Feedback X4 Presentation

[iuiz]

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice.... - Just saying

[Skeeter]

Anyone notice the hit effects are still the same from past x games as in a bit ugly and too big and flash bangs. I had hoped they would be smaller and less flashy if u know what I mean and more like shield hit effects from say something like star trek when a phaser hits a shield facing. Mainly referring to when in the vid there's this ship from external view getting pounded all over and it just looks wrong and bad hit effects as it looks like fireworks all over ship. Making it a fireworks show over the ship. Would look cooler being under attack if half the effects went there, smaller and a different hit effect graphic, IMO.

https://youtu.be/FuIeKMYaIAk

About the 39/40 second mark. Is what I'm referring to BTW.

Just a let peeve I've had on these for along time. Same as explosion effects, never looked right but had improved a bit in xr.

Could be weapon used doing them certain hit effects compared to others but I still don't like that particular effect it causes. As if u wana watch ships being shot at in a screenie it doesn't look good.

[Zenon104]

I'm back after long hiding for more testing

The Management/Map stuff looks awesome.

The fact they going back to some of X3 is a good sign.

[longshooterm]

Anyone have a link to the vod of the stream?

[rulerofallcheese]

I'm optimistic that since X4 uses similar tech to Rebirth, it won't be hamstrung as severely by technical problems at release.

I'm glad it's not Rebirth, but I'm also glad it's taking some new approaches rather than trying to carbon copy X3, which is a fantastic game that I'll always be happy to go back to. Anyway thanks for a great presentation guys, X4 is looking good and I'm excited to see what you will do with it.

There's no way this will have the same problems X Rebirth did at launch. First of all, X Rebirth was completely built from the ground up and they didn't have years of patches and community feedback to tap into. X4 should be able to benefit from those earlier fixes on day 1. That being said, I'm still hopeful the game will make it to early access, although I would totally understand if Egosoft wanted to work out all the kinks in a closed beta to avoid the backlash the last game had.

[Ketraar]

Anyone have a link to the vod of the stream?

DNA recorded the EN one, but sound is a bit low

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T10iR69-PqQ

The German version in on their Twitch Channel

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/169959696

MFG

Ketraar

[Killjaeden]

And hello KJ

Hey man *brofist*

From a gameplay aspect this seems like its in a very good direction. Art style i'm not too excited. And i really doubt they are going to overhaul the models they already have massively. But at least the colors at least would be something they should be able to adjust without too much fuss.

[BlackRain]

Pretty sure it is egosoft that determines what is 'X4' and what is 'X Rebirth 2'.

This is hilariously wrong.

Egosoft can aim for what they think is X4 but the consumers decide whether or not they hit that mark.

In the same way that X:R was billed as the 'next' X series game, almost no one bought it post-launch. I think as a community, we have stopped trusting EGO when they make claims like that. This is why we are all asking very specific questions during the stream.

What's hilarious is your misconception on what 'opinion' and 'reality' are.

Egosoft is the developer and what they deem to be 'X4' will in fact be X4. Whether you, or others, like the game is irrelevant.

You can choose to buy it, you can choose to dislike it, hate it, whatever you want. You saying 'This is not X4' is what is laughable because that is not determined by you.

And once again, a person presents an argument based entirely on emotions without a shred of logic. You hated X Rebirth so now you are bringing your hatred to a new product. Where is your argument with facts showing how the game is more similar to X rebirth than X 3? No where to be found, instead just another knee jerk response and wide ranging condemnation based on your own opinion.

Out of all the things I typed in my post, you decided to nitpick the only part of my post which you felt you could express an emotional outburst about. You didn't touch on a single point that I made.

Now, if you want to say that the new X 4, doesn't have enough of the features that you liked from X3, that would actually be a real argument. However, you would need to present the facts and reasons for such an argument. This is the exact reason for the post I made, because I do not agree with that position.

[Observe]

Personally, I'm disappointed highways are staying, because I always thought highways gave Rebirth an arcade game feel to it. Not a "real" space game.

Was anything said about improved AI or collision detection/avoidance? Those are two areas sorely lacking or non-existent in Rebirth.

I noticed one of the smaller ships madly shacking/vibrating the way they do in Rebirth and the pathing for the smaller ships was real jerky. Once again, the arcade game feel.

Hopefully they can improve those things in the new game. If not, in spite of multiple ship piloting and a few other improvements, I can't see myself getting into X4 with much enthusiasm.

[Sandalpocalypse]

that's a weird criticism. it's x2/x3 where collision planning is literally missing entirely, except for last ditch collision sphere avoidance. xR pilots can fly in amongst station geometry and low down to capital ships with a relative minimum of banging around.

[Observe]

that's a weird criticism. it's x2/x3 where collision planning is literally missing entirely, except for last ditch collision sphere avoidance. xR pilots can fly in amongst station geometry and low down to capital ships with a relative minimum of banging around.

I respectfully disagree. Within minutes of starting an XR game, I see big ships colliding and passing through each other (no collision detection and no collision avoidance), smaller ships bouncing insanely against large objects (Cap ships and stations) etc. XR has collision detection turned off completely in many situations and avoidance is also not very good to non-existent.

Regardless of X2/X3 comparison, collision detection and avoidance are two areas that definitely need major improvement. I know, easier said than done, but there must be a way....

[Ricemanu]

that's a weird criticism. it's x2/x3 where collision planning is literally missing entirely, except for last ditch collision sphere avoidance. xR pilots can fly in amongst station geometry and low down to capital ships with a relative minimum of banging around.

I respectfully disagree. Within minutes of starting an XR game, I see big ships colliding and passing through each other (no collision detection and no collision avoidance), smaller ships bouncing insanely against large objects (Cap ships and stations) etc. XR has collision detection turned off completely in many situations and avoidance is also not very good to non-existent.

Regardless of X2/X3 comparison, collision detection and avoidance are two areas that definitely need major improvement. I know, easier said than done, but there must be a way....

Yes, Bernd specifically mentioned the complexities and difficulties of this, especially in regards to the new stations that can become very complex again, since they are player designed.

[siddham]

Hi Egosoft
Excited for X4 - but....

Please do not make X4 a reboot of XRebirth

Stay focus on what the X games are really about

Please do not waste resources on bs like walking between ships
No one will use that more than once....total waste of time......like walking around the stations in XR....waste of time
That is not what the X games are about

Focus resources on the important mechanics players use all the time...
the economy; the universe artificial life; combat and missions etc

Please do not have the ships designed by artists...
Get some technical people who understand science and technology and engineering etc and who can design credible hardware

And please, please have an adult write the main story

[Triaxx2]

I understand your reasoning, but you always want to expand freedom, rather than restricting it. Don't like it, don't use it. But some people will, just because it looks cool, and because there are people who roleplay.

As for being a Rebirth Reboot, it's in the same engine, so no reason not to reuse some things, but Rebirth was supposed to be a new start in the series, so might as well move forward rather than back.

What story? I will agree, the games aren't about the story. It's all about the world.

[Loltak]

I like what I saw A lot of promising thing / game-play possibilities ...
I like XR so for me it's a good start for the new one, however there was some frustrating point; some seems to be better like the map and its features.
An more dynamic and real universe, that cool.

I'm eager to see more!

[Scoob]

Like Observe I too would like to see ships be a bit more aware of their surroundings, so proper course plotting based on what's known - i.e don't try to fly through a station that's never going to move out of the way - and avoidance when necessary.

X games have never been very good at this, however, I recall a mod for the original X3 I think it was (never ported to TC and AP) that gave us the Fight Command MK3 software IIRC. This upgrade made ships very spatially aware, so much so that nimble fighters would readily avoid shots from slower weapons entirely. If this could be done by a mod in X3, I do wonder why it never appeared in later iterations.

So, yes, no large ships clipping through stations they have no business being anywhere near in the first place, and no clipping through each other either. Small, nimble ships able to dodge slower "bullets", maybe given a good enough pilot. Basically some more I in AI

Also, while the graphics look good, with a special nod to the fine details like retractable landing gear, it looks like we're not going to see "proper" shields effects this time either. I really LOVE space games where ships are surrounded by a bubble type shield, which become visible when hit. Looks totally cool and give an at a glance indication of a ships shield status, I think "health bars" are a bit cheap.

I recall my very first mod for Rebirth was hull shields for Capital Ships, however, someone beat me to it releasing something very similar just as I was testing mine. I was a bit saddened by the fact that I couldn't get the "shield hit" effect that the smaller surface element shields had.

Scoob.

[elexis]

This is more of a feedback for the stream itself, rather than its content.

Next time you do a stream, please support more than 1 bitrate/quality option. 1080p@60 is great, except when your internet can't handle it. Luckily for me I had a friend who was able to re-stream the presentation on his own twitch account at a much lower bitrate so that I could watch it (I could only handle about 4800kbps).

A quick look at the twich chat also showed several people were getting intermittent paused streams, which shows that even people who aren't on peasant internet like me were occasionally struggling.

tl:dr Please provide an additional 720p@30 quality setting next time.

[Santi]

Regarding ship design, what looked odd to me was the surface elements, the hulls and general shape was very good. I believe it is the price to pay for customisation, it is not the same designing ships that will not change over the game compared to ones where you can fit different weapons, engines, shields etc.

Obviously it is Alpha as well, but any structure that you can alter and is going to change it graphically, it is going to have some kind of lego feel to it.

[kolimbo]

What's hilarious is your misconception on what 'opinion' and 'reality' are.

Egosoft is the developer and what they deem to be 'X4' will in fact be X4.

In the same way that Sega called all of the ****** sonic sequels 'sonic' and the same way that the panchinko for MGS is the next 'MGS' ?

Are you so deluded to not be able to distinguish from marketing and reality?

What the company WANT is just that, a desire or a facsimile. EGO can draw a penis on a chalkboard and call it X5, but that doesn't make it so. You are basing your argument entirely on the fact that ownership grants legitimacy and is thus unreprochable and unquestionable. This is such an elementary logic fallacy that I'm shocked that you had the gall to call my post 'emotional'.

[BlackRain]

There is no point in trying to have an argument with you. I will let you continue to embarrass yourself.

I mean seriously, your best example to support your argument was using an example of a Pachinko game being called an MGS sequel, seriously, how ridiculous of an argument is that. They aren't even the same things, but let's just all pull out of our #@! the most pointless and irrelevant example we can think of!