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Morkonan





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PostPosted: Tue, 12. Dec 17, 22:00    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

"Clinics" are becoming more common the US, these days. Though, due to vast differences in population concentration, some areas have few to none. Clinics are there to provide non-emergency "emergency" services... So, for instance, let's say you have a really bad flu. You could try to get an appointment with your normal physician, but that could take several days. If that wasn't suitable, you could also go to a hospital "Emergency Room." But, of course, you're probably not in a life-or-death situation and going to such a place only serves to put unnecessary strain on a system that's not really for that sort of thing.

So... Clinics. You can walk in and get seen by someone, at least, within a fairly short period of time. And, if it's serious enough, they will get you transported to an Emergency Room/Hospital in short order.

So, in the US, that's a pretty good thing. It takes the strain off of facilities designed for critical care. But, still, it doesn't solve all the problems. Clinics are not designed to monitor patient care, aren't part of anyone's "primary care" sort of arrangements (ie: Family doctor) and don't always have the diagnostic tools they may need. (Though, that is changing. I almost went to clinic instead of an Emergency Room, but the clinic told me going to the hospital would probably be the better decision, even though that particular clinic did have some advanced diagnostic tools. (CT Scan and the like, which was surprising.)

Question: Does a UK "analogue" of a US "Clinic", a place that's not quite what we'd call an "Emergency Room" at a hospital where one can go for quick care for acute illness, normally have advanced diagnostic tools like a CT Scanner?

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Chips





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PostPosted: Tue, 12. Dec 17, 22:02    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

mrbadger wrote:

I absolutely love that, and even though they are back to full staff I still use it as my primary consult method for matters involving my pre-existing conditions.


Ours, if you ask for an appointment, you will get a phone consult first (unless it's bloody obvious you need an appointment - i.e. blood test, finger in the butt, knacker caressing, or other such necessary face to face things) - usually within 20 minutes. They're really good Very Happy


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mrbadger





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PostPosted: Wed, 13. Dec 17, 10:12    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Morkonan wrote:

Question: Does a UK "analogue" of a US "Clinic", a place that's not quite what we'd call an "Emergency Room" at a hospital where one can go for quick care for acute illness, normally have advanced diagnostic tools like a CT Scanner?


We do have them, but unfortunately too many people view them as a sign of the dismantling of the NHS, so fight the replacement of outdated inappropriate services with more efficient clinics.

I used to be a nurse, I understand perfectly how much better a local clinic system would be, but the uninformed seem to want a fully equipped hospital in every town.

That just can't happen. Especially since for most of them the primary justification is that they have to travel a long way to visit someone being treated as an inpatient.

You can get NHS transportation for appointments if you're unable to travel, or you just get on a train.

I have to go to my nearest city for MRI scans. Well fine, I'll do that, because that's where the scanners are. I don't want them in my town as well, because that would cost too much.

We could have had clinics in my town a decade ago, but this goddam 'action group' keeps fighting them, so we're still stuck with increasingly outdated services that just get worse over time.

Then they complain about the fact that the old services they 'saved' aren't good enough.

Well duh... Of course they're not, that would be why they've been trying to replace them for the last decade you morons Evil or Very Mad


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Morkonan





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PostPosted: Wed, 13. Dec 17, 16:33    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

mrbadger wrote:
...We could have had clinics in my town a decade ago, but this goddam 'action group' keeps fighting them, so we're still stuck with increasingly outdated services that just get worse over time...


They fight against them? Against clinics? As if the presence of clinic is somehow detrimental to... healthcare?

Are these people right in the head? Playing with full decks? Both oars in the water?

Quote:
Then they complain about the fact that the old services they 'saved' aren't good enough.


So, they're "saving" facilities with operating theaters, critical care units, neonatal services, emergency facilities that keep people from dying when their legs get cut off by fighting against clinics that serve people with colds, muscle strains and minor infections?

I love democracy and equal rights for all as well as equal representation, but some people just... shouldn't be participating. Smile

Quote:
Well duh... Of course they're not, that would be why they've been trying to replace them for the last decade you morons Evil or Very Mad


"Modern medicine is bureaucratic and evil! We want more doctors that make house-calls! Housecalls, with MRI machines! DELIBBER MA BABIES AT HOME WHILE I"M INNA TUB! But, make sure they're healthy and I don't die..."

Sometimes, it's tempting to give people what they ask for, just so they'll truly realize why they should stop asking for it.

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Skism





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PostPosted: Wed, 13. Dec 17, 16:47    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

mrbadger wrote:
Morkonan wrote:

Question: Does a UK "analogue" of a US "Clinic", a place that's not quite what we'd call an "Emergency Room" at a hospital where one can go for quick care for acute illness, normally have advanced diagnostic tools like a CT Scanner?


We do have them, but unfortunately too many people view them as a sign of the dismantling of the NHS, so fight the replacement of outdated inappropriate services with more efficient clinics.

I used to be a nurse, I understand perfectly how much better a local clinic system would be, but the uninformed seem to want a fully equipped hospital in every town.

That just can't happen. Especially since for most of them the primary justification is that they have to travel a long way to visit someone being treated as an inpatient.

You can get NHS transportation for appointments if you're unable to travel, or you just get on a train.

I have to go to my nearest city for MRI scans. Well fine, I'll do that, because that's where the scanners are. I don't want them in my town as well, because that would cost too much.

We could have had clinics in my town a decade ago, but this goddam 'action group' keeps fighting them, so we're still stuck with increasingly outdated services that just get worse over time.

Then they complain about the fact that the old services they 'saved' aren't good enough.

Well duh... Of course they're not, that would be why they've been trying to replace them for the last decade you morons Evil or Very Mad



Whilst the destruction of the NHS is a serious issue that is quite something Mr B. Laughing


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mrbadger





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PostPosted: Wed, 13. Dec 17, 20:55    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Morkonan wrote:


So, they're "saving" facilities with operating theaters, critical care units, neonatal services, emergency facilities that keep people from dying when their legs get cut off by fighting against clinics that serve people with colds, muscle strains and minor infections?

I love democracy and equal rights for all as well as equal representation, but some people just... shouldn't be participating. Smile


There is a very old hospital in my town. I used to work there. Old, poorly equipped, and it's buildings are falling apart.

But in the city only 25 miles away we have a huge modern hospital with more facilities. So many in fact that all we need is reasonable size clinic with a CT scanner and a decent first response team.

Which is all they've been trying to build.


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Morkonan





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PostPosted: Wed, 13. Dec 17, 22:30    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

mrbadger wrote:
Morkonan wrote:


So, they're "saving" facilities with operating theaters, critical care units, neonatal services, emergency facilities that keep people from dying when their legs get cut off by fighting against clinics that serve people with colds, muscle strains and minor infections?

I love democracy and equal rights for all as well as equal representation, but some people just... shouldn't be participating. Smile


There is a very old hospital in my town. I used to work there. Old, poorly equipped, and it's buildings are falling apart.

But in the city only 25 miles away we have a huge modern hospital with more facilities. So many in fact that all we need is reasonable size clinic with a CT scanner and a decent first response team.

Which is all they've been trying to build.


"A decent first-response team... ?"

You don't have one of those already? I admit, I'm ignorant in all the "Ways of UK" stuff, for the most part, but what happens if someone gets in a car accident or has a heart-attack? They have to go 25 miles to a hospital? That's like... almost all the way across the whole island, right? Smile

Where I used to live, we had 12 hospitals... Twelve. Admittedly, it had a decent military presence with VA hospitals and such and it did have a decent catchment area, but even other regions it drew from had their own smaller hospitals. The medical community was larger than most, as well. But... we had twelve.

Where I am now, we have two within a few miles of each other and this isn't exactly a large town. That doesn't count the other hospitals nearby as well as those attached to universities.

The US is pretty big and there are surely many regions where there aren't hospitals close by. But, that's 'cause there ain't crap else "close by" either. Smile In the UK... Well, it'd be nothing to just drive across the whole country in a couple of hours or so.

Even so, there should at least be a clinic or competent ER facility within a few minutes of just about anywhere.

There's a new "Emergency Room" stand-alone facility opening up down the street from me. It can handle any emergency situation up to and including emergency surgery. That is all it does, though. It can stabilize patient for transport, elsewhere, of course.

Why?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

They're opening it up so they can get more business for patients that require "immediate transport" to the nearest emergency facility. They're doing it to undercut the competition by having an Emergency Room closer to where the accidents occur than the competition... It's all about money.

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mrbadger





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PostPosted: Wed, 13. Dec 17, 23:13    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Morkonan wrote:


"A decent first-response team... ?"

You don't have one of those already? I admit, I'm ignorant in all the "Ways of UK" stuff, for the most part, but what happens if someone gets in a car accident or has a heart-attack? They have to go 25 miles to a hospital? That's like... almost all the way across the whole island, right? Smile


Not in all areas of specialty, but the idea is supposed to be that the central hospital rotates teams around the county, so we would have decent teams. As it is though we have people who've been doing the same job for 20-30 years, and weren't very good to start with.

I know, some of them used to work for me. It was a real shock for me when I started working there, I had no idea that nurses could be so bad at their jobs and still be on a trauma ward. I didn't stay long.

They already rotate certain teams, but not the ones that would operate the walk in clinics that would act as triage centres.

And when people have heart attacks they do take them straight to the main city hospital, because frankly they have a better chance of survival if they stay in the ambulance then get treated by decent medical teams.

That's what they did to me when I had my brain injury.

The worst period of care I got was when I was transferred back to the hospital in my home town for a few weeks before I went back to the city hospital and it's excellent rehab centre.


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pjknibbs



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PostPosted: Thu, 14. Dec 17, 10:41    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

mrbadger wrote:

And when people have heart attacks they do take them straight to the main city hospital, because frankly they have a better chance of survival if they stay in the ambulance then get treated by decent medical teams.


Case in point: my mother had a mild heart attack this year. She lives in a small village miles from the nearest hospital, so the ambulance guys had her flown via air ambulance 40-odd miles to St. James' hospital in Sunderland. Darlington would have been closer, but they couldn't offer the same range of services, so they decided that the extra few minutes was the better option.

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Morkonan





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PostPosted: Thu, 14. Dec 17, 17:33    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

mrbadger wrote:
...They already rotate certain teams, but not the ones that would operate the walk in clinics that would act as triage centres.

And when people have heart attacks they do take them straight to the main city hospital, because frankly they have a better chance of survival if they stay in the ambulance then get treated by decent medical teams.

That's what they did to me when I had my brain injury.

The worst period of care I got was when I was transferred back to the hospital in my home town for a few weeks before I went back to the city hospital and it's excellent rehab centre.


Ya know...

Maybe the NHS should hire a group of rabid X3 players to help them work out their logistical problems with services and quality issues? Smile

XPLayer1: "OK, I think we set up a central station hospital complex, here, and cover several regions fairly adequately."

XPlayer2: "That's a good idea. We're also going to have to set up a CLS training flight, though, to increase our local presence across all these towns and, perhaps, promote some T3s to UT to run mobile services to handle region further than three zones. That'd be pretty efficient and we could expect fairly rapid response."

XPlayer3: "We could also use the trade-station dockspace plan to set up depots for emergency services and to reduce response time in remote areas by having supplies and equipment readily available with minimum overhead."

NHS: "Wat?"

It's not unusual for patients to get transported to "better facilities", or at least specialized ones, after they've been stabilized. But, to get transported twice, back and forth, is... kinda inefficient and, IMO, not good for the patient. I can understand, however, that unique cases certainly exist and no diagnosis or treatment is ever perfect.

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