[MOD] Variety and Rebalance Overhaul (VRO) 4.x

[Shuulo]

My only problem now is that vanilla X4 now seems like a trash!

Some people still prefer vanilla, it's a taste thing.
Anyway, happy you liking the mod, 2 years of constant patches and tweaking went into it to make ship and weapon balance, behaviour and progression feel "right".
You will need to re-learn few things though as combat and balance are drastically different from vanilla.

As for SVE mod, it's made and balanced by other people , while it has VRO version it's also a taste thing, from my perspective it has quite few OP ships that make some other ships obsolete and this goes against VRO principle of "choice" when there is no single best ship but each has its own strength and weaknesses, same for weapons. Base VRO mod has frigates and battleships as well. I personally play without SVE, but it's still a fine addition for those who want even more ships and are not such balance maniacs like myself

[mr.WHO]

My only problem now is that vanilla X4 now seems like a trash!

As for SVE mod, it's made and balanced by other people , while it has VRO version it's also a taste thing, from my perspective it has quite few OP ships that make some other ships obsolete and this goes against VRO principle of "choice" when there is no single best ship but each has its own strength and weaknesses, same for weapons. Base VRO mod has frigates and battleships as well. I personally play without SVE, but it's still a fine addition for those who want even more ships and are not such balance maniacs like myself

I also just added "XR Ship Pack VRO" into to th mix with SVE
It now the entire package blew my mind with the amount of ship options.

I agree that some ships might be OP (especially that I found VRO frigate size ships most charming) or duplicated or obsolete, but now with the tons of different ships the universe seems alive and interesting and I have to learn and experience all these ships.
No longer the boring copy/paste destroyer swarm of vanilla.

I noticed that Terran cruiser mod plan to add cruisers to other races as well, so more variety!



P.S. In regards to VRO directly, I wonder if it's possible to include more detailed class tag (like Light, Heavy)?
Like I noticed there are Heavy Battleships and Light battleships...so many battleships that I'm a bit confused.

Kinda sometinng liek that is planned for Cruiser mod where there is Light, Heavy, Battle and Command cruisers.

[Shuulo]

Base VRO has only one battleship per faction, they are all different and there are no light and heavy battleships. Those others come from ship mods and not always follow VRO's idea for a battleship.
XR ship pack - be warned that it does change more than it says, e g. it changes some xenon jobs and shipgroups in a bit weird way and adds a ton more xenon ships in the universe, this breaks factions balance sometimes and may lead to stagnated resource-lacking galaxy in a day or two, you were warned.

[mr.WHO]

Base VRO has only one battleship per faction, they are all different and there are no light and heavy battleships. Those others come from ship mods and not always follow VRO's idea for a battleship.

Yeah, guess I'll stay silent in regards to ballance because it's now a bit hard to tell which thing is VRO and which is SVE.


One thing in regards to SVE - first, by accident I installed non-VRO version, which has "Viper destroyer" that has somewhat better looking model than VRO "Viper frigate" - like SVE ship model use paint job compactibile texture, while VRO Viper frigate seems to always be purple in ship screen.

Would it be possible to swap the Viper frigate model for SVE one (or at least the texture)?
https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com/mo ... 67742.jpeg

XR ship pack - be warned that it does change more than it says, e g. it changes some xenon jobs and shipgroups in a bit weird way and adds a ton more xenon ships in the universe, this breaks factions balance sometimes and may lead to stagnated resource-lacking galaxy in a day or two, you were warned.

Given that I don't want long term play and more of a combat/chaos gameplay...this seems like an endorsement for me

[Scarlet Ashcroft]

The VRO wiki classifies the Chiba light carrier as a frigate. However, ingame it does not seem to meet the classification of frigate for the purposes of completing the 'assemble fleet' missions. This leaves Terran only players unable to complete these missions without sourcing ships from other races. Heavy fighters also don't seem to count as fighters for this.(Unsure if that one is intentional or not.) Any chance the code can get tweaked in the short term to fix this issue? Or perhaps long term, introduce a new frigate.

[Shuulo]

The VRO wiki classifies the Chiba light carrier as a frigate. However, ingame it does not seem to meet the classification of frigate for the purposes of completing the 'assemble fleet' missions. This leaves Terran only players unable to complete these missions without sourcing ships from other races. Heavy fighters also don't seem to count as fighters for this.(Unsure if that one is intentional or not.) Any chance the code can get tweaked in the short term to fix this issue? Or perhaps long term, introduce a new frigate.

Next version will have new frigate. Chiba cannot be reclassified as it will loose carrier functionality, its tied to the ship type.
Heavy fighters are not fighters, its the same in vanilla.

[Scarlet Ashcroft]

Next version will have new frigate. Chiba cannot be reclassified as it will loose carrier functionality, its tied to the ship type.
Heavy fighters are not fighters, its the same in vanilla.

Good to know. Thank you.

[Todesgleiter]

Does this mean the Chiba get's replaced with another ship, or just that a new ship (propably from the Terran Cruisers mod) is added alongside it?
Excuse my dumb question but i plan on buying a Chiba as a cheap carrier to acompany my destroyer and don't want it gone in the next update...

[Shuulo]

Why should I remove Chiba? It'll be new ship, the weakest from terran cruisers line

[mr.WHO]

IMO the Chiba was on the weaker part of kitbashing, so I'm glad that the model will be replaced by cruiser mod.

[Todesgleiter]

Why should I remove Chiba? It'll be new ship, the weakest from terran cruisers line

I don't know why you should remove the Chiba cause i don't know your plans for VRO. I'm glad to hear that ist will stay thanks for the Info!
And btw. great mod! Can't imagine playing withaut it realy. X4 is a great game but lacks somehow in the diversity departement, something VRO fixes very well.

[Shuulo]

Why should I remove Chiba? It'll be new ship, the weakest from terran cruisers line

I don't know why you should remove the Chiba cause i don't know your plans for VRO. I'm glad to hear that ist will stay thanks for the Info!
And btw. great mod! Can't imagine playing withaut it realy. X4 is a great game but lacks somehow in the diversity departement, something VRO fixes very well.

Thanks

IMO the Chiba was on the weaker part of kitbashing, so I'm glad that the model will be replaced by cruiser mod.

It wont be removed or replaced, itll remain as is.

[mr.WHO]

It wont be removed or replaced, itll remain as is.

Why should I remove Chiba? It'll be new ship, the weakest from terran cruisers line

Ahh, that line was confusing, so current Chiba will be put along new cruisers, not replaced by them?

[Shuulo]

yes, they have different roles, Chiba is a light carrier

[mr.WHO]

The more I look, the more impressed I am by terran cruisers.

They have rather simple model but somehow it goes very well as design between X3 and X4 ships:
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ ... D7003552D/

I wonder what will they make for non-Terran cruisers.

[mr.WHO]

I se you already have an eye for SDP Tritor:
https://steamcommunity.com/workshop/fil ... 2637879265

[mr.WHO]

"Powered beam L turrets can be equipped by Carriers and in limited number by Battleships (not available for Split battleship and carrier) and in case for Terrans - on their destroyers as well."


Where I can find 'powered beam turrets", especially for Terrans?

I tried to create a ship in custom game start, but can't find them anywhere (I've cheked various races carriers and mentioned Terran destroyers).

I have only installed VRO X-Tra ship packs and SVE

[Todesgleiter]

I don't think Terrans have acces to these "Powered Beam Turrets" since the Tokyo has no "L" turrets (or is this changed in VRO? Don't have a Tokyo myself yet) and the Asgard already has a pretty powerfull beam weapon.

Btw. i have a question/request regarding weapons, especially Terran weapons. Is there any Chance to convince you to add additional weapons for the Terrans/Segari since they are quite limited if you want to play a purist (like myself)? Specifically i wanted to request a "M" version of the EMP cannon since i like it on Fighters as a sort of heavy allrounder. Could be fitting in between the existing light and heavy weapons. (More firerate and projektile speed than the graviton thing but less Firepower and maybe range to balance it out).
Also a "M" turret Version of the EMP's would be nice to have. The Meson turrets do good work as a "heavy" Terran m Turret but i am shure it woul be possible to fit an additionall heavy turret in without destroying the balance since everyone else also has multiple "heavy" m turrets availabe.
Last but not least i also wandted to request a "m" turret version of the starbust shockwave cannon since "l" slots are kinda sparce. To sparce to "sacrifice" them for a pure anti fighter weapon in my opinion. (at least on single ships in fleets this is a different matter)

Thanks in advance for atleast considering it

[Malchar]

To stay on L turrets subject.

VRO include ''Battleships". However Egosoft tend to practice the overbidding.

Now the 195 tons destroyers have more firepower, (and more large turrets) than battleship included in the mod. Some may say it exists other mods compatible with VRO to add ships, especially battleships. In this case it makes those included in VRO more or less useless.

What should be the solution ?

1) It works like that, dont change anything ?
2) Update hold VRO battleship to new standard ?
3) remove them ?
4) Anyway nobody care everybody play exclusively terrans now.

[Shuulo]

the only ship with more firepower than battleship in vanilla is Syn, and in VRO it has much worse defense and is slower than any battleship, and is expensive as other factions battleships.
Dont see any problem in the balance.