Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

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Scoob
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Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

Post by Scoob » Sat, 6. Jul 19, 00:59

Hey all,

So, I'm a little confused. I finally got a support ship in 2.5 and parked a load of my captured S-Class ships on it. Some still had some Consumable items aboard, such as Satellites and the like. I selected to remove a load of these to gain some materials for other ship items. I'd done this before prior to 2.5 just fine.

However, after removing quite a high credit value of Consumables from a few ships and Confirming the order, the items were removed, but my Support Ship (Nomad) gained nothing at all. Note: I'm talking about removing things via the same method used at a Race Equipment Dock etc. NOT doing a transfer.

These support ships are supposed to be mobile Equipment Docks, but they appear a little broken at the moment. I had hoped too that they'd be able to make weapons (I have the Blueprints) for refitting my ships, however that feature does not seem to be enabled.

How is this supposed to work now?

Scoob.

burger1
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Re: Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

Post by burger1 » Sat, 6. Jul 19, 09:56

"Selling" consumables to support ships has always made them just disappear.

Scoob
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Re: Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

Post by Scoob » Sat, 6. Jul 19, 13:06

burger1 wrote:
Sat, 6. Jul 19, 09:56
"Selling" consumables to support ships has always made them just disappear.
Erm, no, not when I last used a Support Ship they didn't - I built up a little collection of materials...perhaps that was a bug? I know if you're on a race Equipment Dock or Wharf removing stuff adds materials to the stations stores - I've exploited this to remove something from one ship (broken down into materials) to install something else on another ship, where the station didn't have the materials needed. A Support Ship should work the same. Resources just vanishing isn't very "real" from an economy perspective.

Regardless, what's the point of the UI showing what materials you get from removing something if you don't actually get anything?

Scoob.

Falcrack
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Re: Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

Post by Falcrack » Sun, 7. Jul 19, 22:24

Same general issue when replacing equipment at equipment docks. The old items are not recycled back into the original components. They simply disappear. However, you are paid for selling back equipment according to the value of the wares used to create the recycled equipment. So in essence, the equipment dock is paying you for your old equipment, and getting nothing at all in return.

IMO, equipment should be recycled when sold, or in the case of support ships, the consumables should be turned back into the original components.

Scoob
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Re: Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

Post by Scoob » Mon, 8. Jul 19, 12:49

Erm, but I've removed items from a ship which then enabled me to fit items that I previously couldn't due to lack of materials. This led me to believe that things were broken down into their component parts.

I don't know how my Support Ship in my game prior to 2.5 gained resources then, it certainly didn't buy any, yet unequipping ships (just consumables of course) did see it has various component parts afterwards. Confused!

Regardless, removed items should be broken down into their component parts, minus Energy Cells which are just a catalyst in effect. The same as ship repairs on a Support Ship should require Hull Parts and not be free. The economy needs to be as REAL as possible, and repair costs in any conflict should be a thing, and take resources from said economy.

Scoob.

xWolfzx
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Re: Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

Post by xWolfzx » Tue, 9. Jul 19, 00:41

I'm confused, isn't Support Ships introduced in 2.5? Or am I thinking about something else?

Scoob
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Re: Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

Post by Scoob » Tue, 9. Jul 19, 19:55

xWolfzx wrote:
Tue, 9. Jul 19, 00:41
I'm confused, isn't Support Ships introduced in 2.5? Or am I thinking about something else?
I'm not entirely sure, but then I was playing with the Beta, so before the official 2.5 drop. I know I used them in one of my prior games, but cannot fully recall if that was the 2.5 beta or before.

Scoob.

Imperial Good
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Re: Support Ship - Why aren't I gaining resources when removing Consumables?

Post by Imperial Good » Wed, 10. Jul 19, 01:26

When modifying equipment, any excess wares will be discarded. Has been like this since release day. It was a common exploit to sell more product to NPC shipyards/warfs back during release. It is now an exploit to generate fake demand from your own shipyards and warfs by modifying expensive ships at them (L, XL) and then removing all equipment from them at an NPC Shipyard/warf for huge payment. Ah perfectly balanced!

I am guessing the reason for this is to stop a possible game breaking bug where by refunding enough equipment might overfill a shipyard/warf storage with the wrong ratio of wares resulting in it becoming dysfunctional until the player manually hacks storage to discard some of the wares.

I would suggest that materials should be 100% refunded when being converted between equipment. For example changing an engine from an PAR Travel Mk3 to a ARG Travel Mk3 is free like currently. However if some material is left over then only 80% of it is recycled incurring some loss. For example going from PAR Combat Mk3 to ARG Travel Mk3 incurs a small loss if it were to be reverted. Further more recycled wares over the maximum storage limit for that ware are fully discarded without refund. For example if a NPC shipyard is full of Engine Parts then going from XL All-round Thrusters Mk3 to XL All-round Thrusters Mk2 incurs a very large loss with little refund due to all Engine Parts from the action being discarded.

This behaviour is intuitive, logical, fair and much more exploit resistant.

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