Trump

[RegisterMe]

If any of what he's alleging is true, then why is it that only Trump and his "lawyers" have this mysterious evidence? Why has none of it been released to the public or presented in court at a minimum? For nearly 2 months is been "we have all this proof, but you can't see it.

Silly boy. He can't release it. It's under audit by the IRS.

[Vertigo 7]

If any of what he's alleging is true, then why is it that only Trump and his "lawyers" have this mysterious evidence? Why has none of it been released to the public or presented in court at a minimum? For nearly 2 months is been "we have all this proof, but you can't see it.

Silly boy. He can't release it. It's under audit by the IRS.

touché! lol

[matthewfarmery]

Trump now filing two lawsuits over the leaked recording.

https://www.rt.com/usa/511448-trump-geo ... suit-call/

Also, Trump's team is saying that the recording has been heavy edited. But the Washington Post has said, that simply isn't true, and the whole recording has been released.

Again, one rule for one, another rule for others. So its fine for a sitting president to bully and force a state to overturn a result, but not for that state official to release a recording about that very thing?

While I not heard the recording, (not all of it) but what I have heard, Trump is really desperate now. Close to wits ends.

But to me, what Trump has done is a far more serious crime, and one that the GOP can not ignore.

[RegisterMe]

It appears to be a State level crime, which means that he can't pardon himself. Whether it gets prosecuted remains to be seen.

Though, whilst we're on about the IRS (my joke post above), presumably Federal tax evasion is a Federal crime? In which case I wonder can he pardon himself for anything that occurs under that umbrella?

[Gavrushka]

It *has* to be prosecuted, and there's a fundamental reason why:

Trump and those like him see the consequences of wrongdoing as potential litigation and nothing beyond other than a possible financial penalty. - Unless incarceration is the (potential) penalty for breaking the law, younger generations of Trumpalikes are gonna have carte blanche to follow in Trump senior's footsteps. -I believe Eric has already stated he wants to be president in the future. - I really feel the US will struggle with its identity if a succession of Trump clones are able to become leader of what is the most powerful democracy on the planet, and then abuse that position for personal gain without fear of prosecution.

So to be clear, I really think it is a case of 'lock him up' if it's lawful to do so.

[RegisterMe]

I think my Hoover is smarter than Eric, and it's not even IOT.

[Gavrushka]

I think my Hoover is smarter than Eric, and it's not even IOT.

Ha, I think he favours his father, intellect-wise. Besides, intelligence doesn't seem to be high up on the list of must-haves for politicians. Look at our own IDS...*



*I didn't know what your TLA stood for, incidentally.

[pjknibbs]

Though, whilst we're on about the IRS (my joke post above), presumably Federal tax evasion is a Federal crime? In which case I wonder can he pardon himself for anything that occurs under that umbrella?

Pretty sure he can't pardon himself for anything. He could resign and get Pence to do so, though.

[matthewfarmery]

I think there is a deeper issue here. IF Trump has done threatening phone calls to one official, what about elsewhere? like the Pentagon?

Is Trump Making Democracy-Threatening Phone Calls to the Pentagon, Too?
https://washingtonmonthly.com/2021/01/0 ... tagon-too/

Granted that is a what if situation, given Trump's state of mind, I wouldn't put it past him. Then there is the letter from the Pentagon that got written and signed recently. but considering that Trump has been pushing people into Pentagon positions, that they aren't qualified for. Could someone from there do Trump's bidding?

But then we have to look at the wider angle, what about other states? It won't take one state alone to make Trump the victor, he will need at least 4. So I guess in his way of thinking, if he can bully one state, then others will follow suit.

This is very deeply worrying. Trump needs to be held accountable. neither the GOP or the dems can let this one go. Because if they do, then others will do the same. and might have more success.

[RegisterMe]

Though, whilst we're on about the IRS (my joke post above), presumably Federal tax evasion is a Federal crime? In which case I wonder can he pardon himself for anything that occurs under that umbrella?

Pretty sure he can't pardon himself for anything. He could resign and get Pence to do so, though.

There's nothing in the Constitution that prevents it, and it's never been done before. So, as ridiculous as it sounds, he can certainly try it. Though one would hope that it would be challenged in the courts.

One other interesting aspect of it is, I think, that acceptance of a pardon implies guilt and means that you can no longer plead the 5th. I've no idea how that might play out.

[matthewfarmery]

Though, whilst we're on about the IRS (my joke post above), presumably Federal tax evasion is a Federal crime? In which case I wonder can he pardon himself for anything that occurs under that umbrella?

Pretty sure he can't pardon himself for anything. He could resign and get Pence to do so, though.

There's nothing in the Constitution that prevents it, and it's never been done before. So, as ridiculous as it sounds, he can certainly try it. Though one would hope that it would be challenged in the courts.

One other interesting aspect of it is, I think, that acceptance of a pardon implies guilt and means that you can no longer plead the 5th. I've no idea how that might play out.

I read that I think its Stone, and one other, that Trump has pardoned, will go in front of a grand Jury, and may have to testify against Trump. And if they do lie again, there wont be a Trump anymore to give them another pardon.

So pardoning is an admission of guilt. And in that above case, could be used against you. (Trump) So all these pardons that Trump has handed out, could very well backfire. Even then, there should be an inquest or something into his pardoning power, and who he has pardoned. As there probably an obstruction of justice there as well.

[Vertigo 7]

Though, whilst we're on about the IRS (my joke post above), presumably Federal tax evasion is a Federal crime? In which case I wonder can he pardon himself for anything that occurs under that umbrella?

Pretty sure he can't pardon himself for anything. He could resign and get Pence to do so, though.

There's nothing in the Constitution that prevents it, and it's never been done before. So, as ridiculous as it sounds, he can certainly try it. Though one would hope that it would be challenged in the courts.

One other interesting aspect of it is, I think, that acceptance of a pardon implies guilt and means that you can no longer plead the 5th. I've no idea how that might play out.

Well, the thing it, the constitution may prevent it. Article 2 doesn't limit his pardon power, but it does prevent someone from being a judge in their own case, which a self-pardon would seem to be just that.

[matthewfarmery]

https://www.rawstory.com/george-conway- ... tion_start

George Conway: Trump's only defense for Georgia call is to claim insanity -- but even that won't work



George Conway said President Donald Trump's only defense was essentially insanity against criminal charges for his phone call with Georgia's secretary of state.

The president was recorded on a call pressuring secretary of state Brad Raffensperger to "find" just enough votes to overturn his election loss in Georgia, and Conway told MSNBC's "Morning Joe" that Trump had once again made his legal problems worse by openly engaging in criminal activity.

"He's dumb as a rock and he made that [Mueller' investigation about himself by trying to interfere with it," Conway said, "and now he's making his legal situation worse in his fear of criminal liability in an investigation by essentially committing more crimes."
Take advantage of our limited time offer. Go ad-free for just $2 a week. Support independent journalism.

"If you look at the Georgia statute it's pretty clear this is a crime," he added. "The only defense he would have, and also there's a federal statute that's differently worded that also arguably comes in to play, but his only defense to that, to a criminal prosecution on that phone call, he's so delusional that he actually believes that he won this election, that he believes all the things that he said, and maybe he's convinced himself of that."

However, Conway said, the president's history of dishonesty would make an insanity defense difficult to pull off.

"If I broke into your house, and I claimed it was my house and I was arrested, it might be a defense if I truly, truly believed it was my house," Conway said. "But I can't establish that just by saying, 'Oh, I told 50 people that it was my house and I made a big deal of it, and Lin Wood and Sidney Powell and Rudy Giuliani said it was my house.' It doesn't work, especially in you're the biggest liar in the world like President Trump is."

So yeah, another lawsuit will probably be heading Trump's way. Even pleading insanity isn't going to work. But I agree, Trump is really dumb, this move just puts another nail in his coffin.

Edit
'Open-and-shut federal crime': Members of Congress demand prosecution of Trump for election tampering
https://www.rawstory.com/trump-crimes-2649728452/

So basically a state and federal crime. So a pardon won't be enough. but this should be investigated once Trump leaves office.

[RegisterMe]

Pretty sure he can't pardon himself for anything. He could resign and get Pence to do so, though.

There's nothing in the Constitution that prevents it, and it's never been done before. So, as ridiculous as it sounds, he can certainly try it. Though one would hope that it would be challenged in the courts.

One other interesting aspect of it is, I think, that acceptance of a pardon implies guilt and means that you can no longer plead the 5th. I've no idea how that might play out.

Well, the thing it, the constitution may prevent it. Article 2 doesn't limit his pardon power, but it does prevent someone from being a judge in their own case, which a self-pardon would seem to be just that.

Yup. And that's what will end up in court.

[matthewfarmery]

https://www.rawstory.com/trump-turnberry-scotland/

So a rumour has started, when

Prestwick airport, which is near Trump's Turnberry resort, was told to expect the arrival on Jan. 19 of a U.S. military Boeing 757 plane the president has reportedly used before, reported the Sunday PostSunday Post.

If that is indeed the case, then it could very well mean that Trump might try and flee the US. I'm not sure what else it could be? Unless Trump might plan on living in Scotland? (but I doubt they will want him there) Unless its for one of Trump's family members? Whatever it is, it does raise concerns about Trump might try and flee. But then again, Trump isn't all that bright, so, if he does come this way, he won't get very far.

[Gavrushka]

Apparently there's an apartment just came vacant in Moscow. (Thanks to George Blake.)

I was musing over where he could go without an extradition treaty with the US. I think that limits it to Russia and Iran.

His legal advisors have pointed out Iran is much warmer.

[Vertigo 7]

Gym Jordan and Moo Man Nunes are supposedly getting butt snorkeling medals from the orange overlord. It's gonna be an interesting feat of acrobatics to see Trump put a ribbon around their necks while their faces are surgically attached to his anus.

[mr.WHO]

Gym Jordan and Moo Man Nunes are supposedly getting butt snorkeling medals from the orange overlord. It's gonna be an interesting feat of acrobatics to see Trump put a ribbon around their necks while their faces are surgically attached to his anus.

Not gonna lie, I burst of laugh trying to imagine the whole situation.

[felter]

The Pardon thing is pretty funny as most of them Trump included have no idea what the pardon means and what it is. A fine example is that Joe Arpaio, when he got Pardoned he didn't realise it's true meaning till he was in an interview and he stated that even though he was pardoned, he was still going to clear his name in court, until the interviewer pointed out that once you take a pardon you take full responsibility for the crimes related to that pardon, that the case is then closed and cannot be opened again, meaning he couldn't clear his name as there is no way to do it.

It's the same with that Roger Stone, I don't think he realised what with him taking that pardon meant as I have seen it mentioned on several occasions now where the person talking about Stone have used the term and name, the Traitor Roger Stone. Because he accepted the pardon he confirmed he committed treason against the US of A and he will now go down in the history books as that traitor Roger Stone and there is nothing he can do about it, as he accepted that pardon, he accepted that he was a traitor, and anyone and everyone can say it without any kind or repercussions. It's the same with the rest of them, they all agreed they are traitors and should be called so.

A pardon is just the ultimate prosecution deal you can make as you have to plead guilty to the crimes you are being pardoned for. But like all deals there are two sides to them, as others have pointed out if they end up in court and are asked questions about their crimes, they must answer them honestly and truthfully, or go to jail, and that could be for a long time, none of this is a good thing for Trump.

It's the same if Trump does try and pardon himself, all he is doing is saying I forgive myself for committing those crimes I have committed. It's a risk because if he ends up in court and loses out to the he can't pardon himself, he will have admitted to committing crimes and having no protection because he can't suddenly go, I didn't do those crimes, because he gave himself a pardon for them.

[felter]

https://www.rawstory.com/trump-turnberry-scotland/

So a rumour has started, when

Prestwick airport, which is near Trump's Turnberry resort, was told to expect the arrival on Jan. 19 of a U.S. military Boeing 757 plane the president has reportedly used before, reported the Sunday PostSunday Post.

If that is indeed the case, then it could very well mean that Trump might try and flee the US. I'm not sure what else it could be? Unless Trump might plan on living in Scotland? (but I doubt they will want him there) Unless its for one of Trump's family members? Whatever it is, it does raise concerns about Trump might try and flee. But then again, Trump isn't all that bright, so, if he does come this way, he won't get very far.

He most certainly will not be coming to Scotland as we are in total lockdown, nobody gets in and nobody gets out unless it is for necessary travel. Not just that, all the golf courses are all closed down, so no golfing allowed here.