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What ship do you recommend for starting the AP plot?
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JohnnyR





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 16:19    Post subject: What ship do you recommend for starting the AP plot? Reply with quote Print

I'm still starting out, and only have ~5 Million in the bank - is it too early to start the plot? I have an M5, so I'm not sure which ship I should grab that will work.

I'm not looking for the best M3 ever, just something that I can use to get started with the plot, and progress from there.

Thanks!

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Timsup2nothin





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 16:45    Post subject: Re: What ship do you recommend for starting the AP plot? Reply with quote Print

JohnnyR wrote:
I'm still starting out, and only have ~5 Million in the bank - is it too early to start the plot? I have an M5, so I'm not sure which ship I should grab that will work.

I'm not looking for the best M3 ever, just something that I can use to get started with the plot, and progress from there.

Thanks!


Spoiler
Fairly early on the Argon military will provide you with ships that are pretty much ideal for the situations they send you into. Prior to that all you need is something you can use to take out a handful of Terran ships in the war zones, and there's no specifics about what kind of ships. I take a Disco and snuff a few Rapiers myself, but whatever you are comfortable with will work.

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Bill Huntington



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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 16:59    Post subject: reply Reply with quote Print

You're in a good place, JohnnyR.

My choice for a basic M3 is a Mamba or variant. There's reasons to choose almost every one. Some of it's your own style. Some of it's the opportunity in front of you. Most M3+ are even better but I stay away from the slow ones like Kea. Chimera has speed and is my top choice.

I put my early team in a Boa as soon as I can. Some cargo space for picking up loot and slots to carry small ships with extra JDs.

A Kestral is part of the team when I can get one. You can progress through the AP plot quickly with this one. When I've got $20 Mil, I buy a Elephant. Another milestone, followed by top rank for every race.

I love to travel in a Hype when I can board one. The Springblossom is a good choice when you get Terran rank. Again, most M6 ships have their advantages.

Good hunting!


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Alan Phipps
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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 17:16    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

As some have intimated here, just get on with enjoying the plot and the necessary capabilities will usually come to you in good time.

Yes there are perhaps a few ship types that stand out above others and so tend to become player favourites, but almost any ship of the appropriate class for the task has the capabilities to see you through the plot requirements. Some real fun is in trying out the different ship types and variants and seeing what characteristics of theirs best suit your playstyle and your internal story-telling or role-play.

Enjoy the game and don't worry too much about the usual must-haves. Smile


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Last edited by Alan Phipps on Tue, 31. Oct 17, 17:19; edited 1 time in total
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JohnnyR





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 17:17    Post subject: Re: reply Reply with quote Print

Bill Huntington wrote:
You're in a good place, JohnnyR.

My choice for a basic M3 is a Mamba or variant. There's reasons to choose almost every one. Some of it's your own style. Some of it's the opportunity in front of you. Most M3+ are even better but I stay away from the slow ones like Kea. Chimera has speed and is my top choice.

I put my early team in a Boa as soon as I can. Some cargo space for picking up loot and slots to carry small ships with extra JDs.

A Kestral is part of the team when I can get one. You can progress through the AP plot quickly with this one. When I've got $20 Mil, I buy a Elephant. Another milestone, followed by top rank for every race.

I love to travel in a Hype when I can board one. The Springblossom is a good choice when you get Terran rank. Again, most M6 ships have their advantages.

Good hunting!


Thank you! I was looking at the Nova Raider, because of it's increased shielding and Hull - but I'm not familiar enough with the different styles to really know what I'm looking for. The Mamba looks fast, but also a little less resilient.

In the past, (years ago when I played TC) I just used the computer to autoattack, but I'm guessing this is the worst way to attack anything that's close or above my level?

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RAVEN.myst





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 17:27    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Greetings!

I'm guessing this is your first play-through, so you'll likely be wanting to try a bit of everything - I'm not going to make any specific recommendations in this regard (except to *highly* recommend to put yourself in a TM as a mobile base of operation, which will allow you to carry whatever fighter/s you feel like, giving you options literally on-the-fly), but instead I'll plant a small seed-thought that may (or may not) be relevant at some later point:

What I normally do, is I pick one race, and I stick with that race's ships and stations, enjoying their strengths and working around their weaknesses. (Note: this might be considered by some as a more "advanced" mode/approach, so like I said, it's likely not applicable at this point while you're getting your feet wet and getting a feel for the various races' pros and cons.)

Happy hunting! Smile


PS: The Nova Raider is certainly a very decent option, with good balance between speed, power, and toughness. In fact, in my current game I wore one of those for a little while, operating from my Magnetar and/or Zephyrus TM. An advantage of the Novas (and quite a few other M3s, but not the Mambas, if I recall correctly) is the rear turret, which is particularly useful when set to "Missile defense" (which will also shoot at aggressors in addition to shooting down missiles chasing you.) As for your last question: unless you're a particularly poor pilot, yes the autopilot will always do a worse job than you can (I've recently switched to "spectator mode" - letting my autopilot fight some/most of my fights, while I sit back and watch, but that's just me being lazy Very Happy I mean "chilled out", that is...)


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JohnnyR





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 18:31    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Thank you for the insight!

One unrelated question in regards to capturing ships - Is there anywhere this can be done without taking a rep loss? War sectors? (Which I don't think I understand how those work either)

Thank you!

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Timsup2nothin





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 19:24    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

JohnnyR wrote:
Thank you for the insight!

One unrelated question in regards to capturing ships - Is there anywhere this can be done without taking a rep loss? War sectors? (Which I don't think I understand how those work either)

Thank you!


You will always suffer a rep loss with the race you attack. If you attack them in their own space it is a bigger loss, and in their core sectors it is even bigger. If you attack them in "friendly" space you will get a rep loss with whoever you are attacking and also some rep loss with the race that "owns" the space. If you attack in "enemy"* space you will get the loss for attacking them, but a slight boost with the owner of the space.

In Pirate space, or "unknown" sectors you can attack anyone you want (except maybe pirates) and all you take is the minimum penalty with whoever you attack. So I tend to use those when I'm "shopping." Pirat

*enemies are Boron-Split, Argon-Paranid, and Terran-...mmm, everyone?...so, for example if you attack an Argon ship in Paranid space you get a loss with the Argons, but a boost with the Paranid.


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jlehtone



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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 19:25    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Xenon. We cannot lose reputation among the Xenon, for they hate us enough already. However, capturing Xenon is, if possible, more challenging than of the others.


There are two parts for the reputation, just like int X3TC.
* Owner race of the ship that you shoot/board/kill simply does not like it.
* Owner race of the sector, where you do killing can love, hate, or be neutral.

If you kill an enemy of the sector, the natives love you more.
If you kill a friend of the sector, you will lose reputation.
The neutrals simply ignore your actions.

For example, you attack Boron freighter in Split sector. Borons and Split are enemies. The Boron will dislike you. If you kill rather than capture, the Split will like you.

Same Boron in Argon sector. These two are allies. Argons dislike death of allies.


Thinking Plot? Sorry, started X3AP game a while back, did most of the plot without thinking and then had a longer break. Cannot remember a thing. Embarassed I have only some "armistice" on the ToDo list. Sounds peaceful.

"Plots" are not important in the X-Universe, IMHO.


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RAVEN.myst





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 19:27    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

JohnnyR wrote:
One unrelated question in regards to capturing ships - Is there anywhere this can be done without taking a rep loss?

Not really. It's not so much a question of where you do the capturing (though this CAN be a secondary factor - see [*] footnote), but more a question of whose rides you're taking. You will "annoy" whichever faction's ships you go after (of course, Xenon already hate to the max, so nothing changes if you go after their ships.) Some players like to keep one or two factions as enemies, in part to make the game more interesting/challenging, but also sometimes in part as a "resource", for "affirmative shopping".

JohnnyR wrote:
War sectors? (Which I don't think I understand how those work either)

The war sectors are an odd place. For the most part, they are no different from other sectors, with one small difference that makes ALL the difference: you want to, for the most part, avoid sending or leaving stuff there unless you are in the same sector, otherwise, whichever out of Argon and Terran you have the lower reputation with, that faction WILL actively go after those assets of yours. This happens regardless of how friendly you are with both factions, even if you are at the top reputation rank with both, whichever is lower, even by a single percentile, will attack your unattended ships, satellites, and stations. I think this is meant to simulate the fact that this is a warzone, and there will be collateral civilian casualties in there regardless. (Note: as mentioned above, this ONLY happens to your "out of sector" assets ie. any assets you have in one of those sectors while you are not personally present.)


[*] Footnote: There is a set of interspecies relationships that you may be aware of, having played X3TC before. Paranid and Split are loosely allied, and the same is true of Argon and Boron. By contrast, Argon and Paranid are in a state of limited war, and the same is true for Boron vs Split. Teladi are Swiss. (Of course, there's also the whole Argon vs Terran thing, now...)
- Now, if you attack a race's ships in its own territory, you lose lots of reputation, and you lose that race's police license if you are holding one at the time. That race's police/military will respond and come after you.
- If you attack a race's enemy's ships in its territory (for example, if you attack Paranid ships in Argon space), you lose reputation with the race you are attacking but gain some with the race whose jurisdiction you're in (in the above example, Argon would like you a little more, while Paranid would like you somewhat less.) There will be no police/military reprisal.
- If in a race's space you attack a ship of another race that the first one is neutral with (eg. you attack a Split ship in Argon territory), the victim's race (Split, in this example) will like you less, the locals (Argon, in this example) will not like you any more or less, but their police/military may come after you (and if you fight them, you then WILL, of course, lose reputation and police license.)
- If you attack a race's ally's ships in its space (eg. you attack Boron in Argon space), you will lose reputation with both (less with the locals, I think), and the local enforcement will target you.

There's an opportunity in the above: if you go after a race's ships (say, in order to capture them), it's advantageous to do so in that race's enemy's territory - so, for example, if wanting to capture Argon ships, you would want to do so in Paranid space, as that would gain you Paranid relations and you would not lose any police licenses (if applicable), and there would be no authorities responding (you would, of course, still be losing considerable Argon rep.)

Pirates are "fair game" in all territories - you will gain reputation and be paid bounties (if you have a local police license) for killing these in any race's space (even the Teladi, who in the lore have considerable dealings with pirates.) Of course, pirates will hate you more - this isn't shown on your character sheet, but it IS a factor, and one that can be improved such as to become friendly with pirates. Yaki are essentially a separate pirate faction, and killing them will also earn you brownie points in any sovereign space. (Yaki and pirates are notionally rivals, but I'm not sure to what extent reputation mechanics apply.)


Bah! So the "footnote" is longer than the main post... Oops


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RAVEN.myst





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 19:30    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

jlehtone wrote:
I have only some "armistice" on the ToDo list. Sounds peaceful.

Yes, VERY "peaceful" - it involves the single biggest military objective in the whole game Very Happy

(And plots are the main reason I play the X games - once I finish the plots, I tend to start a new game Wink )


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Timsup2nothin





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 19:31    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

jlehtone wrote:

If you kill an enemy of the sector, the natives love you more.
If you kill a friend of the sector, you will lose reputation.
The neutrals simply ignore your actions.


I need to investigate this, but...

I'm pretty sure that 'neutrals,' like say Teladi if you attack an Argon in their space, will still get mad about it. The local border patrol, cops, etc, are going to respond, and your rep with them will take a small hit.

I'll verify this and update, but I'm almost sure this is true.


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Not a DiD, so I guess it's a DiDn't, the story of my first try at AP
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HEY! AP!! That's new!!!
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RAVEN.myst





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 19:34    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Timsup2nothin wrote:
jlehtone wrote:

If you kill an enemy of the sector, the natives love you more.
If you kill a friend of the sector, you will lose reputation.
The neutrals simply ignore your actions.


I need to investigate this, but...

I'm pretty sure that 'neutrals,' like say Teladi if you attack an Argon in their space, will still get mad about it. The local border patrol, cops, etc, are going to respond, and your rep with them will take a small hit.

This is correct - while they are "neutral", they will still punish "antisocial" behaviour - I guess it's a matter of treaties. It's only attacks against the racial enemy that are ignored by the local authorities. There is no local reputation loss, however (that I've ever seen, at least) - unless the player engages those local cops, of course.


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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 19:36    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

So different races have different ships, and different specialties.

Argon ships are very balanced between speed, shields and weapons. They're good all around, but don't stand out in anything.

Split ships prioritize speed and hitting power over shielding. You'll be less well protected by your defenses, but you can usually hit well above what other races can. IE the Split M4 Scorpion can mount High Energy Plasma Throwers (HEPT), which are normally found on M3's. Where the Nova carries 3x25Mj shields, the Split Mamba only has 2.

Teladi focus on shielding and cargo capacity. They have poor weapon generation, though excellent selection. The Teladi Harrier is an M5 capable of mounting Mass Drivers, usually reserved for heavier Argon fighters. The Teladi Falcon has 4x25Mj shields compared to the Nova's 3. They also have the Energy Bolt Chaingun, which hits as hard as the HEPT, but uses ammo and thus removes the limitation of their weapon energy problems.

Paranid ships are fast and well shielded, but sacrifice weapon selection for more power. The Perseus has the same shielding as the Nova, but is much faster and has far more weapon power. The standard Perseus is actually faster than the Nova Raider.

Boron ships are very defensively minded, being quick and with rapidly recharging shields. They don't have Teladi sized cargo bays, but they have enough space to carry missiles which you'll want to supplement their moderately awful weapon selection.

Terrans have entirely too much shielding and fire power for their own good, but fortunately their weapons fire slowly, hit hard, but the projectiles travel slowly enough they're reasonably easy to dodge.

For a ship, having never done the AP plot, I'd recommend a Boron Pike. It's an M4+ which means it's slightly tougher and stronger than the normal Boron M4, but not as expensive as their M3. It's also very short front to back and so a lot of shots will miss you as you dogfight.


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Timsup2nothin





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PostPosted: Tue, 31. Oct 17, 19:46    Post subject: Reply with quote Print

Triaxx2 wrote:
So different races have different ships, and different specialties.

Argon ships are very balanced between speed, shields and weapons. They're good all around, but don't stand out in anything.


I agree generally with everything Triaxx2 said, but would add that Argon ships are also very maneuverable, which happens to fit my style of fighting really well.


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HEY! AP!! That's new!!!
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