XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

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donzi
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XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

Post by donzi »

TL;DR

So, a friend of mine finally bit the bullet and nabbed XR and X4 over at steam during the winter sale. I was playing X4 but since it had been a while since playing XR I decided to revisit so I could help my friend more confidently after he finally loaded up XR and got crash course done... I also had been always wanting to push something past my top played game hours (an Early Access game) and this was my chance!

Well as it turned out, my bud has no need for help since he’s still with the plot Rahanas CE without a full crew and worrying about how to change the skunk cockpit back to default last I heard. Anyhow, in the mean time, I have 17.5 days in, 10 stations (9 in DV) and ~1.3 billion credits AND comfortably past the previous high mark of hours played of that EA game.

My current game was a basic plot start on normal (or whatever default difficulty is called), vanilla XR without DLC active yet. I like to observe the base game action/reactions and play along a time line that unfolds DLC similar to how it would have been based on game vs. DLC release dates.

I like the challenges of DV system and it’s also relatively calm without Xen infestations. I also like it for resources matching AL which has a nice IN/OUT time. Too much distance from Wavy Haze jump beacon to gate for my taste and manual way points is a pain to use for more speed and/or dodging that nasty HV base between gate/beacon and Ratfish Waters.

In my haste and due to brain cramp, I glanced for some refresh of decent starter stations outside of DV.GT. Sadly I picked something off steam forums that was, well, wrong IMO. However, it has been a nice experience despite being worthless for cash production.. more later on that.

Realistically the plot station is reasonably profitable manually trading among AL during the initial grind process.


Also, I generally feed the HOA and ROC plot CV in DV.MA & DV.GT since I want the extra NPC population to choose from and whatever defenses they can muster for both player and NPC ships in the area. I also like the extra ROC BTO despite the limitations of the second one.

My placement selections here also reflects that I do not prefer my stations near jump beacons. Fundamental logic is I want my ships to boost away from the beacons as often as possible to get where they are going. The exception possibly will be Heartache Mist. My other consideration is to place stations where they can possibly help NPC survive more often and choke points like system and sector junctions.

Lastly, I have assigned ships with the underlying idea to sell/deliver from stations only, as best I can. Hence some of them do not fetch resources (aside from assigned mining ships) at all and some only have a Sucellus assigned to the DO. Also, at this point 4x small miners (2 bulk and 2 liquid) for station #5 seems fine. All station construction since #5 has been a breeze, the only thing I needed to do manully as send a lepton or sanahar to get force field projectors and turrets.


Here is the order of construction I used, and keep in mind that the second station I would have skipped since it remains still basically a EC churn without profits or losses.

1. DV Integrative URV Forge (plot) in DV.GT.1 - this I sometimes build in 42 to keep Gushing Spring a little less busy. This time around it’s in DV.GT.1. Until it’s able to send miners out of GT small miners can do okay. After that it’s a crap shoot. Pathing in/out of GT by small ships remains a bit of a headache.

2. AL Energy Array in AL.AS.5 (Buried Treasure). This without any trade ships just churns along without any shutdowns ever, but also never dumps excess credits to the player (or nags about needing money). Having a CE or E trader literrally made no differnece, so removed it some days after station went into operation.

Since I have developed DV as below, it reasonably easy to build Sucellus, which I like for their reasonably nimble navigating traits and the HVIMA or whatever BFG on it. I don’t recall anymore, but probably have made past notes on this here, but it’s amazing to watch from OOZ the Sucellus deal with Xenon K popping into that zone. It boosts back and forth and around the K or whatever and presumably just tearing it apart quickly without ever taking damage. The stations around are helping along with whatever NPC patrols at times, but it’s fun to watch anyhow.

3. AL Cell Fab in DV.BP.4 (Dim Flamelet) - preparations for further DV expansion mainly, although the additional NPC population and defenses are welcome.

4. AL URV Parts Supply in DV.BP.4 (Dim Flamelet) - put station #1 & #3 products to use and of course better drones for more cash and use. This is a nice helper for local system station building along with feeding ROC BTO, etc.

5. AL Construction Shop in DV.BP.3 (Flickering Flame) - further use of previous station products and of course RMP for even faster station building in the zone and profit universe wide.

6. AL Cell Recharge in DV.BP.1 (Crimson Rocks) - although I stopped using small/med ships the NPC use them and at some point I may implement more of them again if pathing can be influenced. This is the first station placed to try and protect NPC in addition to it’s obvious purpose.

7. AL Cell Recharge in DV.MA.4 (Extinct Torch) - additional protection for NPC and handy for refuel of any Sucellus produced at the BTO here.

8. AL Crystal Supply in DV.BP.1 (Crimson Rocks) - additional NPC help at choke point and more self supplied resources for existing infrastructure.

9. AL Cell Recharge in DV.BH.5 (Unmet Promise) - final DV sector refuel point and start of NPC choke point protection, NPC population, etc.

10. AL H20 Additives in DV.MA.2 (Gatekeeper’s House) - this location is specifically to test later if I can get small ships to use the sector highway here instead their usual path to from MA to GT by going through the highway at Extinct Torch, through Fell Affliction. I doubt it will work since the game is probably going to want the shortest path, but.. maybe I’ll be surprised. I led small ships I wanted to park in GT to DV.BP through this highway then let them go on themselves to GT from there a few times in the past, so hoping proximity to this highway may make a difference if I assign small ships to this station. Experiment only, combined with my desire to not have stations close to jump beacons.

In regard to this latest station, I also was hoping to coax it to selling ice to the NPC water station, again. (RE: viewtopic.php?f=127&t=389176 )
Idea is not profit or selling water or ice as much as trying to keep NPC faction trade moving along here. The RoC miners here are unable to provide ice locally so far. Patrol ships in Lava Flow are hit/miss at best trying to keep NPC or my own mining ships from fleeing too much. At this point, ice is pushing max storage at the station #10 and I restricted water sales and am trying to fill that up to see if maybe that might trigger ice sales on the trade list.

It seems that the most obvious option is to activate the TO DLC so I can build a warehouse... but those have there issues too and I am not ready to deal with some of those Wavy Haze like routes yet.

It sure would be nice if the stations in XR could have a foundation only stage of construction. Hence not have a default production line as part of initial construction. While that may not help sell ice here, IMO the game never should have forced a particular production as part of the base construction for perhaps anything other than single product production stations. (cell recharge, ec array, etc)

Anyhow, there it is. Gist of my game at present. I know having all those hours in the game doesn’t mean much, but within that time I remember a bit of game nuances and some methodology that served me well with the sandbox.

I will likely keep going on XR for a bit now, but my X4 game was put on hold to refresh my memory of XR to help my friend with his game. I can probably help now if needed, but it doesn’t take too long to replace GUI manipulation memory muscle and I’ll be thinking X4 KB+Mouse things again instead.

..and, if you read this far, maybe you can confirm something?

I read all the changelogs again and it reads as if NPC on stations can be killed with station attacks.. So, trade offers from NPC stations and hired NPC on owned stations, etc can vanish just as if they were on a ship that is destroyed?

Finally, there are probably some details I forgot to mention or methods I use which I didn't think of at this writing. Feel free to expand on this thread. I never know how long I'll be playing and visiting the forum, should be a bit longer but US income tax coming due fast. Going to have to quit playing sometime in the next several weeks. :gruebel:
rudi_pioneer
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Re: XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

Post by rudi_pioneer »

Thank you for posting this! Relatively new to X:R, and want to do one significant game before back to X4, and this gives me some ideas
donzi
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Re: XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

Post by donzi »

My pleasure rudi.

There is so much to X games to digest and it seems familiar to me playing it again fairly quickly, but it's always like brand new too in some ways.

Some of that which I mentioned about the h20 Additives Fac and the ice/water situation in DV, I uncovered a bit about that I think.. probably again, seemed to be familiar when it was all said and done.

I suggest not building the #10 station under normal circumstances. The testing I did recently, basically matched what the old thread covered.

I trade restricted water sales then let the ice max out once it filled the station liquid storage. During that time it sold ice twice that I saw. The first was enough for a cocktail, ~128 units of ice. The second time I noticed ice for sale, the offer was for like 1330 units. After each sale, the trade offers were removed despite the water full and the ice pushing/reaching max. Not a reasonable way to sell ice to NPC. Seems the only way would be manually, or with a miner/trade mod or activating the TO DLC and trying to do it with a warehouse.

However... :D

I did notice a RoC Onil before all this testing and building of the h20 Additives Fac. It had no drones and was pacing between Vapor Stream and Lava Flow, staying only a couple/few minutes at each zone. I assume that is because it was unable to activate the mining job.

I removed my protective ships from Lava Flow thinking the Onil might get blown up and maybe RoC would replace it. After a day or so, it was still there, apparently safe since it boosts off so quickly from each visit to each of those zone.. back and forth, constantly.

Today I decided to edit in some drones for it to allow it to do what it seemed it was supposed to do.. provide ice.

The result was a bit unexpected at first, but it started mining and then head off to Furnace Chamber to sell the ice. So far so good. However, once it sold the ice it went AWOL. hehe. After undocking the Onil went 'calculating parameters' and then went into explorer mode and jumped into a black hole. Removed from the game.

My assumption is that this ship was part of the HOA + RoC mining / exploration of GT.MA of the plot. It apparently isn't intended to become a lame duck like it was, but probably just was part of the show and happened to survive the ordeal... or something.

It appears that once that ship completed it's shift into the void, RoC put in the functional RoC Onil which had a reasonable compliment of drones -- 27 cargolifter, 2 construction and 23 surface miner Mk1. I'm almost certain this functional Onil was spawned/built only after the lame Onil was able complete it's 'job' and kick into explorer mode.

Furnace chamber had basically shutdown for lack of ice. Fairly sure 1 Onil could keep DV limping along with water as long as RoC replaces it if/when it were to be destroyed. I'll be observing that as I go, I explect DV is supposed to keep their core food/energy economy going by itself.

UPDATE: .. :( I noticed the Onil is back to pacing between Vapor Stream and Lava Flow without any of the drones it had. Same crew names on the Onil so.. I can't imagine how it could just loose all drones so I guess it's just the way it's supposed to be for some crazy reason. Might dig into the scripts and look for an explanation but my final wild guess is that RoC is supposed to be broken.

My H20 Additives Fac is basically shut down. I use it for NPC harvesting sometimes but at this point it really just was a loss of time constructing it. Maybe I will expand on water consumption the DV side of things later but for now just keeping it restricted to see how their core business fares without buying my water.
Last edited by donzi on Sun, 3. Mar 24, 17:59, edited 1 time in total.
rudi_pioneer
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Re: XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

Post by rudi_pioneer »

I have a soft spot for DV, so it’s lots of fun reading your adventures there. Currently I have few stations in OL and HL since I was worried building in DV would result in running out of construction materials, but plan to revisit DV at some point.
donzi
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Joined: Mon, 12. Feb 07, 14:29
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Re: XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

Post by donzi »

It was initially a bit of work (trade in/out of AL) grounded in DV for a time but doing the campaign start, the Integrative URV Forge is a huge bonus along with the simple Titurel captures.

LI tech stations in AL make it possible, particularly while PMC is hostile if doing the plot.

Since there is so many things to do waiting on long trades isn't too bad. I still get frustrated sometimes with the OL beacon to gate trip in Wavy Haze, so mainly just do internal OL trade deals to help out their NPC traders and rep gain... or sell off large qty of drones from my own stations.

I have since built an Arm Tech Supply and a Techno-Complex in DV. Pretty much a huge bite with both of those. Lots of BOW required for the Tech Supply, and wow, it's got serious defenses. I am maxing all my stations just for kicks, but it's kind of silly in DV since I don't recall it organically having enemy outside of REI.

..but will be nice for reference when I actually build in AL and elsewhere. At this point I have a internal source of most all AL construction materials just waiting to be used as desired or for cash. Still above 1 billion in cash and selling excess products and trimming manager budgets can cure any additional cash needs. Kind of at that point where it's more work to spend the cash.

Fully equipped Sucellus are ~27MM and with the stations I've got that can feed the BTO, I often have no problem now getting capitol ships queued at the 2 RoC BTO. A bunch of IHC is kind of like portable HIVI iirc.

At some point going to take a handful of Sucellus out for station bashing. At this point though I have 12 of them, each doing a station protect and 1 sweeping an undeveloped zone somewhere.

Going to keep focus on the DV/AL resources for a while yet I think while I [re]think how to approach the AL - OL - MA gap and Maelstrom development this time around.. and perhaps until I activate one or both DLC to refresh what sort of route changes that entails.
rudi_pioneer
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Re: XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

Post by rudi_pioneer »

Wish game had permanent way to destroy stations like X4. Maelstrom you mentioned would be awesome minus the xenon in the back. Cold star is also mostly empty but has xenon and pirate presence too
donzi
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Re: XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

Post by donzi »

You're right, it would be great to be able to use NPC station locations and inhabit inner Maelstrom. I'd like to see how that spiral highway played with a ton of small/medium ships. :D

I guess it's best how it is due to the prefab stations and the way zones are. It's frustrating sometimes the way adjacent zones can bleed into one another.

I prefer the other X games station building format most, but the prefabs in XR look very nice and are interesting inside.
magitsu
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Re: XR revisit and ramblings after 2900+ hours

Post by magitsu »

Nice to hear people still appreciating the XR experience. The campaign is good and the sights alomg the way even better.

If you want to see how pre-X4 attempt in trying to get economy properly simulated looks like, try CWIR New Frontier. It even has two options, simplified ship production with ship parts, or with multiple wares. It also has salvage gameplay with 2 salvage ships (Remakron being the bigger one), partly better than X4 Tides of Avarice, but cheaty if you allow yourself too many free ships (instead of rng it change gets to 100% with 100+ build drones). You can even take over stations with marines once they have been lowered to around 20% strength. Even Xenon if I remember right... But Pirate and Xenon capital behavior is quite poor - they suicide against station defenses too often. Targon Tracers op. Partly its due to the jump behavior, and it's interesting to think about it against X4 which moved away from it to travel drives.

Though I guess X3 Mayhem is another attempt at properly simulating the economy.
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