CC.xls V2.1! & FCC.exe V2.0.0.2 ("the old thread")

General discussions about the games by Egosoft including X-BTF, XT, X², X³: Reunion, X³: Terran Conflict and X³: Albion Prelude.

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Is this usefull for you?

Yes
314
86%
No
26
7%
I dont use/build complexes
27
7%
 
Total votes: 367

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nirwin
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Post by nirwin »

jlehtone wrote:
nirwin wrote:Sadly I refuse to get MS Office. So I will not be able to use this tool.
You can still see the raw data with OO. And you can use the Dave's exe-version.

Or visit German forum and look up X-Freak Cartman's Komplexprufer. That does have OO (v2) version.
Jiehtone to the rescue again! :D
I did try opening it in OO (always ignore what people tell you if it's restrictive rather than instructive) but I just wouldn't enjoy using it without the dropdowns, the .exe however works like a charm, ('cept I see there may be a slight problem mentioned at the top of this page, which I can live with)

Now I just wish I could change my vote to a yes, I am always too hasty. Cheers Merroc, Dave & Jiehtone.
Nirwin
------
Sector Takeover | Unlimited Resources (x2/x3)
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donotdespisethesnake
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Post by donotdespisethesnake »

nirwin wrote:Sadly, I had to vote 'No' on the poll. I did not want to do that, I find the concept oh so handy, and you seem to have implemented it well, and I could have killed hours designing the ultimate complex with this. Alas, it all fell apart when I read:
As a final (and most important note): This sheet is only compatible with Excel. Not the windows Excel viewer and Not Open Office.
Sadly I refuse to get MS Office. So I will not be able to use this tool.
I've had a look into porting the macros to OpenOffice. OO supports the same BASIC syntax as Excel, but the Object model is quite different. If you know the object models then translating the macros is quite easy. I translated some of AddSPP as a trial.

However, the OpenOffice guys are adding a compatibility mode to OO to allow macros to use the same object model as Excel. This is still work in progress. I tried using it, but didn't get very far. So if we are lucky, it won't be long before OO can use Excel macros directly.
"Yes, he is in his office, but he's on an intergalactic cruise."
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nirwin
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Post by nirwin »

donotdespisethesnake wrote: I've had a look into porting the macros to OpenOffice. OO supports the same BASIC syntax as Excel, but the Object model is quite different. If you know the object models then translating the macros is quite easy. I translated some of AddSPP as a trial.

However, the OpenOffice guys are adding a compatibility mode to OO to allow macros to use the same object model as Excel. This is still work in progress. I tried using it, but didn't get very far. So if we are lucky, it won't be long before OO can use Excel macros directly.
Those good ol' boys at OO.org always working hard on the features you need most. When was the last time you saw release notes with Excel that said "Improved compatability with <non MS application> files" or "Added compatability for <non MS application> files"?
Nirwin
------
Sector Takeover | Unlimited Resources (x2/x3)
Deleted User

Post by Deleted User »

jlehtone wrote:...80+ station complex....As much Crystals as the complex can hold....13,000+ Crystals..
You are right, but try doing that with a 44 gPPC complex,
e.g I've got one of these that's also got 4 bPPC & one 10GJ:
to max. out the stock to give the 'float', you'd need to ship in around about:
45,000 crystals
780,000 cahoonas
190,000 beef
16,000 silicon
111,000 ore
if you bought all that it'd cost about 174 million credits, and fill 512 super freighters.
It's somewhat cheaper to buy that extra SPP XL (or two, + crystal plants etc), and it will
work straight away (ish), + it generates it's own continuous float automatically,
(and you can sell the excess off).
nirwin wrote:'cept I see there may be a slight problem mentioned at the top of this page, which I can live with
I can't quite get what that problem is exactly:
arcana75 wrote:I don't think the EXE is set up to sell excess ore, cuz increasing/decreasing the yield affects the percentage.
If you increase the asteroid yield, wouldn't you expect to affect the %age?, cos it's making more ore/silicon.
jlehtone
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Post by jlehtone »

Dave Toome wrote:
jlehtone wrote:...80+ station complex....As much Crystals as the complex can hold....13,000+ Crystals..
You are right, but try doing that with a 44 gPPC complex,
e.g I've got one of these that's also got 4 bPPC & one 10GJ:
The 13k Crystal complex is only about 50 fabs. The 80+ complex contains at least 30 gPPC, 1 25MJ, 1 bHEPT, 1 aHEPT, and 2 1MJ. All resources for one cycle were about 1,000,000 cargo units. I hauled everything but Crystals and ECells first, and then those with 20 Dolphin SFs. Took about 10 minutes to unload all the Crystals and energy, but the 30 GPPC forges are nearly in sync, within 10 minutes. That was much fun to do. I did buy all the needed Cahoona from the NPC. Manual remote trading. Best part is that the 80+ complex is not self-sufficient alone. Not at all. It is part of a closed loop.

So, I have not done that with complex containing 50 Ore-based long-cycle forges. Yet. :)
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arcana75
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Post by arcana75 »

Dave Toome wrote:I can't quite get what that problem is exactly:
arcana75 wrote:I don't think the EXE is set up to sell excess ore, cuz increasing/decreasing the yield affects the percentage.
If you increase the asteroid yield, wouldn't you expect to affect the %age?, cos it's making more ore/silicon.
When I setup my complex (5xBHEPT 5x125MJ), I needed ore, which I got from building an L on a 51 yield roid. I set them to buy/sell at minimum.

I had this complex for prolly 5 days' ingame, and practically every time I checked the ore on both the complex and ore mine are at max.

Would this suggest that the 51 yield L ore mine is actually producing more than the 5x+5x needs? I dunno really, but it's definitely filling up. And it always fills up to max at the ore mine.

I setup this complex I dunno sometime late 2005, with I think a version of ComplexCalculator, or maybe the Sector Planner I don't remember.
jlehtone
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Post by jlehtone »

arcana75 wrote:Would this suggest that the 51 yield L ore mine is actually producing more than the 5x+5x needs?
int( 600 / (51+1) ) + 1 = 12 sec to make 1 Ore
24 sec (S consumption rate)/ 12 sec = 2
L=5 => 5 * 2 = 10 = 5x+5x

Yield 51 Ore should match exactly the consumption of 10 Forges. Ie, if you somehow have filled the Ore stock, full it shall stay. Should match, assuming perfect nonstop operation of every factory and transporter.
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arcana75
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Post by arcana75 »

jlehtone wrote:
arcana75 wrote:Would this suggest that the 51 yield L ore mine is actually producing more than the 5x+5x needs?
int( 600 / (51+1) ) + 1 = 12 sec to make 1 Ore
24 sec (S consumption rate)/ 12 sec = 2
L=5 => 5 * 2 = 10 = 5x+5x

Yield 51 Ore should match exactly the consumption of 10 Forges. Ie, if you somehow have filled the Ore stock, full it shall stay. Should match, assuming perfect nonstop operation of every factory and transporter.
I thought that too, so I used the Auction Wares script to sell off all ore stock on both sides, leaving abit in the big complex to keep it running.

In time, both the ore mine and complex filled up to max again.
Deleted User

Post by Deleted User »

What is the complete complex setup?

If you have an excess of energy for the ore mine, but a slight defecit
fo the weapons complex, you could be seeing lag in the bHEPT production,
that causes a build up in resources.
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arcana75
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Post by arcana75 »

Dave Toome wrote:What is the complete complex setup?

If you have an excess of energy for the ore mine, but a slight defecit
fo the weapons complex, you could be seeing lag in the bHEPT production,
that causes a build up in resources.
The full build taken from CC.exe:

Code: Select all

Argon	Shield Prod. Facility 125 MJ	5
Paranid	Beta HEPT Forge	5
Argon	Cahoona Bakery L	1
Argon	Cattle Ranch L	1
Paranid	Soyery L	1
Paranid	Soyfarm L	1
 	 	 
Argon	Space Fuel Distillery L	1
Argon	Wheat Farm L	1
Teladi	Bliss Place L	1
Teladi	Dream farm L	1
Argon	Silicon Mine L	1	64 	 	 
Argon	Ore Mine L	1	51
 	 	 
Argon	Solar Power Plant M	3
Argon	Cattle Ranch M	3
Argon	Cahoona Bakery M	3
Argon	Crystal Fab M	3
Argon	Solar Power Plant XL	1
Argon	Cattle Ranch L	2
Argon	Cahoona Bakery L	2
Argon	Crystal Fab M	5
Argon	Silicon Mine L	1	26
The resource used:

Code: Select all

125 MJ Shield	25 L	4.41	 	 	40
Beta HEPT	15 L	3.00	 	 	40
Space Fuel	2 S	360.00	 	 	1,660
Spaceweed	6 S	83.33	 	 	410
Energy Cells	1 S	134,725.42	113,729.61	118.5 %	645,000
Soja Husk	4 S	600.00	600.00	100.0 %	6,660
Argnu Beef	4 S	3,780.00	3,780.00	100.0 %	42,000
Soja Beans	1 S	3,600.00	3,600.00	100.0 %	40,000
Meatsteak Cahoonas	4 M	12,600.00	12,600.00	100.0 %	139,944
Delexian Wheat	2 S	3,000.00	3,000.00	100.0 %	33,320
Ore	8 XL	1,500.00	1,500.00	100.0 %	12,480
Swamp Plant	3 S	600.00	600.00	100.0 %	6,660
Silicon Wafers	18 XL	688.73	600.00	114.8 %	5,408
Crystals	4 M	960.00	976.27	98.3 %	13,964
Everything's 100% usage except E-Cells 118.5%, Wafers 114.8% and Crystals 98.3%.

Now what's more is, while the wafers are 114.8%, they never fill up! Everything else appears 100% ingame tho (even crystals), while e-cells (this I understand) and ore (?) fill up.
Deleted User

Post by Deleted User »

So it's in one of Ore Belt, Rhy's Desire, Tkr's Deprivation, or Mines of Fortune,
I'm guessing south Ore Belt.

Sounds like an M6 'munitions (Dragon?, maybe Rhy's Desire then),
with a happy/whacky bar on the side for your pilots.

I reckon your silicon would have gone to max stock after only 50 hours,
but you say that you are selling at min price?, so I guess that's NPC (or UT)
shifting the silicon stock.

I can't see why you're getting excess ore, except if there was a intermittent pause
in weapon &/or shield production due to hitting max stock of 40.
- if you are/were mainly kitting M6's you've obviously got an huge excess of 125 MJ shield
production rate relative to bHEPT & unless you're selling them effectively maybe
the shield hits max stock regularly?
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arcana75
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Post by arcana75 »

Dave Toome wrote:So it's in one of Ore Belt, Rhy's Desire, Tkr's Deprivation, or Mines of Fortune,
I'm guessing south Ore Belt.

Sounds like an M6 'munitions (Dragon?, maybe Rhy's Desire then),
with a happy/whacky bar on the side for your pilots.

I reckon your silicon would have gone to max stock after only 50 hours,
but you say that you are selling at min price?, so I guess that's NPC (or UT)
shifting the silicon stock.

I can't see why you're getting excess ore, except if there was a intermittent pause
in weapon &/or shield production due to hitting max stock of 40.
- if you are/were mainly kitting M6's you've obviously got an huge excess of 125 MJ shield
production rate relative to bHEPT & unless you're selling them effectively maybe
the shield hits max stock regularly?
Argon whiskey mostly :D Actually the mine's in Ore Belt, the weapons complex is in Home of Light while the whiskey/weed complex is in Elena's Fortune while the SPPs and others are split between EF and PE.

The silicon never really fills up, and the weapons sell fast (Station Manager to I guess Terracorp HQ). So those aren't a problem at all.

Because it's supposed to be a self-sustaining loop, the mines don't sell to AI; only the whiskey/weed is open to AI, the rest are closed. In other words, between all my fabs in HoL, OB, PE and EF, the only stuff able to get ore from the Ore Mine L in OB is my weapons complex in HoL. And both of them fill up max with ore.

Wafers are fine tho they do fill up just alot slower than this Ore Mine L.

I've recently set everything to sell/buy at avg-1 and opening up all the mines/fabs to AI; maybe it'll help rid excess. If not I'll just auction it off, usually fetches a mere 90cr per piece :cry:
jlehtone
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Post by jlehtone »

How do you transfer the Ore from the mine into the weapon complex?
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arcana75
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Post by arcana75 »

jlehtone wrote:How do you transfer the Ore from the mine into the weapon complex?
I have a dolphin in the weapon complex set to buy at best price.
Deleted User

Post by Deleted User »

arcana wrote:When I setup my complex (5xBHEPT 5x125MJ), I needed ore, which I got from building an L on a 51 yield roid. I set them to buy/sell at minimum.
arcana wrote:I have a dolphin in the weapon complex set to buy at best price.

So why would the weapon complex dolphin only buy from your mine?,
unless you have the mine set to min price, and even then you might find some NPC ore mines with the same price.
I guess that's the danger of setting up factory loops, rather than self-sustaining complexes.
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arcana75
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Post by arcana75 »

Dave Toome wrote:
arcana wrote:When I setup my complex (5xBHEPT 5x125MJ), I needed ore, which I got from building an L on a 51 yield roid. I set them to buy/sell at minimum.
arcana wrote:I have a dolphin in the weapon complex set to buy at best price.

So why would the weapon complex dolphin only buy from your mine?,
unless you have the mine set to min price, and even then you might find some NPC ore mines with the same price.
I guess that's the danger of setting up factory loops, rather than self-sustaining complexes.
Fair point. However, in my game, there's no other Ore Mine selling at minimum within a 1 jump radius from HoL. In my game at least.

Anyway I'll keep monitoring it and maybe make my own ingame calculations to see what's going on...
Deleted User

Post by Deleted User »

What about Ore Mine M alpha, and Ore Mine L alpha in Ore Belt,
unless you've demolished these two then they're likely to be selling at min.
If they're not at the moment, surely thats only because your dolphin has been
buying from them & they've upped thier price.
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arcana75
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Post by arcana75 »

Dave Toome wrote:What about Ore Mine M alpha, and Ore Mine L alpha in Ore Belt,
unless you've demolished these two then they're likely to be selling at min.
If they're not at the moment, surely thats only because your dolphin has been
buying from them & they've upped thier price.
arcana75 wrote:Fair point. However, in my game, there's no other Ore Mine selling at minimum within a 1 jump radius from HoL. In my game at least.
I would prolly rephrase that as there's no other mine selling ore within 1 jump.
Deleted User

Post by Deleted User »

Ah, so GoDs been at work again :roll:

(or are you denying responsibility for the great Argon Ore industry crash of 2005?)
jlehtone
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Post by jlehtone »

arcana75 wrote:I would prolly rephrase that as there's no other mine selling ore within 1 jump.
Now. But has it always been like that? If there ever was a NPC Mine, that could have filled your stations. And at 100% rate, they stay like that even when there is no longer "extra" suppliers.


I do use Commodity Logistics (CLS) for my closed loops. Granted, the bonuspack version has been available only during the last couple months.

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