Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

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mr.WHO
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by mr.WHO »

Scoob wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 15:58 I like X4's Fighters, though I think a clear Scout / Light / Heavy type distinction would be nice - different map icons like X3 and prior for M5/4/3.

Corvettes are pretty good as they are while a Frigates only distinction is the ability to dock ships / drones.

I'd love to see larger Frigates, but that's where the current Capital ships fit it seems.
Scoob.
Sorry, but are you blind? X4 races have exactly such fighter classification:
Scout, (for the lack of better description) Main Battle Fighter, Heavy fighter.

The only anomaly are Teladi having TWO scout for no reason and Argon having Elite (obsolete/old interceptor) and Quasar (which is bizzare stat non-sense comparing to Pulsar/Eclipse)



Regarding X4 frigates - personally I do not reckognize them as actual frigates - both size and capabilites they are more or less X3 Heavy corvettes (M6+).
I agree that the X4 need PROPER frigate (aka small ship in L-size range - less direct firepower and L-turrets, but very condense M-turrets with great coverage - ideal anti-fighter platform).
Last edited by mr.WHO on Tue, 27. Aug 19, 17:05, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by tomchk »

Scoob wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 15:58 I would love it though if Egosoft officially imported and converted many of the great Capital ships from Rebirth. Modders are doing it, so I expect it'd not be a huge effort for the team behind both games to make it official. An injection of a large number of ships would be fantastic - the designs are sat there, waiting :)

Scoob.
I hope somebody with your level of community influence and experience can get through to Bernd on this! I think he/they have said they don't plan to do this because X4's huge on-ship docks wouldn't work with X:R ship designs. :(

Perhaps there is a way?
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by Tamina »

Since the DLC not only contains Split sectors, I still hope Albion and Omycron get connected to X4 as well. The plutarch ships looked awesome. The Omycron ships were okay but especially the "cloud" system looked so awesome. :D

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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by tomchk »

Tamina wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 16:35 Since the DLC not only contains Split sectors, I still hope Albion and Omycron get connected to X4 as well. The plutarch ships looked awesome. The Omycron ships were okay but especially the "cloud" system looked so awesome. :D
Yes! I hope they look at this thread with all you long-time contributors making these good points. Those systems were *amazing* and should be included in X4 officially somehow, even if the ships cannot be.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by GDS_dmitry »

tomchk wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 16:26 I think he/they have said they don't plan to do this because X4's huge on-ship docks wouldn't work with X:R ship designs. :(
This is absolute nonsense. Mods with Rebirth ships showed us, that Rebirth models has enough room to make all sort of landing pads. Hey, even Arawn has built in nose (partially open) hanger deck suitable for corvettes. If the devs will say that this is impossible to do, then in reality it will mean that they do not even want to try to make this.

Because who cares, Colossus is the best ship they've done in vanilla X4. And I remember Odin, Wooden, Boreas, Tokyo, Kyoto and laugh from this.
I never thought, that best capital ship in X series for me will be... in mod (in previous games I was satisfied with vanilla ones). Just look at this: https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ ... 85CB45903/ and say, which current X4 cap ship could compete with this one.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by Artean »

Scoob wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 15:58 Whether you Love or Hate X Rebirth, it did to capital ships very very well.
Indeed. They looked very good and was a joy to see in battle, given the weapon effects, explosions and fires. It does seem like a bit of waste to not reuse those models. Especially so when we need more ships of all kinds - much more!

But, in reality, there's only so much one can do at the same time. I'm sure X4 will eventually be fleshed out from patches and DLCs.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by tomchk »

GDS_dmitry wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 16:48
tomchk wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 16:26 I think he/they have said they don't plan to do this because X4's huge on-ship docks wouldn't work with X:R ship designs. :(
This is absolute nonsense. Mods with Rebirth ships showed us, that Rebirth models has enough room to make all sort of landing pads. Hey, even Arawn has built in nose (partially open) hanger deck suitable for corvettes. If the devs will say that this is impossible to do, then in reality it will mean that they do not even want to try to make this.
If the mods were able to implement the docks (I haven't tried), this might be worth a thread of its own to get more attention. Someone also said ships like the Arawn would destroy balance because they are so powerful (especially with all its turrets), but I hope we can get it officially someday with similar ships. Such a shame.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by mr.WHO »

IMO it would be great if they would later (I mean AFTER DLC2 and AFTER Borons) do the "X-Rebirth" DLC and make it free for all X-Rebirth owners.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by tomchk »

mr.WHO wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 17:08 IMO it would be great if they would later (I mean AFTER DLC2 and AFTER Borons) do the "X-Rebirth" DLC and make it free for all X-Rebirth owners.
I like this idea, but I just think they'd be wise to do it ASAP because they seem to be losing a lot of interest and support right now, and some of these changes sound far easier compared to making new content. For example, some effects mods literally just use X4-inlcuded (but not used) assets that came from X:R. I don't understand why Egosoft hasn't taken the time to check these mods and just make them official... :(
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Post by spankahontis »

Scoob wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 15:58 Whether you Love or Hate X Rebirth, it did to capital ships very very well.

I was quite surprised when NONE of the excellent X Rebirth Capitals made it into X4 and the ships we did get...well, they'd have made great Frigate-class ships (think M7's in old money lol) but they are NOT in the same league as Rebirth's capitals.

I like X4's Fighters, though I think a clear Scout / Light / Heavy type distinction would be nice - different map icons like X3 and prior for M5/4/3. Corvettes are pretty good as they are while a Frigates only distinction is the ability to dock ships / drones. I'd love to see larger Frigates, but that's where the current Capital ships fit it seems.

The game is crying out for Arawns, Taranis and the Terran Capital ships - they were all awesome. Even the weaker DeVries ships were very well done. It seems a shame for all that excellent design work to not make it into X4.

I also hope that Egosoft have another pass at weapons and shields. Really, what is their obsession with SLOW projectiles and WEAK shields? Every single X game prior to X Rebirth- and I've been here since day one - has been modified by me with faster bullets and better shields, making for infinitely better combat. Period. Rebirth appeared to do things differently and, once hull shields were in (I made a mod for myself to do that initially) the weapons balance felt pretty good.

I'm looking forward to 3.0 and the DLC of course, but I'll likely not be playing it - other than to test perhaps - until Shuulo's excellent VRO mod is updated with its faster and more varied projectiles and shields that actually work. Comparing the pure visual aspect of a vanilla fight and a VRO fight it's a different game and the balance feels pretty much spot on with larger ships feels harder - no more single light fighter whittling away a Capital ships shields...that's just silly lol.

I do of course welcome the extra Sectors, the game needs it I think as it does feel small compared to X3 irrespective of however many cubic km it's technically larger. Plus it's good to see the Split back in force with their own unique ships. I would love it though if Egosoft officially imported and converted many of the great Capital ships from Rebirth. Modders are doing it, so I expect it'd not be a huge effort for the team behind both games to make it official. An injection of a large number of ships would be fantastic - the designs are sat there, waiting :)

Scoob.
To be honest, i'm pleased, only means the Argon will have more unique ships when the Rebirth Systems do connect to X4's Systems. Which means the other Factions will need new ships to compensate their numbers.
Love to see Plutarch and Albion still fighting in a civil war along with the Republic of Canterra aiding them, with their own ships.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by teleportationwars »

spankahontis wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 18:45
Scoob wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 15:58 Whether you Love or Hate X Rebirth, it did to capital ships very very well.

I was quite surprised when NONE of the excellent X Rebirth Capitals made it into X4 and the ships we did get...well, they'd have made great Frigate-class ships (think M7's in old money lol) but they are NOT in the same league as Rebirth's capitals.

I like X4's Fighters, though I think a clear Scout / Light / Heavy type distinction would be nice - different map icons like X3 and prior for M5/4/3. Corvettes are pretty good as they are while a Frigates only distinction is the ability to dock ships / drones. I'd love to see larger Frigates, but that's where the current Capital ships fit it seems.

The game is crying out for Arawns, Taranis and the Terran Capital ships - they were all awesome. Even the weaker DeVries ships were very well done. It seems a shame for all that excellent design work to not make it into X4.

I also hope that Egosoft have another pass at weapons and shields. Really, what is their obsession with SLOW projectiles and WEAK shields? Every single X game prior to X Rebirth- and I've been here since day one - has been modified by me with faster bullets and better shields, making for infinitely better combat. Period. Rebirth appeared to do things differently and, once hull shields were in (I made a mod for myself to do that initially) the weapons balance felt pretty good.

I'm looking forward to 3.0 and the DLC of course, but I'll likely not be playing it - other than to test perhaps - until Shuulo's excellent VRO mod is updated with its faster and more varied projectiles and shields that actually work. Comparing the pure visual aspect of a vanilla fight and a VRO fight it's a different game and the balance feels pretty much spot on with larger ships feels harder - no more single light fighter whittling away a Capital ships shields...that's just silly lol.

I do of course welcome the extra Sectors, the game needs it I think as it does feel small compared to X3 irrespective of however many cubic km it's technically larger. Plus it's good to see the Split back in force with their own unique ships. I would love it though if Egosoft officially imported and converted many of the great Capital ships from Rebirth. Modders are doing it, so I expect it'd not be a huge effort for the team behind both games to make it official. An injection of a large number of ships would be fantastic - the designs are sat there, waiting :)

Scoob.
To be honest, i'm pleased, only means the Argon will have more unique ships when the Rebirth Systems do connect to X4's Systems. Which means the other Factions will need new ships to compensate their numbers.
Love to see Plutarch and Albion still fighting in a civil war along with the Republic of Canterra aiding them, with their own ships.
The xr ships aren't coming. Its a weekend to two to port them but the modding community can't because ego won't let us.
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Post by Wehrwolf_10 »

GDS_dmitry wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 16:48
tomchk wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 16:26 I think he/they have said they don't plan to do this because X4's huge on-ship docks wouldn't work with X:R ship designs. :(
... Just look at this: https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ ... 85CB45903/ and say, which current X4 cap ship could compete with this one.
no no no, this ship looks just ugly, it is sewn from different ships like Frankenstein
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by mr.WHO »

teleportationwars wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 18:59 The xr ships aren't coming. Its a weekend to two to port them but the modding community can't because ego won't let us.
LOL what? I see no less than 3 XR ship mods in X4 moding page - there is no Egosoft blocking anything on the modding side.
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=409546
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=418034
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=405414
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by teleportationwars »

mr.WHO wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 19:36
teleportationwars wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 18:59 The xr ships aren't coming. Its a weekend to two to port them but the modding community can't because ego won't let us.
LOL what? I see no less than 3 XR ship mods in X4 moding page - there is no Egosoft blocking anything on the modding side.
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=409546
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=418034
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=405414
https://imgur.com/tTmFK98

viewtopic.php?f=181&t=418034

so each of us can only port a few and we have to get approval for each one?
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Post by mr.WHO »

You know this "ban" is practically dead by its own definition?
You don't need total conversion, but you can make two mods that by some accident gives you complete XR pack.
Unless they outright ban any and all XR asset ports this ban is nothing more than a practical joke.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by Tomonor »

teleportationwars wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 19:40
mr.WHO wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 19:36
teleportationwars wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 18:59 The xr ships aren't coming. Its a weekend to two to port them but the modding community can't because ego won't let us.
LOL what? I see no less than 3 XR ship mods in X4 moding page - there is no Egosoft blocking anything on the modding side.
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=409546
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=418034
viewtopic.php?f=181&t=405414
https://imgur.com/tTmFK98

viewtopic.php?f=181&t=418034

so each of us can only port a few and we have to get approval for each one?
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by GDS_dmitry »

Wehrwolf_10 wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 19:30
GDS_dmitry wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 16:48
tomchk wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 16:26 I think he/they have said they don't plan to do this because X4's huge on-ship docks wouldn't work with X:R ship designs. :(
... Just look at this: https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ ... 85CB45903/ and say, which current X4 cap ship could compete with this one.
no no no, this ship looks just ugly, it is sewn from different ships like Frankenstein
Then you can choose any XL asset from XR or any M1-M2 from X3. They all look a lot better than X4 ones.
Kyoto for example. Any Split capship.
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Post by Axeface »

GDS_dmitry wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 22:24 Then you can choose any XL asset from XR or any M1-M2 from X3. They all look a lot better than X4 ones.
Kyoto for example. Any Split capship.
The X3 models would look very very bad in X4, most dont hold up to close inspection at all. The XR ones are better but even those would require a lot of work for their modeling quality to match that of X4. A modder can add a ship without worrying too much about quality being even across the board, the devs cant. I also love loads of the XR designs, but I dont know if adding them to X4 would be a smart thing to do - havent thought about it much but my gut feeling is they wouldnt 'fit'.
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Re: Egosoft@Gamescom | Live@Gamestar | Translated Summary

Post by Tomonor »

Axeface wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 22:33
GDS_dmitry wrote: Tue, 27. Aug 19, 22:24 Then you can choose any XL asset from XR or any M1-M2 from X3. They all look a lot better than X4 ones.
Kyoto for example. Any Split capship.
The X3 models would look very very bad in X4, most dont hold up to close inspection at all. The XR ones are better but even those would require a lot of work for their modeling quality to match that of X4. A modder can add a ship without worrying too much about quality being even across the board, the devs cant.
They wouldn't look bad per se but additional work would be required. In fact, one might need to completely remodel them from scratch while using the original look as a template. This is basically what happened with some of the X4 ships (X-BtF's Falcon, X2's Buzzard, the Pelican is basically a reworked X3 Teladi Falcon, etc).

But just to reinforce what I'm saying, here's a video of an X-Rebirth mod, where the X3 models work perfectly:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m02in8wHask


As for the hangar question (regarding the unusable XR ship models), imo it was a rather silly idea to not work out a means of docking that would support slimmer docks with other directional approach than upwards. We already have quicklaunch bays on carriers and some station modules, can't Egosoft work on those to support docking/player docking as well? That would fix the problem temporarily.
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Post by ScandyNav »

X4 needs new models created from the scratch. If you port models from X:R there are two possible outcomes:
- models are too big and if you place balanced amount of hardpoints on them, ship will look stupid: huge hull, small turrets, low amount of turrets.
- models are too big and you cover them with guns to look awesome and by this creating death-star, wich is out of balance with other ships completely.

So, good way, sadly, is only new models, which will be only slightly bigger, then current X4 ones, creating new classes heavy destroyers and heavy carriers, not a OMFGOP motherships.
Last edited by ScandyNav on Wed, 28. Aug 19, 00:44, edited 1 time in total.

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