Mass Drivers and game slowdowns

[Martin2k4]

OK, i have 2 questions that have been bothering me for some time..

1. Is it worth equipping the Dragon with Mass Drivers ??? Are they more effective then the GHEPTs?

2. If i build many fabs and deploy many satelites, will i experience a slowdown... I don't own a top notch CPU (only XP2000+) and i'm that if i do that the cpu won't take it

[SpinningCone]

GHEPTS are much much more powerful than mass drivers and dont need ammo. mass drivers are ok against m5 ships because they have such pathetic hulls and can occasionally help you cap (small hull damage) other than that they have little offensive value compared to the other weapons. however they rock at missle defense. installed one in the rear of my Nova way back when . hardly ever got hit by a missle afterwards. so if you want to focus on your front guns for capping but want a good missile defense then yes otherwise no, go HEPT.

nav sats shouldent affect your game that i could see. pretty sure all the ships are calculated anyway the sat would just let you see them .

[Quinch]

Put bluntly, mass drivers have no offensive value whatsoever. The fact that they bypass shields would be better if it didn't take you five minutes of continuous pelting to take down a pirate bayamon. You'd use up less time if you 'ported on top of the enemy ship and tried to take it apart with a 20th century screwdriver.

[Momaw]

Put bluntly, mass drivers have no offensive value whatsoever. The fact that they bypass shields would be better if it didn't take you five minutes of continuous pelting to take down a pirate bayamon. You'd use up less time if you 'ported on top of the enemy ship and tried to take it apart with a 20th century screwdriver.

Don't be dramatic. It doesn't take 5 minutes. It doesn't even take 1. A Bayamon has 2000 hull points. A mass driver does 12*20 = 240 hull damage per second. You would destroy the Bayamon in 8.33 seconds of sustained firing with one gun, or 4.16 seconds with two. Just because you fail to recognize when is an appropriate to employ a mass driver and when it is not, don't give everybody the impression that it's worthless.

[Quinch]

Don't be dramatic. It doesn't take 5 minutes. It doesn't even take 1. A Bayamon has 2000 hull points. A mass driver does 12*20 = 240 hull damage per second. You would destroy the Bayamon in 8.33 seconds of sustained firing with one gun, or 4.16 seconds with two. Just because you fail to recognize when is an appropriate to employ a mass driver and when it is not, don't give everybody the impression that it's worthless.

Maybe, but a single GPAC will take it down in thirty seconds max. The problem is that in X2, ships that have massive shielding, and thus warrant the use of a MD also tend to have massive hull armor, which makes it a lot less feasible. The bottom line is that, if you can destroy a craft in reasonable time with a MD gun, chances are you can take it down just as, if not more quickly with a conventional laser.

[Momaw]

Maybe, but a single GPAC will take it down in thirty seconds max. The problem is that in X2, ships that have massive shielding, and thus warrant the use of a MD also tend to have massive hull armor, which makes it a lot less feasible. The bottom line is that, if you can destroy a craft in reasonable time with a MD gun, chances are you can take it down just as, if not more quickly with a conventional laser.

IF you can hit said craft often enough and IF your laser can do damage fast enough to keep their shields down. MD slugs are nigh undodgable. Hull damage is permanent.

Trying to use the mass driver like a HEPT is not what it's for. That is an inappropriate and wasteful use of the weapon. It's not a generic shoot-up-everything gun, it's a precision device for specific roles, at which it excels.

[Quinch]

I'm not so sure how much of a precision device it is; its pellet speed does pretty much make it a simple point-and-clicker, as opposed to conventional weapons which have to track in advance. Thus, the only instance I can think of where it excels is turret-mounted missile defence, but then again, the same can be done with a simple AIRE.

[Lutzie]

The MD has two massive advatages over ANY laser based weapon:

1: No "Low Energy"
2: Try killing a Khaak M5 moving at 400+ speeds with B-HEPTs. Considerably easier with an MD.

Using MDs also adds a challenge to the dogfighting. Go fight some Khaak in a Scorpion with a pair of MDs to see how long you last.

[Quinch]

The MD has two massive advatages over ANY laser based weapon:

1: No "Low Energy"

I only get *that* when I go poking capships or pirate bases. There's a time to shoot and a time to ease off the trigger.

2: Try killing a Khaak M5 moving at 400+ speeds with B-HEPTs.

One BHEPT. In a Dragon. About six times in a row, I think. Xenon sector somethingorother a ways north off Interworlds.

Using MDs also adds a challenge to the dogfighting. Go fight some Khaak in a Scorpion with a pair of MDs to see how long you last.

Heh. I've yet to find a way to deal with Khaak swarms without some heavy shielding. The numbers aren't the problem, it's the damned point-to-point rays...

[Some Strange Man]

Accuracy; nothing with the possible exception of PSG's, ID's and Kyon emitters are as accurate. - The drawbacks of psgs and ID's are friendly fire. So that has to count against them.

Mass drivers win.

For causing an exact amount of damage. (Say 13% hull damage) Nothing beats the MD's.

For being able to destroy any ship with any ship, MD's and PSG's rule. If an M5 could carry MD's, it could destroy any capship bar the Khaak capships very easily. - It would take some time and money but it can be done. For destroying M5's, MD's rule at ripping their hull to pieces and PSGs are also really effective.

HEPTs are slow, but powerful, which makes them suitable against enemies that don't constantly change direction.

MDs are fast but weaker, which makes them suitable for hitting enemies that constantly change direction.


But ALL of this is dependent upon skill, style and cost. Is buying ammo against your style? MD's not for you. Do you just want to cause havoc? Then use PSG's. Do you want to show off your abilities? Use the weakest gun that can kill the target to kill the target. Do you hate the low energy warning? Use MD's. Don't want to run out of ammo? Bring a secondary weapon or don't use MD's.

Oh and for slowdown, YES building too many factories and satellites will slow your game down, but only if you go too far.

I have 30ish facts in argon prime, and argon prime is sluggish. The rest of the universe which I have left relatively untouched hasn't slowed down.

[Tsumikae]

Here is a situation: you are at least Ace 3rd grade, and you accept an assassination mission against a Paranid, which Demeter is escorted as usual by four super Persei. You are using a Mamba, or a nova if you like. I challenge ANYONE of you HEPTs fanboys, to take the escort down in less than 5 minutes, using only you HEPTs. In fact, I would even give you 20 minutes, if you like. The whole day, let's go.

Those who never tried, don't start saying "pfff far too easy, what are you talking about". Try it. And don't forget to bring a good payload of aspirin with you

On the other hand, if your ship is equipped with MDs, it would take no more than 3-4 minutes to wipe them out.

[pjknibbs]

2: Try killing a Khaak M5 moving at 400+ speeds with B-HEPTs. Considerably easier with an MD.

I've successfully managed this using the forward BHEPT on a Pirate TS--it takes a bit of dodging, but it's not all that hard. So long as you've taken out the M3 the M5s have little or no chance of hurting you in reply.

[Martin2k4]

Wow, thank's for the answers.. i can see that the opinions are divided, so i'm just going to invest 3 millions in some mass drivers for the dragon.. Now.. i just have to get the money first..

[Tsumikae]

Since I'm helluva rich I have equipped my trusty ol' dragon with EVERY hardware it could use: 1xAPPC, 5xBHEPTs, 4xMDs.

So it fit to pretty much all situations

[Martin2k4]

Since I'm helluva rich I have equipped my trusty ol' dragon with EVERY hardware it could use: 1xAPPC, 5xBHEPTs, 4xMDs.

So it fit to pretty much all situations

What do you need the APPC for? It's useless!!

[Tsumikae]

As I said, I'm helluva rich. Don't you know that rich people are so bored that they waste money just for the pleasure of wasting it?

[Martin2k4]

As I said, I'm helluva rich. Don't you know that rich people are so bored that they waste money just for the pleasure of wasting it?

How many SPP plants you need to be helluva rich? Or are you one of those Nova enslavers??

[simonnance]

Here is a situation: you are at least Ace 3rd grade, and you accept an assassination mission against a Paranid, which Demeter is escorted as usual by four super Persei. You are using a Mamba, or a nova if you like. I challenge ANYONE of you HEPTs fanboys, to take the escort down in less than 5 minutes, using only you HEPTs. In fact, I would even give you 20 minutes, if you like. The whole day, let's go.

Those who never tried, don't start saying "pfff far too easy, what are you talking about". Try it. And don't forget to bring a good payload of aspirin with you

On the other hand, if your ship is equipped with MDs, it would take no more than 3-4 minutes to wipe them out.

pff...... 30 min easy, and that was to cap all 4 perseuses......

with BPSGs.

in a Nova

fair enough MDs would have been easier, but its not imposible without them!

Since I'm helluva rich I have equipped my trusty ol' dragon with EVERY hardware it could use: 1xAPPC, 5xBHEPTs, 4xMDs.

So it fit to pretty much all situations

Dont you mean GHEPTs, the dragon can take them you know

[Tsumikae]

Yes, GHEPTs, thanks for the correction. And I'll care to return the favor: how do you install BPSGs on a Nova? Wasn't it BHEPTs?

Martin, I do own 70 plants. Not really much, but they are well-placed, and concurrence has taken, huh, retirement

And I'm not an enslaver! What kind of monster do you think I am??? Well, not that one anyway I like space fly hunting better, it makes the local greenpeace mobs so upset.

[Martin2k4]

Yes, GHEPTs, thanks for the correction. And I'll care to return the favor: how do you install BPSGs on a Nova? Wasn't it BHEPTs?

Martin, I do own 70 plants. Not really much, but they are well-placed, and concurrence has taken, huh, retirement

And I'm not an enslaver! What kind of monster do you think I am??? Well, not that one anyway I like space fly hunting better, it makes the local greenpeace mobs so upset.

WOOOW.. 70.. i still have 64 to go !! Damn !! Long game