Suggestions for Pirate DLC

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S!rAssassin
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Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by S!rAssassin » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 09:19

  1. Change logic of pirate harassment similar to police logic. Topic.
  2. Rework pirate harassment! They only demand your cargo, but do not collect it! Pirate must collect goods and fly trade it to pirate base.
  3. Remove "Plunder", "Raider", etc. from pirate ship names - it`s completely unmasking them.
  4. Say NO to spawn pirates! Let them order ships at all shipyards! Ordered ship must be original masked as lawful citizen of race that has made this ship.
  5. Unlock SCA rating to player, allow gain rep to them and FAF/YAK.
  6. Add illegal masking device to player inventory, allowing cheat police scan with some chance.

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Axeface
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Axeface » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 14:44

S!rAssassin wrote:
Fri, 13. Aug 21, 09:19
[*]Unlock SCA rating to player, allow gain rep to them and FAF/YAK
I think there should always be pirates that are independent and they should form most of the pirate activity we see. SCA is more like a cartel, we need independent npcs (some could be pirates, some smugglers, some simply independents like Malcolm Reynolds) before we are given the key to befriend the cartels. They could be single ships or rogue fleets. Imo the vast majority of pirates shouldnt have a faction by their very nature, and the game just doesnt have this right now.

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oddible
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by oddible » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 19:51

I can't believe how giddy I am about a pirate start. I've never really done it - always picked one faction to champion. I'm imagining an ALWAYS WAR type of scenario with all of the factions. The Litigious Rodent in the CoH storyline is a great example - a device that allows me to mask my identity. Just like the mauraders / pillagers do! The player can have this device but only one - something like that - too OP if you can buy them for all your ships. Or at least make them end-game type of expensive or super rare. Or maybe only for small ships. So I COULD have drug runner ships despite being red to everyone. Lock my rep at -10 or less with all factions.

So I can start drug running, cap some ships and build up a small fleet that can capture a larger ship. Eventually build a trade network of drug runners. Then I can build my own station in a dark corner of a remote sector to start my own supply. Though getting resources to build a first station is going to be tough. Probably have to be Terran for the lower logistics requirement. Cap my first sector and get a defense platform up and running. Hold the line and start expanding out.

Alm888
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Alm888 » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 21:28

Before any serious discussion could be held about pirate factions, I think we must first get a working pirate economy.
I see several problems:
  • Pirates do not have a ship source. While it could be hard to imagine a full-blown pirate shipyard (which would be the first target for MIN or other enemy factions, unless it is somehow hidden/cloaked so enemy NPC ships can not discover or target it), right now there is not even a most-pirate way of getting a ship implemented! Pirates do not board ships in X4!
  • Provided there is a pirate shipyard/stronghold (you know, "Exo Squad" style, hidden somewhere deep on the outskirts of an abandoned sector), there is no working mechanics for pirates to deliver goods there. Minotaurs/Behemoths/Phoenixes are totally inadequate -- even if they manage to plunder someone, most of the loot either self-terminates due to time, or simply can not be picked up due to laughable amount of cargo space.
  • If we imagine that pirates have a working wharf/shipyard and economy, there is an additional challenge for a player trying to make a pirate career. Blueprints. Currently there is no way to get ship/equipment Blueprints other than purchasing at a faction's HQ, which requires good standing. A friendly and patriotic pirate, yeah!
  • And lastly, while we have pirates, we do not have their targets: civilian ships! Want to plunder someone? It must be either a faction-affiliated station (with potentially dozens of turrets), or a military transport carrying "turret components", "hull parts" or other building materials. Where is the GOLD?! Where are the treasures? (Needless to say, plundering stations currently is impossible for a pirate-player, as access to engineering section requires docking permission and thus a good standing with the victim, which would not last long.)
So, these are the main problems in my opinion.

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Axeface
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Axeface » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 21:55

Alm888 wrote:
Fri, 13. Aug 21, 21:28
[*]Pirates do not have a ship source. While it could be hard to imagine a full-blown pirate shipyard (which would be the first target for MIN or other enemy factions, unless it is somehow hidden/cloaked so enemy NPC ships can not discover or target it), right now there is not even a most-pirate way of getting a ship implemented! Pirates do not board ships in X4!
Yaki take abandoned ships, but they then recycle them. It would be rather cool if this feature was expanded to other pirates, and instead of recycling that they actually just flew the ships off to a pirate shipyard to change the ID and then actually used that ship, sometimes modifying it (Like bolting another turret onto a freighter or something).

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Tamina
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Tamina » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 22:05

They haven't told us anything about the new DLC. Would be nice to hear Egosofts ideas at some point before they implement them, so that we can bring our own ideas to the table as well, but I fear we will hear nothing much until right before release.
Last edited by Tamina on Fri, 13. Aug 21, 22:57, edited 1 time in total.

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Slashman
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Slashman » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 22:28

Tamina wrote:
Fri, 13. Aug 21, 22:05
They haven't told us anything about the new DLC. Would be nice to hear Egosofts ideas at some point before they implement them, so that we bring our own ideas to the table as well, but I fear we will hear nothing much until right before release.
Didn't we have a whole heaping set of time between the last DLC's announcement and its release?
If you want a different perspective, stand on your head.

Phenom__64
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Phenom__64 » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 22:55

Gamescom *cough*
I´m very sure that the next DLC will be announced/revealed at gamescom like the last 2 DLCs and X4 and X Rebirth and maybe every other X game.
And most likely the release will be targeted at Q4 2021 and then probably postponed to Q1 2022 which results in a mid/late march release :D

So, yes there should be enough time to make suggestions.

xant
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by xant » Fri, 13. Aug 21, 23:36

Last year Egosoft announced their presence at gamescom a week before the event. Since gamescom starts in 12 days, I expect some news in the second half of next week. But as they're already included in the gamescom 2021 lineup, this is no more than a formality at this point.

If we're lucky, we'll also get a reddit AMA from Bernd at the end of August, just like last time.

Sadly they didn't repeat last years mistake, when they published the CoH logo a week before the official announcement... ^^

Alm888
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Alm888 » Sat, 14. Aug 21, 09:28

Axeface wrote:
Fri, 13. Aug 21, 21:55
Yaki take abandoned ships…
Sure they do! Quite inefficiently, I must add (spending all 9 marines on a single abandoned Moreya is less than optimal). But they lack the ability to make said abandoned ships.

S!rAssassin
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by S!rAssassin » Sat, 14. Aug 21, 10:35

Phenom__64 wrote:
Fri, 13. Aug 21, 22:55
So, yes there should be enough time to make suggestions.
Indeed! Let’s generate some ideas!

Pirates must be complete race! With trade and production. And player should be able play as pirate as well!

SwizzleStick86
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by SwizzleStick86 » Sat, 14. Aug 21, 14:46

Why not give them some station modules that have multiple productions as opposed to one single product, but yield a much smaller amount? Imo pirates as tested should have less stations then other factions and this would facilitate that. Additionally I think it would be neat if their station modules looked like their poeces thrown together with ductape from all different race modules, with more weapon turrets than other races.
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Slashman
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Slashman » Sat, 14. Aug 21, 19:10

I would actually be in favor of ships that get destroyed leaving behind some form of salvageable scrap...which would be useful specifically to pirates who would then turn it into pirate vessels when they get enough of it.

Would be interesting to see the Blastclaw make a return. Anyway a defined line of pirate ships from S to L would make me a pretty happy chap. They would not be produced at shipyards...they would be cobbled together at pirate scrapyards and would have very specific strengths and weaknesses.
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Tamina
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Tamina » Sat, 14. Aug 21, 19:55

Idealy, imo, pirates economy would mostly be based on their stolen goods and wrecked ships building some tucked together ships from those. Maybe a new pirate faction specific ware "scrapmetal"? I fear that their economy would be very fragile that way, though.

Would be cool if the balance could be tipped in favour of the pirates (theoretically) creating factions overrun by outlaws. Similar to real factions.

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Und wenn ein Forenbösewicht, was Ungezogenes spricht, dann hol' ich meinen Kaktus und der sticht sticht sticht.
  /l、 
゙(゚、 。 7 
 l、゙ ~ヽ   / 
 じしf_, )ノ 

SwizzleStick86
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by SwizzleStick86 » Sat, 14. Aug 21, 21:49

I like that idea. They could even have modules that produce scrap metal from pretty much any salvage or goods that they steal from stations and ships.
"It can only be attributable to human error."
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S!rAssassin
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by S!rAssassin » Sat, 14. Aug 21, 21:56

Tamina wrote:
Sat, 14. Aug 21, 19:55
Idealy, imo, pirates economy would mostly be based on their stolen goods and wrecked ships building some tucked together ships from those.
Yes! If Egosoft makes new pirate ships based on existing ships, like YAK, pirates may salvage ship wrecks for consuming resources to build ships, equipment and illegal goods.

Herelekin
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by Herelekin » Sun, 15. Aug 21, 09:35

Aigh,
don't know where else to post this. Almost put it in Beta 4.10 section. Is there the possibility to implement a autorepair command in the behavioral menu "Einzelanweisungen"? Like "When there's enough money and a wharf ist whithin range go and get some repairs". Really would help with the micromanagment.
Thx

S!rAssassin
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by S!rAssassin » Mon, 23. Aug 21, 08:49

Add to pirate L destroyers small fleets of S fighters! They are very vulnerable (and very profitable) to boarding by player.

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grapedog
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by grapedog » Mon, 23. Aug 21, 09:34

Other Pirate related things that need fixing...

Player and NPC ships need to NOT come out of travel drive because a pirate harassed them. That's pretty much the dumbest thing ever... if up comes an issue where pirates are not able to do their piratical things because of this... then another solution needs to be found. Dropping out of travel drive to stop your ship so you can tell a pirate to F off is a dumb mechanic...

Pirates need to be less obvious, but there needs to be more ways of catching/finding them. Perhaps that could be a benefit of an advanced satellite is that it can pick up on pirate ships easier, where a normal satellite cannot. That would give me a real reason to use some advanced satellites. I only use them rarely now as I only place satellites at gates and regular satellites work fine for that... but if they could help dealing with piracy, that would probably convince me to use more advanced satellites.

Pirates need to be UNABLE to switch ID's during combat. If I'm camping a shipyard, and have like 30 ships attacking an FAF rattler... and it switches to a TEL Rattler... and turns blue... my ships should not be fooled, and should not stop attacking. It should turn immediately back to red since my ships already saw it and engaged it before it switched.

Piracy right now is already pretty un-fun to deal with. My ships stop so they can get more easily harassed. You have some pirates running around in dragon raiders, kuraokamis, asps, moreyas, and rattlesnakes, which are either the fastest ships in their class or close to... not only do my ships stop to be harassed like idiots, they usually cannot escape afterwards either because they're being chased down by ships faster than they are. Aside from viewing all the ships in an area, and looking for obvious pirates, or setting an alert to notify you of pirate ship sightings... there is no real way to combat them except after the fact. Also, I am barely notified that I lost a ship. Pretty much every hour now I just my message log, search for destroyed, just to see if/and how many, ships I need to replace. It's just an inevitability that I will lose ships, no matter what I do. That isn't fun...

LameFox
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Re: Suggestions for Pirate DLC

Post by LameFox » Mon, 23. Aug 21, 11:32

As much as I like pirates thematically, we are two expansions in and I still have to use mods to play as one because there is no recycle/salvage, or capturing of non-structure BPs. It feels like they don't care much about that gameplay. Even adding the Yaki didn't make them do anything about it.
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