Align the ship heading and the screen center on external view

[flywlyx]

The ship's heading and the weapon's aim point in external view are not centered on the screen, which feels unintuitive and makes aiming less convenient.
Since the UI lacks a ship heading indicator, players can't accurately predict the ship's direction from the camera view.
Additionally, with the weapon aim point offset from the center, estimating max gimbal angles becomes nearly impossible.
Most notably, it's very difficult to fly straight and shoot a target directly ahead using mouse aiming and mouse steering simultaneously—flying straight requires the mouse to stay centered, but the target ship isn't centered on the screen.

[MarStrMind]

Strange. In normal flying situations both indicators are perfectly centered for me (when not changing directions) - Timelines 7.5. Maybe there is an axis on your HOTAS or something misaligned?

[PV_]

It seems a bug. Under certain circumstances both weapon pointer and flight direction circle tend to be near that middle sticky circle. In other instances, both go higher as OP has shown.
It isn't hard to reproduce and seems to tied to ship rotation direction.
Also worth mentioning I'm playing beta as well as OP, I guess. Perhaps 7.5 doesn't have that problem.

EDIT: after more testing the things looks a bit weird, but probably intended. I normally don't use external view and there is something I might have missed. But... If there is active target selected AND ship look at the target side then the weapon pointer and move direction circle are anchored in the middle of the screen. Otherwise (if there is no selection or ship nose facing another direction rather the target) then pointer goes upward.

[flywlyx]

Strange. In normal flying situations both indicators are perfectly centered for me (when not changing directions) - Timelines 7.5. Maybe there is an axis on your HOTAS or something misaligned?

External camera? I just checked in version 7.5—same problem still exists. What resolution are you using? I'm on 1920x1080.
This seems to be a camera issue, not related to the controls.

EDIT: after more testing the things looks a bit weird, but probably intended. I normally don't use external view and there is something I might have missed. But... If there is active target selected AND ship look at the target side then the weapon pointer and move direction circle are anchored in the middle of the screen. Otherwise (if there is no selection or ship nose facing another direction rather the target) then pointer goes upward.

Yeah, and the target can't be any friendly unit either. But since the devs moved this topic out of the beta test forum, it’s probably just another odd design choice meant to add some intentional difficulty to the racing gameplay.

[A5PECT]

3rd person camera behaves differently depending on whether you have a target selected or not.

If you have a target selected, the camera will be centered on the ship's facing (the center reticle and velocity indicator will be on top of each other, if your ship is flying in a straight line)

If you do not have a target selected, the camera will be offset from the ship's facing (the center reticle will be below the velocity indicator, if your ship is flying in a straight line). The offset will be greater the further away from 0 you have the 3rd person camera set along the Y axis.

[MarStrMind]

Strange. In normal flying situations both indicators are perfectly centered for me (when not changing directions) - Timelines 7.5. Maybe there is an axis on your HOTAS or something misaligned?

External camera? I just checked in version 7.5—same problem still exists. What resolution are you using? I'm on 1920x1080.
This seems to be a camera issue, not related to the controls.

I missed the external camera bit. In external view it is the same for me.

However, this is not a bug. This has to do with the alignment of the external camera and the resulting direction where the ship is currently heading, based on the viewpoint of the camera. It's working as intended.

You can change the camera position in external view, and you wil see the indicator move based on that position.

[flywlyx]

However, this is not a bug. This has to do with the alignment of the external camera and the resulting direction where the ship is currently heading, based on the viewpoint of the camera. It's working as intended.

Since you mentioned it's working as intended, what exactly is the intention? What purpose does it serve other than confusing the player's sense of direction?"

Now I understand why those racing missions feel so awkward—because that’s exactly how they were intended to be.

[GCU Grey Area]

If the heading indicator was 'aligned' as you request it would no longer provide accurate information. It's normally above screen centre in external view due to the relative positions of the ship model & external camera. If the external camera position is moved e.g. to the side of the ship, the heading indicator moves correspondingly to show the ship's destination - it's now no longer above screen centre, it's off to one side (screenshot). Only way to align heading indicator with screen centre would be to move the external camera position such that it is directly behind the ship. This may be undesirable however since in that position the ship itself would obscure the view ahead.

[flywlyx]

If the heading indicator was 'aligned' as you request it would no longer provide accurate information. It's normally above screen centre in external view due to the relative positions of the ship model & external camera. If the external camera position is moved e.g. to the side of the ship, the heading indicator moves correspondingly to show the ship's destination - it's now no longer above screen centre, it's off to one side (screenshot). Only way to align heading indicator with screen centre would be to move the external camera position such that it is directly behind the ship. This may be undesirable however since in that position the ship itself would obscure the view ahead.

In a game, the camera represents the player's eye within the game world, and its center indicates the line of sight. Generally, the standard approach is to have the camera look straight ahead, meaning the line of sight is parallel to the vehicle’s heading. In a perspective projection setup, this means the camera’s center should align directly with the vehicle’s direction of travel. It doesn’t need to be positioned on the back of the vehicle—the key idea is parallel alignment. As long as it’s parallel to the ship, it can be placed anywhere relative to it. The rear camera placement is mainly to help players better perceive the vehicle’s position. When the camera is inside the cockpit, it’s referred to as the F1 cockpit view. If it’s positioned in front of the vehicle, some racing games call it the bumper view.

What you're describing—looking to the right while turning right—is also common, as it mimics how people naturally drive vehicles. However, such dynamic camera movements can cause motion sickness, which is why many games provide options to adjust the camera's movement amplitude or simply turn it off.

Now, looking at the image you uploaded: you're turning right, but the center of the camera is positioned to the left of the ship’s heading. This means the camera is actually looking to the left, which directly contradicts your claim.

As a result, it feels counter-intuitive and awkward for players. It goes against the direction of movement, making it harder to track targets, and the excessive camera movement can cause motion sickness. I honestly don’t see any upside to this approach.

[GCU Grey Area]

Now, looking at the image you uploaded: you're turning right, but the center of the camera is positioned to the left of the ship’s heading. This means the camera is actually looking to the left, which directly contradicts your claim.

Nope - ship was not turning, was flying in a straight line. Was not even touching the joystick when the screenshot was taken. Only thing that changed from default external view was camera position. Couple more screenshots, both taken while game was paused:
1. Default external view. Ship is flying directly towards a station, as shown by the heading indicator.
2. Camera position moved. Ship still flying towards station, as shown by heading indicator, however now that heading indicator is in an entirely different position on the screen.

[jackeycheung]

Classic space sim move, giving you advanced targeting systems but no idea where your ship is actually pointing

[flywlyx]

Nope - ship was not turning, was flying in a straight line. Was not even touching the joystick when the screenshot was taken. Only thing that changed from default external view was camera position.

I don't see any value in discussing manually adjusted camera positions—while you can move the camera anywhere, it won’t automatically track the ship's heading.

[A5PECT]

There just needs to be a "static" heading indicator in 3rd person mode that always shows the exact facing of the ship. This isn't necessary in 1st person mode, as that function is served by the main center reticle. But in 3rd person mode, the center reticle is not always aligned with yoir ship's facing due to parallax shenanigans.

Right now, the velocity indicator shows your ship's direction of movement. If your ship is moving in the same direction as its facing, the velocity indicator will be showing the exact facing of your ship. But as soon as your ships direction of movement diverges from its facing (due to, say, all of the inertial drift added in the last update), the player no longer has a clear, precise indicator of where their ship is pointing

[MarStrMind]

Nope - ship was not turning, was flying in a straight line. Was not even touching the joystick when the screenshot was taken. Only thing that changed from default external view was camera position.

I don't see any value in discussing manually adjusted camera positions—while you can move the camera anywhere, it won’t automatically track the ship's heading.

It doesn't. The indicator moves relative to the external camera position, and the ship's heading direction.

I can only re-iterate that this is working exactly as intended.

[GCU Grey Area]

I don't see any value in discussing manually adjusted camera positions—while you can move the camera anywhere, it won’t automatically track the ship's heading.

Fair enough, I'll try a simpler explanation. Previous examples were intended to illustrate the effect camera position has on where the heading indicator appears relative to screen centre. The further the camera is away from a position directly behind the ship the further away the heading indicator will appear to be relative to screen centre. Default external camera position is not directly behind the ship so it is impossible for it to align with the screen centre. Instead the camera position is above the ship (so the ship doesn't block the view directly ahead), which inevitably moves the position of the heading indicator above screen centre. This is the only place it can be if it is to provide accurate info on ship's heading, given relative positions of ship & external camera.

[flywlyx]

There just needs to be a "static" heading indicator in 3rd person mode that always shows the exact facing of the ship. This isn't necessary in 1st person mode, as that function is served by the main center reticle. But in 3rd person mode, the center reticle is not always aligned with yoir ship's facing due to parallax shenanigans.

Right now, the velocity indicator shows your ship's direction of movement. If your ship is moving in the same direction as its facing, the velocity indicator will be showing the exact facing of your ship. But as soon as your ships direction of movement diverges from its facing (due to, say, all of the inertial drift added in the last update), the player no longer has a clear, precise indicator of where their ship is pointing

In general, the screen center serves as the indicator, which is standard across nearly all vehicle driving games—it's aligned with natural human perception, focusing on the front of the vehicle. Even in cockpit view, parallax still occurs, which is why bumper views exist. I don’t see the need to reinvent something that already works well.

[flywlyx]

Fair enough, I'll try a simpler explanation. Previous examples were intended to illustrate the effect camera position has on where the heading indicator appears relative to screen centre. The further the camera is away from a position directly behind the ship the further away the heading indicator will appear to be relative to screen centre. Default external camera position is not directly behind the ship so it is impossible for it to align with the screen centre. Instead the camera position is above the ship (so the ship doesn't block the view directly ahead), which inevitably moves the position of the heading indicator above screen centre. This is the only place it can be if it is to provide accurate info on ship's heading, given relative positions of ship & external camera.

You’re misunderstanding the relationship between position and rotation. In a perspective projection, the specific location is irrelevant—what matters is orientation, as all parallel lines converge to a single point regardless of their position.

[A5PECT]

There just needs to be a "static" heading indicator in 3rd person mode that always shows the exact facing of the ship. This isn't necessary in 1st person mode, as that function is served by the main center reticle. But in 3rd person mode, the center reticle is not always aligned with yoir ship's facing due to parallax shenanigans.

Right now, the velocity indicator shows your ship's direction of movement. If your ship is moving in the same direction as its facing, the velocity indicator will be showing the exact facing of your ship. But as soon as your ships direction of movement diverges from its facing (due to, say, all of the inertial drift added in the last update), the player no longer has a clear, precise indicator of where their ship is pointing

In general, the screen center serves as the indicator, which is standard across nearly all vehicle driving games—it's aligned with natural human perception, focusing on the front of the vehicle. Even in cockpit view, parallax still occurs, which is why bumper views exist. I don’t see the need to reinvent something that already works well.

But the screen center does not align with the ship's facing when in 3rd person view, to increasing degrees based on how far the camera is displaced from 0,0 on the X and Y axes. This is demonstrable by setting a high vertical or horizontal offset on your 3rd person camera and flying a a straight line with no target selected. The velocity indicator will show your ship's direction, and the center reticle will be somewhere between the velocity indicator and your ship's location on the screen

[flywlyx]

But the screen center does not align with the ship's facing when in 3rd person view, to increasing degrees based on how far the camera is displaced from 0,0 on the X and Y axes. This is demonstrable by setting a high vertical or horizontal offset on your 3rd person camera and flying a a straight line with no target selected. The velocity indicator will show your ship's direction, and the center reticle will be somewhere between the velocity indicator and your ship's location on the screen

That’s exactly what I’m referring to—Egosoft intentionally misaligns the ship’s heading with the screen center when no target is selected. This odd design choice is the root of all these issues.

[GCU Grey Area]

You’re misunderstanding the relationship between position and rotation. In a perspective projection, the specific location is irrelevant—what matters is orientation, as all parallel lines converge to a single point regardless of their position.

This is not a parallel lines appearing to converge situation. Instead the lines intersect & then diverge. Essentially, from the player's perspective in external view, the line through the ship is tilted upwards at a shallow angle, while the line from the player's viewpoint through screen centre is horizontal. This can be verified by shooting while in external view - shots pass through screen centre & carry on towards the heading indicator.