And the award for the most expensive expansion goes to X3

[marksl]

Cost of game +
cost of upgrades to pc to make game work +
Find out upgrades dont work game is faulty +
Hairpulling to get the game work +
Reading a manual that isnt correct +
Time spent on forums wondering why game doent work =

Priceless

[Greyhawk1]

Greyhawk,

I'm sorry you feel that your game was delivered as half a product but i seem to notice other recent games being in a similar state. Not all developers have released a patch for the day of release though.

Needing a patch on the day of release and touting it as a "good thing" is one sign of what a sorry state the general quality of products are in this industry. Saying that other games are just as bad just adds fuel to my argument.

Credit where credit is due they got a patch out the door almost as soon as it started appearing on people's PC's. Unfortunately shutting the barn door after the horse has already bolted still isnt a great advert for the industry.

When I buy something I dont expect to get the product half finished with a vague promise (or hope) that it will improve at an unspecified later date. This title could have been a classic as well. Its all such a shame they werent given enough time.

[sasha123456789]

Since a stupid ****** moderator locked my topic and stopped me from expressing my opinion i'l copy paste it into here. Jeesys they make a sucky game and then tyr to stop us from having the freedom of expressing ourselves.

Ok ive just gotten the game today and would like to share my thoughts and feelings.

Firstly, the date is November 21'st. X3 was realeased in the UK on Ocotber 28th. Anyone see something interesting there? Oh, did you figure it out? Well here it is: I HAD TO WAIT 3 WEEKS! lol. The bottomline is that this really shows how organized deepsilver is. Like why couldn't they release it everywhere within say a week or so? Would that be too much to ask?

Secondly, as soon as i got the game i read "cough- cough tried" to read the manual. Being a veteran of X2 i had no idea what the heck they were talking about some of the time. Not only that but they got THE WRONG hotkeys in some places.

Ok i patch the game to it's latest version. I go into the game and soon find out that with high settings i get a fps of about 10-15. I was expecting this since i have a pretty bad rig and didn't complain. I turned everything i could to off or low. I came back in and now i had a decent fps that i could play with. The problem of course then is that now the game seems to looks WOSE then x2 itself which i can run with max settings. But the graphics i won't complain about since like i said i have a brig.

Now we come to the final part. I did some exploring, looked around etc. The problem i have is simple and can be summed up in a simple equation: X3=X2- Some stuff Some stuff namely being warp animation, decent graphics. The problem is theres nothing really new and a bunch of stuff that was messed up. The only really new things are the graphics (which without the best rig in the world mean nothing), planets (wow i looked at them for 3 secs) and bigger factories which are kind of nice but don't really do anything. And then they took away all this
1. Warp animation
2. Interior's in the stations
3. Cockpits
And they added bugs of course.

I'm not saying that x3 is a bad game. The reason i am complaining is that x3 seems to be a step back from x2. Sure the interface and graphics are a bit better but at what cost? The cost was that they realeased it a few months to early, and excluded a ton of stuff that made x2 great. Anyway once i play x3 a ton more i'l post a full review.

And please don't flame me about me saying how terrible x3 is, that's not what i think. All i think is that x3 is a new game that sacrificed many of x2's features for unneccesary content.

Would love to hear your opinions about my opinion. And rember everyone have fun!

-------

I just wanted to post one more comment. And btw, please excuse any bad grammar i'm typing this up quickly.

In my opinion, all the squares on the hud surrounding stations, ships etc are completely unneccesary. They make space look very crowded and take away the feeling of being in space a bit. Why the put them in is beyond me. We can select stations or anything neccesary in the sector map so there doesn't have to be a square around EVERYTHING only around the one thing weve selected.

[The_Abyss]

Why are you blaming Deepsilver for release dates in Canada? Enlight is the publisher there....

[Lofte]

To be honest i flamed for a bit untill i got it of my chest, now i just try to particpate in the useful discussion's and hope for a great improvement with the patches additions to come.

It still gets my goat though when fanboys have a go at ranters who are entitled to thier opinion, what makes them feel the need to post in a rant thread if they are completely happy about been screwed. Besides if you let them post and agree with there concerns they usually calm down anyway...........

Anyway's the only thing i'm disappointed about now is that egosoft have no official posters commenting on bug thread's or anything, we just got abyss and CBJ who with all the respect in the world are not knoledgable enough to help or comment. Are they to scared to face there fanbase?

[Fusey]

It's not an expansion, and neither it is a new game. It is a sequel. It is designed to slowly bring the X-Universe to perfection.

Sorry, I actually did laugh out loud at that one.

[FellFromLog]

To be honest i flamed for a bit untill i got it of my chest, now i just try to particpate in the useful discussion's and hope for a great improvement with the patches additions to come.

It still gets my goat though when fanboys have a go at ranters who are entitled to thier opinion, what makes them feel the need to post in a rant thread if they are completely happy about been screwed. Besides if you let them post and agree with there concerns they usually calm down anyway...........

Same here. Bitterly dissapointed but trying to make constructive suggestions and help people out if they need it.

What really irritates me though are the posters who say "Why are you complaining? In six months Egosoft will have patched it up to a complete game!" Personally speaking I won't be near a computer for years by then, as I'm going travelling, so I've wasted £25 on a game I will probably be able to pick up for 99p in a bargain bin by the time I'm finally able to play a complete version.

Personal annoyance aside, waiting for patch 1.4 or 1.5 before you get a decent game is ripping off the consumer. X3 cost £25 on day of release, before 1.3 arrives to make it playable it's down to £17.99, by the time it's fully patched it'll be down to about £9.99. This method of working is beyond comprehension, it punishes loyal fans who buy the game at release and rewards those who randomly pick it up in a bargain bin six months later. It's the last time I'm buying an Egosoft product at release, it's not worth wasting £15 just to have the box sit on a shelf for six months.

[giskard]

@Giskard point and counterpoint ... I love it

ATM X3 is gathering dust on my shelf and its really sad to me. Simply not good enough an improvement over X2 to justify spending time on the game. At least, at the moment.

I really hope Ego can produce a major and I mean major patch.

Many of the issues ive seem people raise actually dont exist in the game. For example, there was one entire thread that was started on the basis that 10gj shields are not used in the game. Yet the teladis big ships use them. Ive seen many complaints like that, that could be shot down with 1 screenshot. But rather than embarris the poster, i leave them to it.

You on the other hand have identified some real issues, issues id agree with totally. Issues that have made X3 look like Fred Blogs X2 Mod rather than a full game.

For example, some of issues with the turret views should never have happened. They completely spoil the sence of being in space and if cockpits existed, those issues would have been hidden.

Btw thats an issue you missed, try a centaur and check out the side turret views bud.

Still, this is what happens when plans change but deadlines done. If that is indeed what actually happened.

Dispite all these issues though, I think X3 forms the basis for a game that already totally blows away X2 in all key areas. Its backing a lot of scripts right now but in time it will get them back too.

Giskard

[mbelcher25]

Well, I for one am extremely glad that X3 is very much like X2. If I wanted an arcade style shooter I would get something else. I liked X2 because it was much more of a Simulator than a game, and as such it was something that didn't get old in a weeks time.

As someone once said, "it's the economy, stupid".

The economy in X3 is one of the best aspects of the game. It blows away any others I've seen.

Yes, X3 has a few bugs to be worked out, and I'm sure that will happen, but I'm thankfull that EGOSOFT has not allowed it's vision of the X universe to sink to the level of a common arcade game.

[Subjugation]

I feel sorry for Egosoft, considering it can't really be their fault.

[Mikes78]

the state of the forum is simply a reflection of the sorry state the game is in..... one won't change without the other.

and since i can't see the sorry mess that calls itself X3 changing overnight, we ll be stuck with a forum full of disappointed and angry people.

the ONLY people who can prevent this, would be Egosoft, either by not releasing it in the first place in this state or by hurrying up and patching and actually FIXING what people are angry about.

seeing how long X2 did take to get patched i m not holding my breath....




P.S. oh the economy... love it .. right, keep playing a while longer and you'll notice that it simply breaks apart.

things like cahoona meat and rastar oil pretty much do not get distributed by the AI at all anymore in my game. wich leads to huge bottlenecks.

basically all cahoona factories being full and all tech factories being empty and the AI ships doing NOTHING about it.

someone mentioned in another thread a possible reason for it: that AI ships don t respawn after being killed by pirates - if that s the case then the X3 economy is destined to fail from the beginning.

oh and then the fact that some factories (mostly foodstuffs) seem to be able to produce without primary resources?

the whole economy model is a fake really, designed to look cool at the beginning, nothing else, ............. but when you keep playing it's flaws become apparent.

[ccso]

@Giskard point and counterpoint ... I love it

ATM X3 is gathering dust on my shelf and its really sad to me. Simply not good enough an improvement over X2 to justify spending time on the game. At least, at the moment.

I really hope Ego can produce a major and I mean major patch.

Same here.
I hope suprising new improvements can be seen in the near future

[pccenter]

This is for me the best part, i love it. Most of my complaints about the X2 economy got addressed here. To be honest im surprised you dont see it. Its the one area of the game that stands out so much it almost hits you in the face. At least it does if your a trader.
Giskard

The all point is those two lines. And for me the best part of X3 is the economy because i am most trader than fighter.

In X2 after 1.4 patch the round to build an empire goes : Disco - Bayamon - capping and sell 15-20 M3 (with no serius reputation lost) - Osprey - XI & Ass. missions - Oddy - more XI & Ass. missions. Where in this chain are the trade, build & think?

[steel chicken]

I feel sorry for Egosoft, considering it can't really be their fault.

Thats such a cop out. Whose fault is it? The evil publishers who had the NERVE to sign a contract? Perhaps EgoSoft should have considered not rewriting the entire game as a seperate game halfway through the development cycle and instead did the expansion as originally planned. Maybe they should grown a pair of balls and said "we're sorry, we simply cannot meet this deadline, the product will be terrible, lets give it 3-6 more months, so our die hard fans wont hate us"

Bottom line is, the state of this game is EMBARASSING. Ive been developing business apps for 10+ years, and I would hang my head in shame if my name was anywhere near this game. It has SO much potential, its just NOT done.

Renegotiate the deadline. Convince the publisher that releasing a crappy game early will turn fans angry, and cost sales in the long run. Wait, get it at least *mostly* done and the fans will sell your product for you!

[The Rook]

P.S. oh the economy... love it .. right, keep playing a while longer and you'll notice that it simply breaks apart.

things like cahoona meat and rastar oil pretty much do not get distributed by the AI at all anymore in my game. wich leads to huge bottlenecks.

basically all cahoona factories being full and all tech factories being empty and the AI ships doing NOTHING about it.

someone mentioned in another thread a possible reason for it: that AI ships don t respawn after being killed by pirates - if that s the case then the X3 economy is destined to fail from the beginning.

oh and then the fact that some factories (mostly foodstuffs) seem to be able to produce without primary resources?

the whole economy model is a fake really, designed to look cool at the beginning, nothing else, ............. but when you keep playing it's flaws become apparent.

I agree.

Initially I was optimistic about the new economy model. But as you say, given time it becomes apparent how flaky and kludge dependent the modifications are. If anyone bought X3 partially based on my positive feedback about the economy early this month, then I offer my most sincere apologies. My views at the time were ill informed, and I have to take them back now.

[old elite pilot]

Have to agree with most of the post's pointing out the flaws with X3
and yes playing mostly trader my self after a while 2 weeks ecomone
falls apart
Wondering why given such a lot off negative feed back the normally
talkative guys from EGOSOFT have been totally SILENT about their latest product

[J. Spartan]

Wondering why given such a lot off negative feed back the normally
talkative guys from EGOSOFT have been totally SILENT about their latest product

My thoughts exactly.
2 possible answers:
- they're too busy working on a patch that will solve most of the issues
- they realized that such patch cannot be done, or will requre much more time to produce than initially expected

[ccso]

Have to agree with most of the post's pointing out the flaws with X3
and yes playing mostly trader my self after a while 2 weeks ecomone
falls apart
Wondering why given such a lot off negative feed back the normally
talkative guys from EGOSOFT have been totally SILENT about their latest product

2 weeks ecomony falls apart-->Please explain how it "falls apart"?

[old elite pilot]

read other post's regarding non respawing of freighters after they get destoryed or keep crashing into gates ect. factory either become of goods no one buys or empty waiting for so called independent traders to deliver items required to make goods.
In short the universal economy model falls apart after 2 plus weeks of game play, this is a bug that quite a lot of people have reported

[giskard]

Economy:

I have spent a lot longer than 2 weeks watching the economy and here the holes ive seen. All reported btw so im hoping these will be fixed.

Split space: Rasters not getting to factories in large enough numbers. They are getting there only in small amounts.

Paranid space: Soja beans are not moving at all. Period! But Soja husks are moving when they are available but only slowly.

Boron Space: In Great Reef and Depths of silence the weapons and shields are not moving anywhere. Not even to the local EQ.

All the rest appears to be working just fine so far. Cahoonas especially are being transported about and my in game time is 14 days and count. Thats 14 game days not 2 weeks real time. For the record, this is my second proper game, about my 15th game in total.

I noticed the Free traders often travel in convoys. Not all split free traders but a mixed race convoy of free traders, usually all heading for the same factory. They enter a sector, totally blitz the economy of all bargins and move on. So the good trading sectors appear just before they arrive and once they do, all trade in that sector is done by them, leaving nothing for the player. So the trick is, is to get there before the free traders do.

Remember though, free traders only trade in goods as indicated by their names. So food may be all traded out in one sector but hi tech goods and weapons may still be ok.

Giskard