Mining ship going outside of restricted area

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lostboron
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Mining ship going outside of restricted area

Post by lostboron » Sun, 9. Jul 17, 20:31

Still trying to run the integrated URV forge in DeVries, one issue is blocking me: I double checked the manager is not supposed to send subordinate ships outside of Glaring Truth, but she keeps sending mining ships to Bleak Pebble, where they immediately get destroyed. There is no other sector with crystals in the system, so they always end up there.

I even tried to keep bringing crystals with another ship I control, but that didn't work for long. And I don't have anough destoyers to fully secure Bleak Pebble.

Is there a way to fix or work around this bug ? There is no way this factory is going to keep running without lots of micro management if I can't actually restrict the range of ships...

:?:

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Post by Alan Phipps » Mon, 10. Jul 17, 16:11

Hi. Have a look at the Rebirth Wiki part called "Mining ships assigned to Managers".
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lostboron
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Post by lostboron » Tue, 11. Jul 17, 02:34

Thanks. I wonder if the issue comes from a translation. I am playing the game in French, and the label for that operational range is "liberté d'opération des subordonés", which says nothing about applying only to trading. How is it called in the English version ?

I would still prefer the behavior to be fixed rather than the text. The wiki states the rationale behind the "Trading operational range" setting not applying to Mining ships is to ensure that production lines don't stall due to a lack of resources, but my production line sure stops after my mining ship is destroyed !

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Post by Sparky Sparkycorp » Tue, 11. Jul 17, 03:06

Thanks for the report about the French client. Info passed on to Devs in case it is something they are able to address in the future.

In English the wording is Trading Operational Range.

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Post by Snafu_X3 » Wed, 12. Jul 17, 00:08

lostboron wrote: The wiki states the rationale behind the "Trading operational range" setting not applying to Mining ships is to ensure that production lines don't stall due to a lack of resources, but my production line sure stops after my mining ship is destroyed !
While I dislike the result, I suspect it's a semi-intentional decision to ensure you send out capship miners with plenty of defence drones & a decent DO, plus maybe an escort; S/M miners should prioritise staying IS anyway due to their lack of speed (their tendency to wander OOS is a PITA & likely to be an oversight; it should be corrected)

In several previous posts I've recommended building Xtal & Cell fabs in BP|Dim Flamelet. It's off the general path, so can be boosted to/jumped from fairly directly; it provides local access to essential resources (plasma, xtals etc) so your ships won't get shot up so often; & it gives you a start point in a different area so you can finally use those capship traders for their intended purpose: hauling!
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RAVEN.myst
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Post by RAVEN.myst » Wed, 12. Jul 17, 05:29

I think this design decision is possibly in order to allow a station to mine before the radar upgrade is bolted on (inconsistent, and doesn't really make a whole lot of sense - why would it be possible to communicate at range with a miner but not a trader?) I also very much think that a setting to restrict this separately from the trade range should definitely exist (regardless of whether or not the comms relay is required for system-wide ops.)
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Alan Phipps
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Post by Alan Phipps » Wed, 12. Jul 17, 13:30

Whatever the reasons for the decision, it would still be nice to be able to tell the miner/manager that you wish them to keep mining a certain range of zones for a certain range of resources - especially when there are often closer and safer zones to use than the one the ship is often sent to.
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Post by RAVEN.myst » Wed, 12. Jul 17, 14:37

Alan Phipps wrote:Whatever the reasons for the decision, it would still be nice to be able to tell the miner/manager that you wish them to keep mining a certain range of zones for a certain range of resources - especially when there are often closer and safer zones to use than the one the ship is often sent to.
Absolutely! I remember a particular bugbear of mine: ships in one of the OL "spokes" (I forget which, now, probably Radiant Haven) would travel out to Devoid Clime to mine stuff that was available en route in the central crossroads at Commerce Core - with no way to specify where the ship is to mine, there was no way to avoid this once the host station was built (I believe it was indicated in 4.1 patch notes that some changes were made to improve behaviour, but I haven't tested it since.)
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Post by Ezarkal » Wed, 12. Jul 17, 16:03

What I'd like to see even more is the ability to "blacklist" some zone for certain activities.

For example, say you order a trade ship to buy drones in Omicron Lyrae, and sell to the shipyard in Gemstone Manufacture. If you could blacklist the whole of FoO for trade/mine ships, your ship would probably pass through DeVries, which is a longer but safer route. But, you could keep the system open for fight ships so they could have a quicker way through.

If we take that idea a bit further, there could be the possibility to set restrictions for individual lists or stations. In the earlier example, you wouldn't want a rahanas to go through FoO as it's got a pretty high chance of being blown up by pirates. A lyramekron, however, could do the trip much more safely.

In the OP's case, you would want to restrict navigation for your station's miners, but not to other mining/trading ships that might have reasons to be there.


I don't know if such restrictions would be easy (or even possible) to implement, but hey... food for thoughts. :)
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Post by UniTrader » Wed, 12. Jul 17, 16:06

This Post was written today morning, but I could only send it now:
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RAVEN.myst wrote:I think this design decision is possibly in order to allow a station to mine before the radar upgrade is bolted on (inconsistent, and doesn't really make a whole lot of sense - why would it be possible to communicate at range with a miner but not a trader?)
Maybe because its not about Communicating with the other Ships, but about communicating with other Stations to get their Prices and Stock? The miners go cluster-wide because no matter how big or small your comms array is you cannot talk with a Rock, but the Amount is pretty constant in the whole cluster anyway. (also for most Stations beginning production is impossible with a Sector-wide search for mineables only - often necessary mineables are in other Sectors only)
RAVEN.myst wrote:I also very much think that a setting to restrict this separately from the trade range should definitely exist (regardless of whether or not the comms relay is required for system-wide ops.)
i prefer a setting which is honored by both. and making the Distinction between Trader and Miner less rigid - like i do with my Manager Script: send mining Ships to Mine and, if there is nothing to Mine, use them for Trading.
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end previously written post

RAVEN.myst wrote:
Alan Phipps wrote:Whatever the reasons for the decision, it would still be nice to be able to tell the miner/manager that you wish them to keep mining a certain range of zones for a certain range of resources - especially when there are often closer and safer zones to use than the one the ship is often sent to.
Absolutely! I remember a particular bugbear of mine: ships in one of the OL "spokes" (I forget which, now, probably Radiant Haven) would travel out to Devoid Clime to mine stuff that was available en route in the central crossroads at Commerce Core - with no way to specify where the ship is to mine, there was no way to avoid this once the host station was built (I believe it was indicated in 4.1 patch notes that some changes were made to improve behaviour, but I haven't tested it since.)
the only change was that the Miners dont fly to a Random Zone which has the ressources but use the closest one instead (mesured by raw distance, as the spacefly flies, not by travel Distance)
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Post by RAVEN.myst » Wed, 12. Jul 17, 18:26

UniTrader wrote:
RAVEN.myst wrote:
Alan Phipps wrote:Whatever the reasons for the decision, it would still be nice to be able to tell the miner/manager that you wish them to keep mining a certain range of zones for a certain range of resources - especially when there are often closer and safer zones to use than the one the ship is often sent to.
Absolutely! I remember a particular bugbear of mine: ships in one of the OL "spokes" (I forget which, now, probably Radiant Haven) would travel out to Devoid Clime to mine stuff that was available en route in the central crossroads at Commerce Core - with no way to specify where the ship is to mine, there was no way to avoid this once the host station was built (I believe it was indicated in 4.1 patch notes that some changes were made to improve behaviour, but I haven't tested it since.)
the only change was that the Miners dont fly to a Random Zone which has the ressources but use the closest one instead (mesured by raw distance, as the spacefly flies, not by travel Distance)
Damn - because that's exactly what was ALREADY happening in the first place: the mining ships setting off from certain locations in RH would consider a deposit in DC as nearer than those in CC (which are about halfway to the chosen destination.) So what you're telling me is that if I were to reload that game, those ships would still be carrying out that particular stupidity :S Oh well, since I've (yet again) abandoned Rebirth in favour of various previous Xs (mainly X3AP, but also X2), I guess it doesn't matter...
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