just curious

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Brinkaman
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just curious

Post by Brinkaman » Mon, 6. Apr 20, 12:46

why is x rebirth known for being very bad?

Alm888
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Re: just curious

Post by Alm888 » Mon, 6. Apr 20, 14:20

Brinkaman wrote:
Mon, 6. Apr 20, 12:46
why is x rebirth known for being very bad?
Because it is no "X3". 8)

But seriously, it had three problems (in no particular order) at the start:
  1. it was (presumably) a buggy mess with unbearable interface (do not know for sure because 4.30 is the only version I've played);
  2. it seriously lacked content. And I'm not talking the single player ship. At start only the Albion tech tree was present, Omicron Lyrae had used the very same ships and even in 4.30 the issue still persists: Canterran tech tree is nonexistant and they (for some inexplicable reason) use Balor missile frigate despite it being Argon tech;
  3. it was too different from X3 so a lot of "die hard" X3 players bashed "X: Rebirth" for being too different. I've met some accusations that X: rebirth doesn't have feature Y despite it clearly has it, only implemented differntly, but those "fanats" were not capable of re-learning stuff ("duckling syndrome"?).
While "X: Rebirth" is still not a great game (due to points 1 and 2 from the list above plus indestructible stations) it was still a move in the right direction from dead, static and scripted X3 with "GOD" auto spawning stations and NPC factions not playing by the same rules as player (differences in production cycles). What "X: Rebirth" did was just replacing hidden scripts with a blatant ones spawning enemies out of thin air.

tomchk
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Re: just curious

Post by tomchk » Mon, 6. Apr 20, 14:25

Brinkaman wrote:
Mon, 6. Apr 20, 12:46
why is x rebirth known for being very bad?
While some issues remain, it still has many awesome qualities, such as universe design, station design, effects, sound, music, and great game pad interface. If you haven’t tried it, please take a look at the steam demo! It’s one of my favorite games and at 4.3 deserves much better than its reviews.
Care to see what I've been creating? https://www.youtube.com/user/ytubrute

Brinkaman
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Re: just curious

Post by Brinkaman » Mon, 6. Apr 20, 15:29

tomchk wrote:
Mon, 6. Apr 20, 14:25
Brinkaman wrote:
Mon, 6. Apr 20, 12:46
why is x rebirth known for being very bad?
While some issues remain, it still has many awesome qualities, such as universe design, station design, effects, sound, music, and great game pad interface. If you haven’t tried it, please take a look at the steam demo! It’s one of my favorite games and at 4.3 deserves much better than its reviews.
I'm going to play the demo because I want to get x4 but I want a taste of the action before I buy x4

tomchk
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Re: just curious

Post by tomchk » Mon, 6. Apr 20, 16:09

Great! Hopefully the demo is based on a recent XR version (I never played the demo). There are many differences, and in some way X4 will still be a "step down" (like universe design and some sound and graphics effects, and just cinematic feel in general), but they are both *awesome* games in different ways, in my opinion. I think XR is still very cheap, too.
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letor
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Re: just curious

Post by letor » Sun, 10. May 20, 08:09

Hi.

Very, very interesting and curious the topic that Brinkaman raises.

I share most of the answers you give. Since I've played virtually the entire EGOSOFT series, I think I understand the criticism that came up when it was launched. Truly the game gave many failures, to the point that we spent more time fighting against the "bugs" than overcoming the challenges it posed. But, well, at least I got ahead and I was able to thank him for the positive part it had: his orientation towards a quite different type of game, his impressive artistic work, and his music. Of course, this is not what was expected of a space adventure, so I was not surprised by the storm that broke out. But I think what disappointed the most of followers was, as Alm888 very well points out with humor, that he no longer looked like "Series X". Maybe EGOSOFT addicts (including myself) wanted more of the same, and this was another thing.

But the most curious thing came later, because within a few years X4 Foundations appeared, which is largely a continuation of X Rebirth. Yes, it is also part of the X series, but I see it more in common with Rebirth than with its predecessors. And oh surprise! the product is received with very good reviews. I'm happy for its creators, but I don't understand those who criticized Rebirth so much and are now delighted with Foundations. Certainly, Foundations has not had the series of catastrophic initial failures of its predecessor. But apart from that, is there such a difference? I do not think so. It follows its general appearance, so different from that of Albion Prelude, the last of the "old style". It has practically the same NPCs (they are even uglier), the same modular system of stations and very similar ships, practically the same races, large sectors, and so on. Yes, now we can pilot differents ships and the economy works better, perhaps giving too many "benefitssss”. It must be recognized that in many ways it is a better game, but it also has a worst part, for example that it is artistically less quality, and we can no longer enjoy the landscapes that amazed me in Rebirth. The side missions are working at last, but at the beginning they were a disaster. The few and boring plots shine for their simplicity. Unfortunately too, as is already a custom in recent times, there is more and more "struggle" and less "thinking". Anyway, in general they look like the same family.

In short, I find no justification for such different positions. It is probably that I do not know how to appreciate the change, may be… :P :wink:

Cheers

Alan Phipps
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Re: just curious

Post by Alan Phipps » Sun, 10. May 20, 12:50

Perhaps the best way to think of X Rebirth is that it was an essential break from the old and creaking XP OS/DirectShow era single-thread game engine that had reached its sell-by date and capacity for expansion with X3AP. So, with an entirely new game engine to design and use, wholly different asset models to produce and a completely new gameplay, AI, plots/missions, etc there had to be some balances struck when you have limited financial and development resources. The game release was repeatedly delayed and was eventually made, possibly prematurely for financial or publisher reasons, with many known game issues still outstanding and which earned it the very poor early reviews.

Many updates and a few DLCs later it became a fun and quite playable game. Also, along came a limited scope VR variant using Vulkan API which was another first experience for the Egosoft development team.

X Rebirth normal and VR were the stepping stones that allowed X4 to be built using the now better understood game engine and API which in turn allowed the developers the flexibility to design it more in line with the old X3 gameplay style and ethos. While suffering its teething and a few more persistent problems, X4 has also improved greatly with updates and now a DLC. It will probably become as good as support for its public beta testing approach and continued helpful and constructive feedback from the player base will allow.

In clarification, I am a volunteer unpaid forum moderator and have no commercial connection with Egosoft whatsoever.
A dog has a master; a cat has domestic staff.

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