Performance with large stations

[James Razor]

Well, I have performance issues, but of a more strange kind, as the game seems not to use my available hardware well.

The CPU is the one thing that gets somewhat taken advantage of, but RAM and GPU and VRAM are wondering why there are there even.

My 5800X3D, 64 GB RAM and 3090 Ti are not the latest stuff, but certainly not bad, yet I still get low FPS counts, which I suspect to be simply engine limitations, as nothing is even close to being under stress (unless I run SINZA - sorry, I play in German, dunno what the English version is, but the time compression drive thing is what I mean).

I also have the tendency to build gigantic factory complexes, which does not help the matter and expecially late into a playthrough, the game struggles severely, especially near those or one of my large fleets.

I'll add a screenshot of my latest version of my HQ ship- and terraforming yard:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... 329f9e359d&

Honestly, I doubt anything can be done from my side, because even throwing more hardware at the problem, which was what I tried, did not solve the issue here.
Also, everything runs of Samsung m.2 SSDs directly mounted on the motherboard, so even this part is a good as it can get.

There is also something that I noticed if I leave the game running (those giga-complexes take days with SINZA running to build...):
There seesm to be a VRAM leak somewhere, as I have to reload the game every 2nd day or so, as the VRAM usage creeps up over time. The 3090 TI has 24 GB, so it takes a while to fill up, but I guess a card with less will have this effect sooner.

When I laod the game, I start at under 4 GB VRAM and a few hours that will jump to over 10 - the more I use SINZA, the faster the VRAM usage will spike.
When I run out of VRAM, the game will bug out and even saving will no longer be possible.

[CBJ]

I've split this out from the sticky thread for you so that it is more visible.

First, just to point out that external tools for measuring resource utilisation are not always particularly accurate. The fact that you're seeing the CPU well-used is an indication that whatever you're using is somewhat better than most, but I recommend taking the other results with a pinch of salt anyway.

Second, if the CPU is busy, which it normally is with this game, then that would explain why the GPU is not that busy. When the game is CPU-bound, the framerate will be lower and the GPU will have less to do. With regard to memory, the game uses what it needs, and using more would not make the game run any faster even if there were something to store there. And with regard to "leaks", we keep a close eye on this and are confident that there are no significant issues. It is normal for the game to increase its VRAM usage as time goes on, and as long as there is plenty available, because the game puts assets there as it needs them and keeps them there as long as possible. When it starts running short, the game manages that and starts disposing of things that it hasn't used for a while, but it doesn't do that if it doesn't need to. What you describe with your game eventually running out of VRAM and the subsequent behaviour is not normal, and it would be good to have more information to find out why that's happening for you.

And finally, with regard to the game slowing down, yes, it will eventually slow down if you build huge stations. The game doesn't place many limits on what you can build and if you put a lot in the same area, you will eventually bring your hardware to its knees. We work pretty much continuously on improving performance to allow people to build larger empires, but we cannot perform miracles!

So, if you want us to look into anything further then you'll need to provide us more information to work with. The very first sticky thread at the top of the forum explains what information you need to provide and how to provide it. Start with a DXDiag and vulkaninfo, whether or not your game is modified, and if it's not then also a link to an example of a savegame which exhibits the behaviour you describe.

[James Razor]

The CPU only has utilization-spikes while running time compression and then only on a few of the 16 threads (about 4 spike in waves - think the crazy water planet from interstellar when looking at task manager). Task Manager reports overall CPU usage jumping between 4% and 11%.

Also, the CPU does not get hot.
If I compare it to something like Helldivers II, which is the opposite and pushes it up to its thermal design temperature (aka 90°C), X4 (even with time compression running) does not make it get hot and it barely gets warm above idle temps (I currently have the game running and have the CPU at below 65°C).

This is with 3 Monitors open, middle one having the game, right one the forums while I type this and the left one having a Youtube video playing.

RAM is also not being used fully, even with the tendency of Windows to reserve more when more is available.
Task Manager reports it as 13 GB, but as mentioned, I know that Windows tends to reserver more than the application actually needs when there is more available and as I have 64 GB everything seems to need more RAM when compared to what others report. Total System wide RAM usage according to Task Manager is at 44% or 28.5 GB btw. at the instance I type this.

So I am basing my observation of the utilization at least partially on the observed temperatures of the hardware components involved compared to when they are under stress (Helldivers II for CPU, things like Forza 5 for the GPU - my MSI Suprim X 3090 TI can draw up to 480W according to its spec sheets when under load and I have seen tools report as much when pulling the stops on it and then it also gets warmer, but at the moment, the entire case (CPU, GPU and other temp sensors I can see) is sitting at below 65°C when X4 is running).

I can ignore all FPS issues, etc. while I sit somewhere and let the time compression run, that is not even my issue.
What my issue is, is the massive stuttering in combat, even in sectors that do not have any of my stations and if it is only my personal Corvette or Figther. I still get short locks for like half a second, sometimes longer, but in any case noticeable, which makes combat no fun.

I usually ignore all the personal stuff and play this as game mostly as RTS and let massive fleets take care of things.
Which is a real shame, because since the changes made to the flight model, it is real fun, but the performance issues make it hard to enjoy in the long run and impossible to do with large fleets or even a single full carrier complement present. Then it devolves into a stuttering lagfest.

[CBJ]

As I explained before, memory usage being limited is normal and has nothing to do with performance. CPU temperature is also not a particularly helpful metric.

Task Manager reports overall CPU usage jumping between 4% and 11%.

This is exactly what I was talking about when I said that most external tools are misleading. The game usually makes heavy use of a couple of cores, which are usually the limiting factor for performance, and somewhat lighter use of most others. Not only that but Windows has a tendency to move the load between cores, making it difficult to even spot the ones that are heavily used.

Comparisons with other games are also not helpful, since very few other games simulate the entire game universe all the time. This is also why not being near your huge stations does not make their impact disappear entirely when you don't happen to be nearby.

Occasional stutters could be caused by the game, but equally they could be caused by mods, or by other applications running on the PC.

Anyway, as I said at the end of my previous post, if you want us to look into this any further then you will need to provide the information requested at the top of the forum.

[James Razor]

Version and language (e.g. 8.00 Hotfix 3, English, etc.).
- Latest Version of the Game on Steam without the latest Ship DLC (aka 8.00 Hotfix 3) - game Language is German.
Issue has been encountered with previous versions as well
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

Whether or not your game is modified using any third party scripts or mods (see note below).
- Vanilla / Unmodded / Unmoddified Savegame - all DLCs including Timelines, with Hyperion, without Emisarry
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

The game start you originally selected for the game in which the problem occurred.
- New self-created game with budget limit (aka not having to re-do all the story stuff and having a few assets from the start).
Current Playthrough is MK IX (aka the 9th itteration with activated Expedition Expansion).
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... 08c8922ba&
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

Exact nature of the problem, where and when it occurs and what you were doing at the time.
- Performance issues and stuttering as described in thread
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

Any possibly relevant changes you have made to your game, system, or software before the issue occurred.
- Upgraded PC from Intel i7 4790k, 16 GB RAM, GTX 1070, installation on HDD to AMD 5800X3D, 64 GB RAM, 3090 Ti, installation on m.2 SSD - performance issues remain largely the same.
I personally suspect engine limitations as the root cause, similar to why X3 and before (with their 32bit engines) still run poorly even on hardware with factors of magnitude more computing power.
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

Where appropriate, additional symptoms, error messages, links to saves *, screenshots and crash dump files (see this Wiki entry).
- File Share Link for the Savegame in the Screenshot - https://uploadnow.io/f/h7nN7zV
Please note that you need to have the Expedition extension active to load it.
Also, some things have custom names. While I am not aware of anything in particullar that might be offensive, just a fair warning that this was not initially intended to be shared with anyone.

Once loaded, just teleport to the HQ, one of my shipyards or the Hatikvah's Choice Trading Station in front of the Xenon Gate, as that is defended by one of my main fleets.
I am currently in the process of doing a 2nd Terraforming Project in Frontier Edge, having just completed Getsu Fune.
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

Your system specifications in the form of a DxDiag report and vulkaninfo (see this Wiki entry).**
- https://uploadnow.io/s/5e08d1bc-666a-4a ... 78e5690331
I removed the Hardware Identifiers from the file, which seemed the most obvious thing to do.
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

[James Razor]

As I explained before, memory usage being limited is normal and has nothing to do with performance. CPU temperature is also not a particularly helpful metric.

Task Manager reports overall CPU usage jumping between 4% and 11%.

This is exactly what I was talking about when I said that most external tools are misleading. The game usually makes heavy use of a couple of cores, which are usually the limiting factor for performance, and somewhat lighter use of most others. Not only that but Windows has a tendency to move the load between cores, making it difficult to even spot the ones that are heavily used.

Comparisons with other games are also not helpful, since very few other games simulate the entire game universe all the time. This is also why not being near your huge stations does not make their impact disappear entirely when you don't happen to be nearby.

Occasional stutters could be caused by the game, but equally they could be caused by mods, or by other applications running on the PC.

Anyway, as I said at the end of my previous post, if you want us to look into this any further then you will need to provide the information requested at the top of the forum.

I have uploaded the savegame in the meantime btw.
Would be nice if you could look at it.

But as a sidenote to the 'not using system resources available' argument:
I can leave X4 running in the background (as mentioned, building these extremely large shipyards takes ages, I would be very glad for a possibility to add multiple contruction ships to a fleet that then work together to speed up those builds or something similar) and play other games with virtually no performance impact on those (granted, stuff like World of Warships and Eve Online, which run on a Toaster with Amibitions - but I do not have to reduce anything).

Even more demanding stuff like Elite Dangerous works as long as I make sure that I load the savegame in X4 fresh and keep an eye to not run into that issues I mentioned with the VRAM being filled to capacity after a few hours. But then X4 will bug out, not Elite.

Also, I noticed that even if tabbed-out, inputs made to my HOTAS will still be picked up by X4. Both in windowed, fullscreen-window or fullscreen mode.

I can not do that with titles that make better use of the resources or are 'less well optimized'.

[CBJ]

Again, comparisons with other games are rarely helpful. For example, Elite Dangerous may be demanding graphically but it does not simulate the entire game universe in the background, so it is nowhere near as demanding on the CPU, system memory (speed of memory, not quantity), and so on. The other games are online games, where all the background stuff is done on the server.