London incidents with fatalities (being treated as potential terrorist attack)

[Rive]

Fund and support those services as best we can to continue their work.

What do people expect them to do? Allegedly they're listening and reading absolutely everything.

AFAIK almost all cases the terrorist(s) were on the map already when he(they) finally gone nuts.

It is just that the actual legal system is made according to the terms and practices of the 'western' society and cannot handle that part of the islam which mixing politics, religion and violence.

Without applicable legal background no services can act.

[muppetts]

According to the BBC news this morning, 6 bystanders confirmed dead, the 3 attackers all shot dead by armed police, and 48 injured. There are no words to descrobe my thoughts right now.

Macron told the French that they have to accept this as part of their daily life. I'm curious, is anyone telling that to the British?

We've been there and done that with the IRA, long time ago..

[muppetts]

According to the BBC news this morning, 6 bystanders confirmed dead, the 3 attackers all shot dead by armed police, and 48 injured. There are no words to descrobe my thoughts right now.

Macron told the French that they have to accept this as part of their daily life. I'm curious, is anyone telling that to the British?

We shouldn't have to. I find it very difficult to believe that the people in their respective communities don't know that some of their number have been radicalised. They need to do more to root out these lunatics.

I reasonably expect, when the reports start to come through, that the three killed will be known to the authorities. Given that they had fake bomb vests on, I wonder if this particular "cell" did not have access to the same support network that the guy in Manchester had.

What communities, what is this magic 'community' all these people have membership too whenever these things happen. These people are mostly drug addicts, long time criminals etc. They are not part of any community!

[Usenko]

What communities, what is this magic 'community' all these people have membership too whenever these things happen. These people are mostly drug addicts, long time criminals etc. They are not part of any community!

Some are, but even then, you're hardly likely to advertise to people who don't already agree with you that you're going to do something illegal. The cops might stop you . . .

[eladan]

Fund and support those services as best we can to continue their work.

What do people expect them to do? Allegedly they're listening and reading absolutely everything.

AFAIK almost all cases the terrorist(s) were on the map already when he(they) finally gone nuts.

It is just that the actual legal system is made according to the terms and practices of the 'western' society and cannot handle that part of the islam which mixing politics, religion and violence.

Without applicable legal background no services can act.

Unless we want to start prosecuting thought crimes, which would, as Bishop rightly said, put us well on the road to becoming a totalitarian nightmare, there's not a great deal that can be done. Whether they are 'on the radar' or not.

[Rive]

Unless we want to start prosecuting thought crimes, which would, as Bishop rightly said, put us well on the road to becoming a totalitarian nightmare, there's not a great deal that can be done. Whether they are 'on the radar' or not.

To instigate crime is already a crime itself, so that 'rightly' is actually dead wrong.

The blind spot is, when this meets with religious or 'free speech' rights.

[Memnoch]

We shouldn't have to. I find it very difficult to believe that the people in their respective communities don't know that some of their number have been radicalised. They need to do more to root out these lunatics.

I reasonably expect, when the reports start to come through, that the three killed will be known to the authorities. Given that they had fake bomb vests on, I wonder if this particular "cell" did not have access to the same support network that the guy in Manchester had.

What communities, what is this magic 'community' all these people have membership too whenever these things happen. These people are mostly drug addicts, long time criminals etc. They are not part of any community!

Friends and family
The mosque they attend

It would be a tough decision to make for a family but I don't believe for a second that anyone with a close bond to these people wouldn't realise they had changed in some way.

But perhaps you are right and they belong to no community at all and they all act alone and in isolation...

After watching that statement by the PM I realise we have no hope of beating this. Her idea is to crack down on "The Internet". Basically use this as another chance to try and implement even more aggressive snooping laws. While I have no problem with that in principle, the only way it would work is if you monitor everything and everyone, and we are back to that totalitarian state again.

How do you beat someone who no longer cares for their own life? What does that person really care about in the end?

https://www.thebureauinvestigates.com/s ... eval-exile

It might be unpalatable but is it any more so than blowing people into tiny pieces?

[Tracker001]

Condolences ! ... Again .

[clakclak]

Lets praise the heroes in this.A London police officer stood against the three attackers with his baton, to save lives.

[eladan]

Unless we want to start prosecuting thought crimes, which would, as Bishop rightly said, put us well on the road to becoming a totalitarian nightmare, there's not a great deal that can be done. Whether they are 'on the radar' or not.

To instigate crime is already a crime itself, so that 'rightly' is actually dead wrong.

The blind spot is, when this meets with religious or 'free speech' rights.

By all means, prosecute those who instigated this. You might find they're not in England though. But that's not what I was talking about anyway - instigation is an action, not a thought.

[RegisterMe]

Two things to say.... First the Manchester concert has been brilliant .

Second, and this is pretty much all I agree with Trump on, the perpetrators are losers. Nothing more, nothing less. Don't "dignify" them with grandiose terms like evil, they're not. Mao? Evil. Stalin? Evil. Hitler? Evil. These guys? Sad losers.

Perhaps there in lies the clue. If we can find a way for "them" to be engaged enough in life that they couldn't contemplate such actions by definition they couldn't be such losers.

Always prevent, deter, dissuade, punish and >>hard stop<< the nihilistic misanthropic idiots that carry out such attacks if necessary (I'm no Jeremy Corbyn).

In the words of the concert tonight, "one love", to everybody else.

[Memnoch]

I don't think they need a hug.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/625137 ... tte-Leslie

I don't think they want to engage. They don't want to integrate. Instead of worrying about them, who at the point of committing a terrorist act are too far gone to be reasoned with, we need to catch and stop the ones who made them like this.

Should we be concerned with catching the bombs or going after the plane that's dropping them?

[CBJ]

Did you actually read the article you linked? I suggest you do so, and maybe focus on the pertinent facts about the perpetrator instead of the outrage and headline-grabbing hyperbole. If the article is accurate then it's describing a disturbed individual with a troubled background and a history of mental health issues. How you've managed to extrapolate that into some mysterious group of "they" who don't want this and that, I'm really not sure. In fact the article says a lot more about the state of our mental health provision than it does about our anti-terrorism policy.

[Memnoch]

Once the police have conducted their investigation into the various properties they visited within hours of the attack, hopefully who "they" might be will become more clear.

As far as mental health is concerned, anyone who acts like this is clearly not well. Was this done to them as part of their indoctrination? We'll see how the Police investigation goes.

As a Taxi driver pointed out to me this morning, isn't it odd that they seem to know exactly where to go straight after one of these incidents and again, they were known to the authorities but not considered an imminent threat.

[CBJ]

Except that now "they" refers to the people involved in this most recent incident, who are clearly not the same "they" (or more accurately "he") as the person in the article you linked above, which incidentally was 18 months ago and involved internet trolling rather than killing people. It's important to be able to spot differences like these, as well as the ones I mentioned previously, otherwise you get a badly distorted picture of what the problems really are.

As for your taxi driver, does he really think it's odd that the police are able to identify who someone is and find out where they live within a few hours? Sounds like a pretty routine part of their job to me.

[Memnoch]

Multiple properties were visited, so not just the place where they lived. They may have included relatives as well, or any other people that were on the periphery and perhaps already being monitored. Again, lets see what the police dig up but it should be interesting and probably a painful experience for the security services and the PM.

[Bishop149]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06 ... um=twitter

Bloody immigrants, coming over here, working long hours, paying taxes, attacking terrorists with crates and keeping people safe.

Vote UKIP!

[philip_hughes]

Lets praise the heroes in this.A London police officer stood against the three attackers with his baton, to save lives.

This.

[Memnoch]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06 ... um=twitter

Bloody immigrants, coming over here, working long hours, paying taxes, attacking terrorists with crates and keeping people safe.

Vote UKIP!

That was great. I was watching an interview with him on TV last night.

It certainly is heart warming when you see someone stand up in the face of extremism and go toe to toe with these cowards.

It makes me wonder whether I would be brave enough to do the same thing. It might depend on the circumstance. If I was in the street and unarmed I would almost certainly run. But if they burst into a bar and there were glasses and bottles to hand I think I would be braver.

[korio]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06 ... um=twitter

Bloody immigrants, coming over here, working long hours, paying taxes, attacking terrorists with crates and keeping people safe.

Vote UKIP!

It makes me wonder whether I would be brave enough to do the same thing. It might depend on the circumstance. If I was in the street and unarmed I would almost certainly run. But if they burst into a bar and there were glasses and bottles to hand I think I would be braver.

You will never know what would you do till it happens, and that's because of adrenalin, once you have adrenalin in your blood you don't think the same way and you can do things you never expect yourself to be able to do.


Some years ago one spanish terrorist blew herself with the bomb she was making on a chalet near where i was having my vacations, and by near i mean like 50m away from my apartment and when you heard the bomb at first you feel confused, then you realize its a bomb and probably there are some terrorist around and your body goes full of adrenalin, believe me, you don't think the way you did before.


And that's probably what "forced" that guy to go outside and hit them with the first thing he could find, some people drown themselves with the panic and terror and get petrified, other just do something without thinking in their own health or what could happen to them.