describe a major fraud and lie to make big bucks by cheating friends. Hm.. time for a signature change, I guess !

[Mauzi!]

Here it comes !