VincentTH wrote:Speaking of shield, right now in X3TC, the shield is just another renewable extension of the hull. I like to see ships bounce off each other (with shield damage) during collision instead of instant kill like currently.
I watch my TS ship ram into an SPP for about 2 hours, your argument is invalid. =p IMO the collision system we got now is fine as is.
For the hulls, it be nice if the paranid and boron got some hull regeneration, due to being semi organic and all.
Maybe even make it a customizeable for all ships and stations, like armor plateing or something.
Just saying it forward: I give everyone 2 posts to make good, in context posts(proper english, as always, is optional). After that I'm ignoring what you have to say in that thread that's directed to what we previously were talking about.
Have you looked at ordering the games direct from the Egosoft online store?
no i have not, did know they did that - i thought steam and impulse was doing that for them.
Playing x2 - finding this version way better than x3tc... even though the combat was a lil better in tc. I cant get the hang of combat in x2, its like the mouse is delaid or something so i only fight wen i have too other than that i make for hills cos the khaak seem stronger in this game too - way stronger then in x3tc
VincentTH wrote:Speaking of shield, right now in X3TC, the shield is just another renewable extension of the hull. I like to see ships bounce off each other (with shield damage) during collision instead of instant kill like currently....
Instant kill? Not in TC. It usually takes me at least three, maybe four, heavy bumps to blow up a superfreighter using my fully shielded Zephyrus. And I do it a lot in the 'destroy convoy' missions. First two or three bumps, it's shield-on-shield, and then the TS is down to bare hull and I still have around 75% shields.
So I'm not sure where you're getting this 'instant kill' idea from?
Instant killed if you bump against an asteroid when under the autopillock, or run over by an M7 at the gate like a cockroach while you are flying your 5x200MJ shield Hyperion Vanguard
Seriously, the shield strength is expressed in terms of Energy (MJ, GJ), so collision should be deducted in terms of energy (0.5mV**2, mass and speed) and transformed into kinetic energy. The problem at the gate is that ships are exiting with not overwhelmingly enormous speed (by that I mean gate exiting speed is in the order of 100-300m/s not speed of light), so if collision happen between a ship in front of the gate (the cockroach, my poor Hyperion and its measly 1GJ shield) versus an M7 (3-6GJ shield), it should not have ran over the cockroach, assuming a moderate mass for the M7. In this case, the shield should transform the energy (1/2 of m*V**2 of the M7) into kinetics, such that my M6 would thrust ahead with, say, 50% shield damage instead of instantly being killed.
VincentTH wrote:my poor Hyperion and its measly 1GJ shield) versus an M7 (3-6GJ shield), it should not have ran over the cockroach, assuming a moderate mass for the M7.
That is the problem. We do not know how much the ships weigh, however we can make a rough guess based on their size. A M7 is about 1 km long on average, so a minimum weight of several thousends of tons seems safe. And that is more than enough to create several GJ of damage at 100 m/s (in fact, a lot more if you do the math).
VincentTH wrote:my poor Hyperion and its measly 1GJ shield) versus an M7 (3-6GJ shield), it should not have ran over the cockroach, assuming a moderate mass for the M7.
That is the problem. We do not know how much the ships weigh, however we can make a rough guess based on their size. A M7 is about 1 km long on average, so a minimum weight of several thousends of tons seems safe. And that is more than enough to create several GJ of damage at 100 m/s (in fact, a lot more if you do the math).
I think I did not express myself very well. The point is that shield is different than Hull. The way X3TC uses it, shield only differs from hull in the regeneration. Shield should be able to amortize the impact, and thus would be able to absorb and convert the M7 kinetic energy into the M6's own kinetic energy, and thus lessen the damage to the M6 shield. So when the 2 ships collide, they should be able to bounce back a little bit, instead of the way it is done in X3TC. Otherwise if you "harden" the shield a la IWAR ramming shield mode, then and only then, can you convert your kinetic energy in full to damage the other ship.
Have you looked at ordering the games direct from the Egosoft online store?
no i have not, did know they did that - i thought steam and impulse was doing that for them.
Playing x2 - finding this version way better than x3tc... even though the combat was a lil better in tc. I cant get the hang of combat in x2, its like the mouse is delaid or something so i only fight wen i have too other than that i make for hills cos the khaak seem stronger in this game too - way stronger then in x3tc
still no info for x:r - maybe next week
In X2 the Khaak were The Threat, they were new and they were dangerous/deadly IIRC i used mass drivers against the scouts, and psg on bigger ships for dealing with swarms of them, that plus hornets/hammerheads from a distance before the clusters broke up.
I've never used mouse control for any X game so i cant really comment on that.
And I'm also looking forward to new info, but then i think te entire forum is
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VincentTH wrote:my poor Hyperion and its measly 1GJ shield) versus an M7 (3-6GJ shield), it should not have ran over the cockroach, assuming a moderate mass for the M7.
That is the problem. We do not know how much the ships weigh, however we can make a rough guess based on their size. A M7 is about 1 km long on average, so a minimum weight of several thousends of tons seems safe. And that is more than enough to create several GJ of damage at 100 m/s (in fact, a lot more if you do the math).
I think I did not express myself very well. The point is that shield is different than Hull. The way X3TC uses it, shield only differs from hull in the regeneration. Shield should be able to amortize the impact, and thus would be able to absorb and convert the M7 kinetic energy into the M6's own kinetic energy, and thus lessen the damage to the M6 shield. So when the 2 ships collide, they should be able to bounce back a little bit, instead of the way it is done in X3TC. Otherwise if you "harden" the shield a la IWAR ramming shield mode, then and only then, can you convert your kinetic energy in full to damage the other ship.
Have you actually seen the sizes of these ships next to eachother? An M7 is going to railroad right through an M6, there's just no way I can see something like a centaur "bouncing back" a Shrike or Cerberus(especially the Cerberus, the thing is basically a flying wall), or the space cow that is the Panther. Lessening the damage is well and good, but when the only difference it makes is how fast your debris travels from the impact site, its going to matter a whole lot. =p
Just saying it forward: I give everyone 2 posts to make good, in context posts(proper english, as always, is optional). After that I'm ignoring what you have to say in that thread that's directed to what we previously were talking about.
VincentTH wrote:my poor Hyperion and its measly 1GJ shield) versus an M7 (3-6GJ shield), it should not have ran over the cockroach, assuming a moderate mass for the M7.
That is the problem. We do not know how much the ships weigh, however we can make a rough guess based on their size. A M7 is about 1 km long on average, so a minimum weight of several thousends of tons seems safe. And that is more than enough to create several GJ of damage at 100 m/s (in fact, a lot more if you do the math).
I think I did not express myself very well. The point is that shield is different than Hull. The way X3TC uses it, shield only differs from hull in the regeneration. Shield should be able to amortize the impact, and thus would be able to absorb and convert the M7 kinetic energy into the M6's own kinetic energy, and thus lessen the damage to the M6 shield. So when the 2 ships collide, they should be able to bounce back a little bit, instead of the way it is done in X3TC. Otherwise if you "harden" the shield a la IWAR ramming shield mode, then and only then, can you convert your kinetic energy in full to damage the other ship.
Have you actually seen the sizes of these ships next to eachother? An M7 is going to railroad right through an M6, there's just no way I can see something like a centaur "bouncing back" a Shrike or Cerberus(especially the Cerberus, the thing is basically a flying wall), or the space cow that is the Panther. Lessening the damage is well and good, but when the only difference it makes is how fast your debris travels from the impact site, its going to matter a whole lot. =p
Just saying it forward: I give everyone 2 posts to make good, in context posts(proper english, as always, is optional). After that I'm ignoring what you have to say in that thread that's directed to what we previously were talking about.
Maybe calculating the damage taken taking in count speed mass (ship class) and shield integrity could fo the trick. It would make sense that a lower class ship would be voilently pushed aside upon impact.
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VincentTH wrote:my poor Hyperion and its measly 1GJ shield) versus an M7 (3-6GJ shield), it should not have ran over the cockroach, assuming a moderate mass for the M7.
That is the problem. We do not know how much the ships weigh, however we can make a rough guess based on their size. A M7 is about 1 km long on average, so a minimum weight of several thousends of tons seems safe. And that is more than enough to create several GJ of damage at 100 m/s (in fact, a lot more if you do the math).
Your numbers are very conservative.
A typical carrier (320m in length) wighs in at 90000-100000 tons.
Considering that a ship 3 times the length actually has on average 3x3x3= 27 times the volume (theoretical, if all sides scale equally), that would mean a 1 km long warship would weigh AT LEAST a million tons.
And when you factor in the speed of ships...the kinetic energy of such a ship would be ENORMEOUS. And trying to cancel it's momentum would be an epic undertaking.
Somehow X Rebirth looks less like Star Trek Starfleet Command and more like a space simulation version of Starcraft and Mass Effect. Im not complaining cos its looks awesome and "alive".
Awesome to see another X-game in the works, they just get better and better. One thing I do hope they do though: get rid of the gate system and put in proper galaxies/solar systems in the universe. Hyperspace should be possible now with the jumpdrive and all. Would also be great if you could build up a colony from scratch without having to rely on the 'shipyards' race owner also. This would open many doors to the modding world.
Starting new colony's in space should be doable, but I really doubt we'll see any on planet operations yet. The X series has always been about space simulation, and I'm sure this is no exception. It did say however that we'll have more station interaction than ever before, and NPC's to talk to instead of all those drop down conversations..sounds like an improvement to me. Now...where is this female co pilot from, that's the question..lol.
1) NO DRM... I'm OK with Steam DRM (aka ping-online to check credentials and then let player play independently from the DRM server - not in constant online-connection to the DRM server)... so not the crappy junk DRM type like UBI idiots did. Otherwise I my wallet won't open for the 5th/6th X game series!
2) Continuous space... no gates please! just coordinates XYZ and distance between points would be good enough!
Have you looked at ordering the games direct from the Egosoft online store?
no i have not, did know they did that - i thought steam and impulse was doing that for them.
Playing x2 - finding this version way better than x3tc... even though the combat was a lil better in tc. I cant get the hang of combat in x2, its like the mouse is delaid or something so i only fight wen i have too other than that i make for hills cos the khaak seem stronger in this game too - way stronger then in x3tc
still no info for x:r - maybe next week
In X2 the Khaak were The Threat, they were new and they were dangerous/deadly IIRC i used mass drivers against the scouts, and psg on bigger ships for dealing with swarms of them, that plus hornets/hammerheads from a distance before the clusters broke up.
I've never used mouse control for any X game so i cant really comment on that.
And I'm also looking forward to new info, but then i think te entire forum is
Legionnaire
That would xplain y they so powerful, the scouts are not that much of threat but the khaak fighter or at least i tink it b fighterz coz evrytime betty says unknown object - they seem threating. Would do you for x games if not a mouse - freelancer was my first space sim reali the combat in there with the mouse. Im flying a nova now and it took 2 days jst to come up with 1.9 mil credits, i kinda hate the fact i hav to land to get to the bbs but i love readin ibc news and auto save which i hardly do is save. I was tinking maybe try saving for a m6 - in x3tc i loved the m3 cutlas with my m7 deimos. I see that m6 in x2 can dock one m5. Do you recommend any m6 or maybe any advice on good profit, does nividium xist in x2.
Thanks!
I hope though maybe end of june egosoft wil release some of those trailer, think, fight, build and trade
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