Features from X3 you wish were in X4

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Flippi
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Flippi » Sun, 14. Nov 21, 18:56

I think the solution is to have more fleets, not the JD, imho ...
Depending on how big X4 gets, that might not be feasible. X3 was rather big at the end, so more fleets probably wouldn't solve much.

But anyway, what feature we really need back, is CODEA or something along those lines. I know, it's not vanilla, and X4 did improve carriers. But the difference between a fighter squadron that actually fights together and carrier that can do things like sending patrols and escorts automatically is much dfiferent from the current carrier gameplay.

Also, maybe the Tractor beam could make a return. In case a freshly acquired ship got shot up and needed some tugging.

Also also, Borons.
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Axeface
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Axeface » Mon, 15. Nov 21, 02:35

Did I say we need the Boron?

Diroc
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Diroc » Tue, 16. Nov 21, 06:32

1 ) I'd like to see a return of the Unfocused Jumpdrive. (At least for fighters)
Dump the ship out at random anomalies (functionality similar to entering one now). 80+% shield cost maybe. Enough remaining for a boost and some slight protection if you are dropped into a hostile environment.
Research mission after entering an anomaly?

2 ) Personal sector (Terraforming mission)
Additional hostile sectors not connected to the main system. UFJD only access with anomaly (exit only) and UFJD option.
Terraforming mission to reconnect the sector (or chain of sectors) inactive gate to an inactive in-game gate after discovery of an inactive gate in the remote system.
A big fight for control of the sector with the Xenon (optionally from multiple sectors with productive shipyards if you can pull in docked Cap ships with HQ) or a dozen K's and an I for a single sector. (Plus fighters) if you have to clear the sector with just a fighter prior to being able to teleport in your HQ.
Return of the "Personal Sector idea from X3" via control of access through the new gate. Personal faction only. Gates only temporarily active when your ships use them or alternatively, with a UI that allows you to select which factions and ship classes can use it.
A default rename of the sector based on gamestart player character name. <Name>'s Jewel, <Name>'s Conquest, <Name>'s Victory or something similar by default would be nice.

3 ) Boron
Requirements:
An expansion likely.

4 ) System Override Software
Would be nice to be able to hack ship data leaks while piloting a ship, Maybe increase range a bit to get the data leaks buried in a station (Yes, they still exist despite being much more rare)

5 ) Cargo Bay Shielding (Reduce the chance of a successful scan)

6 ) Marine Training Barracks
Perhaps a Military Training ship with increased skill gain on the crew would be easiest implementation.
Active defense drone cloud while training pilots perhaps?
Active repair drones based on Service crew enrolled.
Regular launching boarding pods. (Self targeted) based on marines enrolled.

7 ) PSG (Phased Shockwave Generator) type Anti-fighter turrets. Good range but Inverse square damage based on range would be nice particularly for anti-missile.

8 ) Monitor window Top right similar to X3. (Perhaps with limited in system high attention focus around the selected item.)

9 ) Video Enhancement Goggles.

10 ) BoFu (Boso Ta has been complaining about the Chelt and Maja Snail diet as of late.)

Some of these would be easy to implement. Some not so much. Most, I believe are doable.
X4 is not X3 though I do miss some of the features and challenges.

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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Ormac » Tue, 16. Nov 21, 07:18

Map Information Services just to sell information on sectors (unexplored with connections or mapped with the important stations [Shipyard/Wharf/EQ Dock/Trade Station])
Target Monitor

rubahax4
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by rubahax4 » Tue, 16. Nov 21, 07:51

Manually controlling the turret would be fun.
Dynamic diplomacy will add interest.
Aggressive Xenon will transform X4 from construction sim to space action thriller.
Realistic early game, where you can't find a team without a reputation, where they don't give the headquarters as a gift.
Construction of mining stations on large asteroids.
Rocket mechanics.

Lord Crc
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Lord Crc » Wed, 17. Nov 21, 05:37

I really miss the monitor windows. Not only was it fun / interesting to view a different perspective, but it was also very nice when issuing quick orders to a selected craft.

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mr.WHO
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by mr.WHO » Wed, 17. Nov 21, 08:08

Ability to buy/obtain different style HQ.

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spankahontis
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by spankahontis » Wed, 17. Nov 21, 18:49

mr.WHO wrote:
Sat, 13. Nov 21, 13:19

That seem like a resonable approach to JD.
Albeit I'd not put jump modules on S/M ships -they are too small, all modules on them are understroyable and it would make carriers and ships with landing pads more useful (return of TM class?).
Still, like in X-Rebirth, jumpdrive range should be limited to within single star system - jumping through entire galaxy (even friendly) is way too OP - for fast player movement we already have teleportation, so there in no need for galaxy wide JD.
What I feel needs to be avoided.
The War Mechanics works cause the AI can't cheat like teleporting it's ships behind Enemy Lines.. If it followed X3's dynamic? It be a cluster **** of attacks and no tactics other than surprise attacks of an enemy region while it's main defence fleet is on the border being pulled in every direction.

I agree with the carriers, that would give them a purpose to jump into the fight and perhaps make jumpgates less busy with fighters.
Flippi wrote:
Sat, 13. Nov 21, 13:59
Jump beacons should not be station modules, period. Stations are already tough nuts to crack. No need to turn them into OP fleet bases either. They should not be buildable by the player either. If beacons have to exist in X4, they need to be as rare as they were in X3 AP. Anything else would be ridiculous.
They should be designed in a way that they are NOT fortresses, that's what Defence/Administration Stations are for.
And I agree that they shouldn't be bullet sponges either, just low HP structures that need allot of resources to build so they need to be strategically placed where enemy ships would have difficulty reaching them.

Why I'm against the Beacons? They can be planted like satellites.. that CAN be overused, also they need to be limited so that the only beacons that you can use would have to belong to allies and your own.
That you shouldn't be able to just teleport into the Heart of Xenon Space with a mega fleet and take out their Shipyards/Wharfs? It would seriously disrupt any tactics the AI Factions have which are already limited in scope.
Bare in Mind also that each Jump Module can house only 1 Large Ship (Agree with Mr. Who that only large ships should have access to it.).
So if there is 1 Module? Then it is 1 Large Ship at a time so it can't be abused simply because time is a MAJOR Factor in the fight and if a giant Xenon Fleet enters the Sector, time is of the essence to get as many large ships to the frontline as possible.
But also.. like Defense Stations adding more defense modules over time, these Jump Stations can have more Jump Modules added over time.

Also, another factor into why ity can't be abused. It'll be more than just Battleships that'll be using these; large Freighters and Miners as well so for those that can't get on one of these modules? Their pathfinding will redirect them to the next sector.
So personally I don't agree that the module system of jumping can be OP'ed. Beacons however? They can be abused, which is why i'm against the X:Rebirth method of jumping with Beacons.
It also makes it so you can't fast travel to the other side of the galaxy, you have to develop the economy to build the infrastructure in order to make the Universe more accessible.

And it's like you said, the X4 Universe is only going to get bigger each expansion that it'll be bigger than X3 eventually.
So Infrastructure to try and make it faster to reach your destination requires allot or resources and requirements to be fulfilled. Plus War can seriously set back the project if such modules get hit by Xenon attacks or by any other enemy Faction trying to slow your advance down.
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Flippi
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Flippi » Wed, 17. Nov 21, 20:33

They should be designed in a way that they are NOT fortresses, that's what Defence/Administration Stations are for.
And I agree that they shouldn't be bullet sponges either, just low HP structures that need allot of resources to build so they need to be strategically placed where enemy ships would have difficulty reaching them.
Stations can be built to ridiculous sizes. The probelm with Jump modules is, that nothing prevents players to add hundreds of defence modules on their stations in addition to the jump modules. Any ship that would dare getting close to such a thing would be vaporised. There is no system in place currently, that makes this and either/or choice. At least to my knowledge. You can have both at the same time. That's why any jump beacon technology should never ever be a station module of any kind. Regardless if the modules themselves can be destroyed easily.
also they need to be limited so that the only beacons that you can use would have to belong to allies and your own.
That was always the case in AP and I think FL. You had to have good reputation with the factions involved if you wanted to use them. Granted, there were more reputation levels than in X4, and maybe jumb beacon access was a bit too low level, but it was still a thing.
That you shouldn't be able to just teleport into the Heart of Xenon Space with a mega fleet and take out their Shipyards/Wharfs?
AP balanced beacons quite well. You couldn't buy them, and you couldn't build them (in vanilla). The only way to get them was hunting down the Rapid response fleet ships (which we may need in X4 too anyway). And even then you only got maybe one of those if you successfully boarded them. In X3, that meant a lot of money and time investment for the player, as it was not easy to board ships, unlike in X4 now.

Additionally, the AI in X3 loved to actually target and destroy deployables of any kind. Even the mosic basic drone could destroy a beacon easily. So planting down a beacon in hostile space meant you most likely would lose it. And losing a beacon in X3 AP was much more devastating than anything else. There was no replacement for them, unless you wanted to go through the tedious boarding process again (which was also heavily RNG based).
Bare in Mind also that each Jump Module can house only 1 Large Ship (Agree with Mr. Who that only large ships should have access to it.).
So if there is 1 Module? Then it is 1 Large Ship at a time so it can't be abused simply because time is a MAJOR Factor in the fight and if a giant Xenon Fleet enters the Sector, time is of the essence to get as many large ships to the frontline as possible.
But also.. like Defense Stations adding more defense modules over time, these Jump Stations can have more Jump Modules added over time.
If players can buy / build something, they will absolutely go ham with it. Your arbitrary numbers just can't match the sheer ridiculousness of player production once it gets up and running. Your solution to limit jump beacons wouldn't be helpful that much, as it just makes scaling up take a bit longer.

The X3 AP approach stays as the best solution possible when it comes to beacons. No buying, no building. Go and try get them with your highly expensive marines, fighting some of the most annyoying ships, just to even have the chance of getting a single beacon. And if you succeed, you get a very powerful, but also extremely fragile item. Which you'd want to protect at all cost. That is a fair trade off if you ask me.
And it's like you said, the X4 Universe is only going to get bigger each expansion that it'll be bigger than X3 eventually.
So Infrastructure to try and make it faster to reach your destination requires allot or resources and requirements to be fulfilled. Plus War can seriously set back the project if such modules get hit by Xenon attacks or by any other enemy Faction trying to slow your advance down.
Having jump drive access to gates only would be already enough to get down future travel times. By a lot. Station modules that act like beacons are not a good idea. Stations can be turned into fortresses, regardless of their type, as there is no hardcap on defence modules as far as I know. And even if there was, you'd still make beacons more common through player production. That should never be the case unless you completely design the game around them.
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Omni-Orb
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Omni-Orb » Wed, 17. Nov 21, 20:43

That all ships could hold and shoot missiles regardless of weapon loadout, having a combat reason for cargo hold room.
Missile/turret only type ships, M and L class. Longer range missiles, i feel they should be at least double range of what they are currently.
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ubuntufreakdragon
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by ubuntufreakdragon » Wed, 17. Nov 21, 22:45

1)Borons
2)Customizable turret commands like in AP/FL
3)Sinza Boost from BtF
4)Ship recycling/Reverse engineering.
5)Missile Defence Mosquito.
6)TM's like ships, M sized, some Cargo, some S pads, miniature Aux support ships, that can restock&repair smaller ships.
7)equipment as cargo items, for loot and switching between different ships, (you have fount an rusty eagle with a nice modded Gun and want to move this Gun to a new shiny Nemesis) so instead of dismantling an uninstalled piece of equipment it will be put into your cargo hold and can be reinstalled on any compatible ship.
8 ) A patrol command that reacts to emergency calls within its system.
9)A DeVries like system as potential player Fortress, I liked the hiding inside the corona theme.
Last edited by ubuntufreakdragon on Fri, 19. Nov 21, 01:49, edited 1 time in total.
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Inzann
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Inzann » Thu, 18. Nov 21, 16:52

I really liked the stock market even if it could be abused.

Falcrack
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Falcrack » Fri, 19. Nov 21, 01:08

Inzann wrote:
Thu, 18. Nov 21, 16:52
I really liked the stock market even if it could be abused.
I would like a stock market, but only if the corporations were actually real in the game, and the stock prices were tied to the profitability of each of these corporations. The old stock market was pretty fake.

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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Imperial Good » Fri, 19. Nov 21, 01:44

Turret priorities. I really want them.

For example with my Asgard I want the L turrets to focus S and M sized ships and only if none are nearby to shoot any capital or bigger targets. I also want them to retarget should a higher priority target show up, such as stop shooting at a station if an S ship enters range.

Szynszyl
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Szynszyl » Fri, 19. Nov 21, 17:40

Jumpdrives!!! Second thing are turret behavior settings :)

buds
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by buds » Sat, 20. Nov 21, 00:27

Id like jumpdrives for x/xl ships. Maybe they could be a research thing. For UFJD style random sectors they should have a few gates around the universe that are 'glitched' that take you to a different randomized sector each time and those have a return gate that return you back.
I also miss being able to command turrets directly, instead of only having the ai shoot them. Maybe you can do this and i havent found the button.

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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Falcrack » Sat, 20. Nov 21, 01:43

I wish X4 had laser power limited by ship energy like X3, rather than heat buildup.

Manawydn
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by Manawydn » Sat, 20. Nov 21, 02:02

Hiding function for ships, also factories too. I mostly just want to de-clutter my UI and have an easier to manage fleet system. We already have templates for ships+factories, now we just need them for fleets

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alt3rn1ty
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Re: Features from X3 you wish were in X4

Post by alt3rn1ty » Fri, 26. Nov 21, 18:00

Axeface wrote:
Mon, 15. Nov 21, 02:35
Did I say we need the Boron?
I'm not sure that you did :D
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