EQ Docks - need some adjustments - not profitable.

[grapedog]

EQ Docks, on their own, left to their own devices, are not profitable. All they do is slowly lose money over time. Is that intended?

This is a very simple EQ dock I set up in Second Contact II. I waited until the initial cash infusion and flurry of buying wares to stock it's storage was over. These pictures are from the last 48 hours in the life of an EQ dock that I didn't touch or use at all. It's all automated for buying and selling, trading, whatever it needs to do. All it does is slowly lose money. I should add, it does have a small hab, there for the purpose of allowing ships to get re-manned if they need manning... and it does purchase food/meds for those 500 workers.

Now, I'm not saying an EQ dock should be super profitable... but I feel that going through the process, and expense, of getting all the BP's and building an EQ dock, there should be some kind of small return on investment. In the least I should be able to break even over time. Right now it only loses money...

In game-starts where I restrict myself to only one shipyard, EQ docks are super useful to be able to repair, re-outfit, and re-equip ships that are very far away from my lone shipyard. I'm not super happy about it always losing money, but it serves a purpose so I put up with it. But EQ docks should at least be able to break even on ROI over time if the player isn't using it. I don't really know how the price slider affects EQ docks... as I have had it set to 150% this entire time, and it still a money loser for me.

I think someone needs to look at the pricing EQ docks charge, and perhaps do some small changes. Maybe a base 500cr fee, or 1000cr fee, for using the EQ dock. The big dips in cash flow are from buying TER wares... which I imagine only get stocked when I get pretty low so the price I pay is higher, allowing me to find a trader willing to make a deal. If I banned TER/PIO ships from using my EQ dock, it would still overall be a money pit.... just at a slower pace.

EQ docks need some love.

[dtpsprt]

The problem with EQ Docks is that the AI does not use them. Mainly it's the player that does so (even the faction/AI ones), therefore how can anyone expect to make even a small profit out of them? And why should the player even buy the blueprints and build them except for having all species equipment available in the same spot?
To fix this it would require (IMHO) a lot of programming work making it impossible in the current state of the game (or even in the foreseeable future).

[grapedog]

The problem with EQ Docks is that the AI does not use them. Mainly it's the player that does so (even the faction/AI ones), therefore how can anyone expect to make even a small profit out of them? And why should the player even buy the blueprints and build them except for having all species equipment available in the same spot?
To fix this it would require (IMHO) a lot of programming work making it impossible in the current state of the game (or even in the foreseeable future).

The NPC factions constantly use my EQ dock, as I have all the BP's available. I'm not sure how well it would work otherwise, but I imagine it would still see a lot of business if it was in TEL space for example and you had all the TEL BP's.... and a simple one time fee for using the EQ dock would solve most of the problems. I don't really like that solution though, it isn't very elegant... but it would probably solve the basic issue of EQ Docks being constant money losers.

[dtpsprt]

The NPC factions constantly use my EQ dock, as I have all the BP's available. I'm not sure how well it would work otherwise, but I imagine it would still see a lot of business if it was in TEL space for example and you had all the TEL BP's.... and a simple one time fee for using the EQ dock would solve most of the problems. I don't really like that solution though, it isn't very elegant... but it would probably solve the basic issue of EQ Docks being constant money losers.

I've never seen AI factions using EQ docs personally but I suppose you have monitored this. This leaves two possibilities:
a) Your price is too low or
b) Your resources are being hacked out by pirates

If it is the price case, I suppose it just follows the nerfing of Wharf/Shipyard profits and the again we fall in the "major" task of differentiating the profit calculations between them and EQ's... still not seeing this to be happening...

[Raptor34]

Can confirm AI does use it.
I like EQ docks to help stiffen a sector's defense, because they attract faction ships, also keeps them in shape so they don't travel somewhere else to rearm.
Also can confirm that iirc with max price, even back in 3.X they lose money. Well, I actually cannot tell whether they are actually losing money or they are still slowly filling up their storage, I generally overload on L storage. But I do know I've never seen them actually earn money.

[grapedog]

The NPC factions constantly use my EQ dock, as I have all the BP's available. I'm not sure how well it would work otherwise, but I imagine it would still see a lot of business if it was in TEL space for example and you had all the TEL BP's.... and a simple one time fee for using the EQ dock would solve most of the problems. I don't really like that solution though, it isn't very elegant... but it would probably solve the basic issue of EQ Docks being constant money losers.

I've never seen AI factions using EQ docs personally but I suppose you have monitored this. This leaves two possibilities:
a) Your price is too low or
b) Your resources are being hacked out by pirates

If it is the price case, I suppose it just follows the nerfing of Wharf/Shipyard profits and the again we fall in the "major" task of differentiating the profit calculations between them and EQ's... still not seeing this to be happening...

In the 2nd screenshot, on the right side box, you can see the NPC ships usng my dock.

This gamestart is old, zya is gone, paranid unified, xenon pretty much extinct... mostly peaceful universe, so not much business.

But even if i had business, it still would be at a loss, just much quicker as i have to stock quicker.

[RodentofDoom]

I don't build separate maintenance docks.
I build a S/M wharf or L/XL shipyard with both manufacture and maintenance on each.

Just because the AI can run an EQ dock indefinitely doesn't mean the player should too.
The AI can by some degrees ignore cash-flow issues, issues that as a player you can easily work around to overcome.




also
Have you disabled the option for the EQ docks manager to purchase supplies from the NPC factions?